Current Affairs Ukraine

[JimmyJeffers]

The best way to judge what will happen is to put yourself in the position of Putin. What would you do? If I wanted to regain control, I'd put my strongest foot forward and that's my nuclear arsenal and I'd want newspapers to write about it and people in the West to panic about me using it. I ain't messing around. This is serious business.

lol This bit had be laughing. If you are a wind up account this is genius.

 

[Toffee_Loaf]

Petraeus: US would destroy Russia’s troops if Putin uses nuclear weapons in Ukraine

Former CIA director and retired army general says Moscow’s leader is ‘desperate’ and ‘battlefield reality he faces is irreversible’

www.theguardian.com

When you say upping the ante, how many Russian cities, towns and villages have been destroyed ? You are just peddling the Russian line of scaremongering hoping that the west caves. It worked at the beginning and even now it continues by not allowing Ukraine to destroy parts of Russia. Any use of nuclear weapons by Russia would be the end of Russia, so Putin gains what exactly ? You also say that he could give nuclear weapons to terrorists or terrorist states, and we should all be afraid. What if the West gave some of its large nuclear stock to Ukraine, now who should be afraid, certainly Moscow, St Petersburg etc. So do you see how this works. So far Russia has literally gotten away with murder, but Ukraine may well get the upper hand. Any use of a nuclear device would spell disaster for Russia, and Putin and his mates all know this……

The US is taking us to the brink of a nuclear war, for what? Humanitarian reasons? For Ukraine cities? Do you really believe that? Can you be that naive? The US doesn't care about Ukraine or it's people.

Look at the most recent example. Do you remember Obama's Red Lines for Assad in Syria if he used chemical weapons on his own people? Assad used them half a dozen times and the US did nothing. Assad laughed in Obama's face. We've seen bluffs like this from the US for years (except when Trump was there ironically). The withdrawal after the Gulf war leaving the Kurds to their doom, some Allies we are! All we have from Biden are foreign policy catastrophes like Afghanistan where billions of dollars worth of equipment were left behind, so chaotic was the withdrawal, which the Taliban could use to round up, harass, rape and murder all the women left behind. Do you not remember people clinging to planes taking off and dropping people to their death from a 1000 ft in the air so scared where they? The US is really humanitarian... They won't do anything if Putin nukes because when Putin decides to escalate this, he's had enough and he has enough nukes to pound NATO 100 times over. All they'll do is rattle their sabres.

I don't understand how someone so intelligent can not only be fooled by media lies. Let's put it like this. Would you bet the lives of your children on the government's propaganda in Ukraine? Because that's what's at stake! It's crazy. Blowing up Nord Stream pipelines, blowing up bridges into Crimea, giving arms directly to an enemy. This isn't humanitarian. We're asking for it now! I've been waiting for some sensible, experienced person in public to say - what on Earth are we doing? Yet still we hear crickets. It's like Covid all over again - everybody nodding along meanwhile the economy goes to hell and people die in misery alone.

 

[peteblue]

The US is taking us to the brink of a nuclear war, for what? Humanitarian reasons? For Ukraine cities? Do you really believe that? Can you be that naive? The US doesn't care about Ukraine or it's people.

Look at the most recent example. Do you remember Obama's Red Lines for Assad in Syria if he used chemical weapons on his own people? Assad used them half a dozen times and the US did nothing. Assad laughed in Obama's face. We've seen bluffs like this from the US for years (except when Trump was there ironically). The withdrawal after the Gulf war leaving the Kurds to their doom, some Allies we are! All we have from Biden are foreign policy catastrophes like Afghanistan where billions of dollars worth of equipment were left behind, so chaotic was the withdrawal, which the Taliban could use to round up, harass, rape and murder all the women left behind. Do you not remember people clinging to planes taking off and dropping people to their death from a 1000 ft in the air so scared where they? The US is really humanitarian... They won't do anything if Putin nukes because when Putin decides to escalate this, he's had enough and he has enough nukes to pound NATO 100 times over. All they'll do is rattle their sabres.

I don't understand how someone so intelligent can not only be fooled by media lies. Let's put it like this. Would you bet the lives of your children on the government's propaganda in Ukraine? Because that's what's at stake! It's crazy. Blowing up Nord Stream pipelines, blowing up bridges into Crimea, giving arms directly to an enemy. This isn't humanitarian. We're asking for it now! I've been waiting for some sensible, experienced person in public to say - what on Earth are we doing? Yet still we hear crickets.

A simple question, what does Putin or indeed Russia gain ?…..

