Dynamo Kiev v Everton. 19th March at 18.00.

[royalblue66]

How?

?

 

[Jeff Jones]

Jagielka talking sh*** now

Pain Will Fuel Us
We have had a long journey home from the Ukraine
It doesn’t look like we will be in Europe next season, so we need to use it as motivation to finish the season strong

What would you have liked him to say?

 

[Jeff Jones]

?

How? Well, what would Peter Reid have done tactically to get a 0-0?

 

[blue4eva77]

You know you've played a load of old bollox when the latest match thread reaches nearly 3000 replies

 

[dave abrahams]

Agree with the almost total feeling of rage and disappointment after Thursdays game, what matters now, for the whole
future of the club, is how the team reacts for the rest of the season, we are in deep, deep trouble if we go down, that
can't be repeated often enough.

 

[royalblue66]

How? Well, what would Peter Reid have done tactically to get a 0-0?

He didn't say,something about we were going there in a winning position ,and he would have kept it tight,he was livid about the performance.

 

[Pabbers]

Im back and still cant eat a think....hang-over from hell

 

[Stanley Parker]

I have to ask what is Barry's role? He isn't very good defensively and his passing isn't good. What exactly is he meant to be doing.

Last season our tactics were very clear. When Baines or Coleman went forward, Barry - or sometimes McCarthy - would drop back to provide cover. When both fullbacks went up, Barry effectively formed a back three with Distin and Jagielka. This worked very well, with Baines and Coleman both making chances and scoring goals.

But this season has been rather different. Some teams have been pressing our defenders, making it harder for them to initiate attacks. And the early part of the season was characterised by the individual mistakes of defenders. These undermined the team's confidence and the team has never really recovered.

Last season, our success was largely due to the partnership of Barry and McCarthy. McCarthy was injured for much of the early season, and they were unable to continue their partnership. Barry has been a powerful presence on the left. He can tackle, make telling passes and, from time to time, shoot. But he is a year older now, and has found this season much more difficult. Whether he will be able to continue his role next season, I have my doubts. Roberto may decide that some younger blood is necessary.

 

[SH1958]

What would you have liked him to say?

Pain Will Fuel Us
Should have been in pain all season but hasn't done them any good

We have had a long journey home from the Ukraine
What 3 hour flight, the fans who had there flights cancelled will have a long journey home

It doesn’t look like we will be in Europe next season, so we need to use it as motivation to finish the season strong.
Why say this when you know your not in europe & we need to get hammered to get motivation to finish strong

Just don't talk a load of crap

 

[froggyted]

If tim howard or gareth barry had been in the same situation fitness wise as stones he would have shunted them straight in, basically our manager is a bizarre weirdo who randomly develops a fetish for certain players with none of this based on ability

An amusing piece of psychoanalysis. I'm not sure there's any truth in it, but if any of the squad are reading this it might get them a bit worried in the shower!

 

[froggyted]

I blame myself. I meant to come on and wish you luck as I have before the other Europa games. But I forgot. I jinxed it. Sorry.

Thanks for sharing some of the blame, because it's taken a lot of weight off me. I usually bring a bottle of Adnams Broadside on when i'm watching and it's usually very effective as the twelfth man, but i never had time to buy any. Perhaps if i'd been prepared to miss twenty minutes of the match to make a detour to the supermarket.....

 

[The Equaliser]

What he could've done is have his HT team talk out on the pitch in front of the fans, and given them a good bollocking for everyone to see.

Nah, he wouldn't say boo to a goose.

 

[froggyted]

...to be fair, quite a few on here suggested he should start. Personally, I wasn't overly concerned when I saw him on the team sheet but he did have a shocker. I really have a concern, though, that the back four are not coached to ensure they are a cohesive defensive unit. We appear to have 4 individuals sent out there to defend. It can't be like that. Coleman and Alcaraz in particular were running around with no assurance or stability, indeed I think 2 of the goals came from balls bouncing of Coleman and another deflected off him.