 

[Chewbacca]

Putin won’t escalate as the risks of battlefield loss is too high. His current tactic is to stall hoping for a Trump administration.

 

[Mutzo Nutzo]

The US is taking us to the brink of a nuclear war, for what? Humanitarian reasons? For Ukraine cities? Do you really believe that? Can you be that naive? The US doesn't care about Ukraine or it's people.

Look at the most recent example. Do you remember Obama's Red Lines for Assad in Syria if he used chemical weapons on his own people? Assad used them half a dozen times and the US did nothing. Assad laughed in Obama's face. We've seen bluffs like this from the US for years (except when Trump was there ironically). The withdrawal after the Gulf war leaving the Kurds to their doom, some Allies we are! All we have from Biden are foreign policy catastrophes like Afghanistan where billions of dollars worth of equipment were left behind, so chaotic was the withdrawal, which the Taliban could use to round up, harass, rape and murder all the women left behind. Do you not remember people clinging to planes taking off and dropping people to their death from a 1000 ft in the air so scared where they? The US is really humanitarian... They won't do anything if Putin nukes because when Putin decides to escalate this, he's had enough and he has enough nukes to pound NATO 100 times over. All they'll do is rattle their sabres.

I don't understand how someone so intelligent can not only be fooled by media lies. Let's put it like this. Would you bet the lives of your children on the government's propaganda in Ukraine? Because that's what's at stake! It's crazy. Blowing up Nord Stream pipelines, blowing up bridges into Crimea, giving arms directly to an enemy. This isn't humanitarian. We're asking for it now! I've been waiting for some sensible, experienced person in public to say - what on Earth are we doing? Yet still we hear crickets. It's like Covid all over again - everybody nodding along meanwhile the economy goes to hell and people die in misery alone.

Oh dear! You accuse the masses of following the western media rhetoric yet you have been completely sucked in by the Russian media rhetoric.

In your desire to be viewed as a free-thinking, well read, and alternative you’ve actually allowed yourself to be corrupted by the very machine that you so vehemently oppose.

Stop trying to be an edge lord and use your common sense. Russia has bombed the crap out of and invaded Georgia, Chechnya, and now Ukraine. If the west sits back and allows Ukraine to fall - who’s next?

Russia crossed the line and the brave Ukranian people have stood up to them. The western powers will do everything possible (within limits) to help Ukraine trash the Russian war machine so that they won’t be able to threaten a neighbour state for a very long time and hopefully will end their current leadership and radically change their foreign policy.

There’s only one aggressor here and it’s Russia. To sit back and appease them is the worst possible response the west could do.

 

[Toffee_Loaf]

Putin won’t escalate as the risks of battlefield loss is too high. His current tactic is to stall hoping for a Trump administration.

That doesn't sound reasonable on two counts. Firstly the risks of battle field losses increases if he does nothing since Ukraine continues to receive better battlefield armaments than his armies have. Secondly, there is at the very least only a 50-50 chance of Trump winning IF he is even the Republican nominee and the law enforcement agencies haven't tried to fit him up for another mysterious crime.

Meanwhile ... It's such a humanitarian conflict...

“Despite being at the centre of news cycle and international policy, little attention has gone to the core of the conflict — who controls the agricultural land in the country known as the breadbasket of Europe. [The] Answer to this question is paramount to understanding the major stakes in the war.”

Sowing Seeds of Plunder: A Lose-Lose Situation in Ukraine​

The report shows the total amount of land controlled by oligarchs, corrupt individuals and large agribusinesses is over nine million hectares — exceeding 28% of Ukraine’s arable land (the rest is used by over eight million Ukrainian farmers).

The largest landholders are a mix of Ukrainian oligarchs and foreign interests — mostly European and North American as well as the sovereign fund of Saudi Arabia. A number of large US pension funds, foundations and university endowments are also invested in Ukrainian land through NCH Capital – a US-based private equity fund, which is the fifth largest landholder in the country.

President Zelenskyy put the land reform into law in 2020 against the will of the vast majority of the population who feared it would exacerbate corruption and reinforce control by powerful interests in the agricultural sector.

The Oakland Institute notes that, while large landholders are securing massive financing from Western financial institutions, Ukrainian farmers — essential for ensuring domestic food supply — receive virtually no support. With the land market in place, amid high economic stress and war, this difference of treatment will lead to more land consolidation by large agribusinesses.

All but one of the ten largest landholding firms are registered overseas, mainly in tax havens such as Cyprus or Luxembourg. The report identifies many prominent investors, including Vanguard Group, Kopernik Global Investors, BNP Asset Management Holding, Goldman Sachs-owned NN Investment Partners Holdings, and Norges Bank Investment Management, which manages Norway’s sovereign wealth fund.