The fact it was keystone cops stuff is more a reflection on the coach than the players.

Well that's down to misfortune, surely, rather than ineptness from Coleman? It was the guy who didn't defend the cross, Alcaraz in one or two of those incidents, that allowed the ball to bounce off Coleman. It's a bit like the two that hit the woodwork from Barkley: on another occasion things could have been very different. Which isn't to say that Kiev weren't the better side on the night. Coleman hasn't perhaps had his best season but i still rate him highly and think that he did some good work down the flank.

 

[froggyted]

He said that we defended poorly as a team and that he refused to blame the defence as all 11 men defended badly. That seems reasonable enough to me,

Martinez has the good grace (unlike the likes of Van Gall) not to criticise individual players in public. Who knows what he thinks privately and expresses in the dressing room.

 

[froggyted]

I'm on page 186 and haven't offered an opinion, yet. I have a lot of opinions about what I've read in the first 185pp but I haven't got the time. I'm disappointed but I don't see much point in blaming people.

My question here Is - Do you think it would have been any different if we'd won at Leicester? And then held on to a 2-0 lead against Arsenal
a week later?

Barry was instrumental in our good 2013/14 season, but he's 36 and has gone on a year too long. Tim Howard is 37 and his reflexes have slowed. Distin is 37.

I've been defending Martinez, but I do question his selections and inflexibility with his game plan.

I don't think 5-2 was a fair reflection of the match. We weren't that bad and I think they're better than some here are giving them credit for.

I think they can go further in this and I hope they do.

Well, it wasn't just Leicester, we got off to a slow start generally. I would like to think the guys didn't let their heads drop after just one result. Conceding a two goal lead to Arsenal the following week certainly wouldn't have helped, the defeat against Chelsea would have been a crushing blow, followed by another poor performance against West Brom. I think by then a trend had started to emerge that was never effectively redressed, and some of that to me has to be put down to the mindset of the players. Somehow, the team that played so well last season hasn't really turned up for this one. There are of course a few other factors, and the loss of Pienaar is imo a major one. Martinez really needs to address this, and a general lack of quality and creativity in midfield, most of all during the summer. Barry I think has had his day, his pace is too slow and he is a real liability when it comes to his disciplinary record - sooner or later that's going to cost us valuable points. Ross Barkley has been a real disappointment as a potentially gifted creative midfielder, and i would give him just one more season to prove himself. Steve Naismith is a real asset, despite his flaws, and the same with regard to Mirallas, although i think most of us are now resigned to losing him in the summer, so replacing him with someone of equal, or better, creative ability is imo of paramount importance. We also need another quality striker to partner Lukaku; Kone has so far shown very little evidence that he can be that man, although to be fair to him he has had very little match time. Defensively, i think we're good as long as the first choices are fit (Baines, Jagielka, Stones and Coleman, and we also have some very promising youngsters coming through in Garbutt and Browning). As I've mentioned in earlier posts in this thread I still think that Howard has the quality, and has been largely let down by the guys in front of him, particularly with respect to all the conceded possession in midfield, but the chances are that next season will be his last as first choice so we need to be looking for a replacement for him too during the summer. Joel possibly has the quality, but i have serious doubt and would not be prone to push his case on the strength of two or three decent performances just before Howard came back.

As previously discussed, Martinez has tried to instil a passing game, and our lads haven't delivered the goods; hopefully this will be largely addressed next season by the appropriate changes in midfield. But we do also need to mix it up a bit with more direct football, and to be fair to Martinez he has done this in recent games. Unfortunately he is in a no-win situation with some of the armchair critics, who slagged him off for the slow passing game only a few weeks ago and now have the guns out for him for being naive against Kiev by not playing that way, when in effect major factors in us losing this match included two or three defensive blunders, a couple of balls coming off the woodwork, several very dodgy refereeing decisions including one penalty call, cynical play by some of the Kiev players, and two stunning strikes that nobody could have pre-empted.