Most of the agribusiness firms are substantially indebted to Western financial institutions, in particular the European Bank for Reconstruction and Development, the European Investment Bank, and the International Finance Corporation – the private sector arm of the World Bank.

Together, these institutions have been major lenders to Ukrainian agribusinesses, with close to US$1.7 billion lent to just six of Ukraine’s largest landholding firms in recent years. Other key lenders are a mix of mainly European and North American financial institutions, both public and private.

The report notes that this gives creditors financial stakes in the operation of the agribusinesses and confers significant leverage over them. Meanwhile, Ukrainian farmers have had to operate with limited amounts of land and financing, and many are now on the verge of poverty.

 

[Kharkiv]

Removed by staff

 

[Toffee_Loaf]

Oh dear! You accuse the masses of following the western media rhetoric yet you have been completely sucked in by the Russian media rhetoric.

In your desire to be viewed as a free-thinking, well read, and alternative you’ve actually allowed yourself to be corrupted by the very machine that you so vehemently oppose.

Stop trying to be an edge lord and use your common sense. Russia has bombed the crap out of and invaded Georgia, Chechnya, and now Ukraine. If the west sits back and allows Ukraine to fall - who’s next?

Russia crossed the line and the brave Ukranian people have stood up to them. The western powers will do everything possible (within limits) to help Ukraine trash the Russian war machine so that they won’t be able to threaten a neighbour state for a very long time and hopefully will end their current leadership and radically change their foreign policy.

There’s only one aggressor here and it’s Russia. To sit back and appease them is the worst possible response the west could do.

I don't even know what the Russian propaganda argument even is since we're not allowed to receive it anymore. It always used to be the case that you would get one side's propaganda and the other side's propaganda and the truth would lie somewhere between the two. Yet our veritable democracy has cut off the Russia news channels. No argument except the governments propaganda is allowed here - just like during Covid. I think its totalitarian, but nobody else seems to care.

 

[Yarrgh]

A simple question, what does Putin or indeed Russia gain ?…..

They escalate conventionally, they suffer and Ukraine suffers. They escalate non-conventionally, potentially the whole world suffers.

Currently the west is managing a very sh@#£y situation probably as well as it can. The problem is, this is set to drag on for god knows how long as it stands and thousands are dying needlessly over Putin's land grab.

 

[Spadge Vernacular]

 

[Spadge Vernacular]

 

[verreauxi]

@Toffee_Loaf You will forgive me if I don't take seriously anything you have to say regarding the situation in Ukraine or elsewhere. Of all the virtues one could instill in a growing child, adolescent proactive murderous vigilantism is a new one to me.

 

[Diogenes the Cynic]

@Toffee_Loaf You will forgive me if I don't take seriously anything you have to say regarding the situation in Ukraine or elsewhere. Of all the virtues one could instill in a growing child, adolescent proactive murderous vigilantism is a new one to me.

View attachment 211242

Haha. Stick a fork in this lad, he's done.

 

[tsubaki]

They escalate conventionally, they suffer and Ukraine suffers. They escalate non-conventionally, potentially the whole world suffers.

Currently the west is managing a very sh@#£y situation probably as well as it can. The problem is, this is set to drag on for god knows how long as it stands and thousands are dying needlessly over Putin's land grab.

Not sure about this bit at all.

I don't want to just repost something I said a few months back but there is an awful lot more that the West could be doing (should be doing, really) - both domestically and in terms of diplomatic efforts.

Any country that does, or is considering, getting supplies of any kind from Russia should be helped to (as far as possible) wean itself off a state of dependence - the best example being renewable energy; we should try and get it to whoever wants it. We should look at our own societies and economies and, finally, take the chance to carry out some much needed reform and concentration of taxpayers money where it is needed - infrastructure is going to be key, and so the long happy time for the water and power "companies" has to end.

 

[Spadge Vernacular]

Not sure about this bit at all.

I don't want to just repost something I said a few months back but there is an awful lot more that the West could be doing (should be doing, really) - both domestically and in terms of diplomatic efforts.

Any country that does, or is considering, getting supplies of any kind from Russia should be helped to (as far as possible) wean itself off a state of dependence - the best example being renewable energy; we should try and get it to whoever wants it. We should look at our own societies and economies and, finally, take the chance to carry out some much needed reform and concentration of taxpayers money where it is needed - infrastructure is going to be key, and so the long happy time for the water and power "companies" has to end.

That and help to ensure that Russia is finished as a military power.