Current Affairs Ukraine

[Spadge Vernacular]

I know why you’re doing this, you’re protecting yourself and your family. You’re paranoid in case they’re monitoring you. You’re not that gullible

Comrade Steveski doesn't have to post in here or about the subject.

 

[larrygobfiend]

Comrade Steveski doesn't have to post in here or about the subject.

I dunno, it leaves a convenient trail of pro Russian support if he’s ever questioned by authorities over there. It might sound preposterous, but it is Russia we’re talking about…

 

[Spadge Vernacular]

I agree with the first part completely, you can't hold a referendum in an active war zone.

The reason why they're doing so isn't about international law though, it's about internal Russian law which Putin is following to the letter in this conflict.
The recognition of the independant territories as such enabled him to order the SMO under Russian and as was argued at the time following UN law to give justification. Before that Russia had refused calls from Donbass to recognize their independence from Ukraine as to do so would have under Russian law forced Russia to have intervened.

The referendum again is about Russian law and what it allows under a SMO and once that referendum makes those areas Russian territory in Russias eyes, it will legally allow them to change the SMO into a war, and that changes everything in terms of allowable actions from the military. Up till now the Russian army has not been engaging according to it's military doctrines, and it's shown.

I fear this thing is gonna go up a huge notch in terms of destruction in the very best future

It would be as legal as Ukraine stating that Moscow is part of Ukraine and referring back to the Kyivan Rus people who founded swathes of what is now Russia and saying they are going to hold referendum to bring it back under Kiev rule. It is nonsense and is just a natter of time before the Russian monsters are sent packing. Many will die in the process but that is all down to Putin and those backing him.

 

[Spadge Vernacular]

I dunno, it leaves a convenient trail of pro Russian support if he’s ever questioned by authorities over there. It might sound preposterous, but it is Russia we’re talking about…

I am sure if he felt under that much threat he would not be living there.

 

[Spadge Vernacular]

Lavrov defends Russia at U.N. showdown rife with anger over Ukraine war

Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov defended Moscow's war in Ukraine at the U.N. Security Council on Thursday as the United Nations warned Moscow against annexing Ukrainian regions and Western ministers called for accountability over atrocities.

www.reuters.com

Top of the chain stuff from this blert.

 

[Jamiednm]

This is exactly what Tony Blair did alongside Bush and Cheney - completely make up a reason to invade another country, kill countless numbers of people and subject the military to a nightmarish quagmire. That Blair is still allowed to roam the streets is sick.

 

[Mutzo Nutzo]

If you said the UK being part of the USA then you might get a more similar analogy. Anyway not for this thread!

Regardless of what we all think, the referendums are now taking place. Soon these regions will be stuffed with armed Russians - not sure if soldier is an appropriate term. It's going to be carnage taking the areas back into Ukraine and god alone knows what will happen to non occupied areas.

My guess is Russia wants a frozen conflict like it has going on in Transnistra and neither side will concede defeat and it normalises and interest is lost outside of Ukraine and Russia. With time they'll return some areas, perhaps Kherson for returning to the fold internationally whilst keeping hold of Donbass and the corridor to Crimea with some money and gas to grease the wheels in Ukraine and cold Europe. If the US can get an oil or gas company back into Russia and/or fracking rights in the occupied areas then its endgame in sight with a % to Ukraine. But I'm not cynical...

Yup, as you say Russia wants to freeze the battle-lines and flood these zones with troops and artillery making it nearly impossible for Ukraine to re-take territory and force them to the negotiating table.

Thats why they need ATACMS, Reapers and paveways. These tools will allow them to destroy Russian artillery and logistics and essentially cut-off the troops, who let’s face it don’t want to be there anyway.

Be interesting to see what weapon systems the US ships next time around as this will indicate the next phase of this war.

 

[Spadge Vernacular]

Yup, as you say Russia wants to freeze the battle-lines and flood these zones with troops and artillery making it nearly impossible for Ukraine to re-take territory and force them to the negotiating table.

Thats why they need ATACMS, Reapers and paveways. These tools will allow them to destroy Russian artillery and logistics and essentially cut-off the troops, who let’s face it don’t want to be there anyway.

Be interesting to see what weapon systems the US ships next time around as this will indicate the next phase of this war.

Republican leader in U.S. Senate calls on Biden to send ATACMS to Ukraine

U.S. Senator Mitch McConnell, who leads the Republican minority in U.S. Senate, has called on the Joe Biden administration to provide more lethal weapons to Ukraine, including long-range ATACMS. — Ukrinform.

www.ukrinform.net

 

[Yarrgh]

Yup, as you say Russia wants to freeze the battle-lines and flood these zones with troops and artillery making it nearly impossible for Ukraine to re-take territory and force them to the negotiating table.

Thats why they need ATACMS, Reapers and paveways. These tools will allow them to destroy Russian artillery and logistics and essentially cut-off the troops, who let’s face it don’t want to be there anyway.

Be interesting to see what weapon systems the US ships next time around as this will indicate the next phase of this war.

Cursed to live in interesting times.

 

[Noisy noise annoys]

Why on earth would I think he was provoked in Georgia for? If anything it was the other way round and Georgia was provoked into attacking and fell into a trap laid for them mate.

Exactly! He was not provoked in any of his murderous crusades, including the current one. He just makes excuses and his apologist lap it up.

 

[Noisy noise annoys]

I agree with the first part completely, you can't hold a referendum in an active war zone.

The reason why they're doing so isn't about international law though, it's about internal Russian law which Putin is following to the letter in this conflict.
The recognition of the independant territories as such enabled him to order the SMO under Russian and as was argued at the time following UN law to give justification. Before that Russia had refused calls from Donbass to recognize their independence from Ukraine as to do so would have under Russian law forced Russia to have intervened.

The referendum again is about Russian law and what it allows under a SMO and once that referendum makes those areas Russian territory in Russias eyes, it will legally allow them to change the SMO into a war, and that changes everything in terms of allowable actions from the military. Up till now the Russian army has not been engaging according to it's military doctrines, and it's shown.

I fear this thing is gonna go up a huge notch in terms of destruction in the very best future

Have I got this wrong... these areas are in the Ukraine?! You cannot in anyway have a referendum in a different country. Perhaps Truss could have one in Benidorm? Modi in Southall?
The logic is utterly ridiculous

 

[COYBL25]

Yup, as you say Russia wants to freeze the battle-lines and flood these zones with troops and artillery making it nearly impossible for Ukraine to re-take territory and force them to the negotiating table.

Thats why they need ATACMS, Reapers and paveways. These tools will allow them to destroy Russian artillery and logistics and essentially cut-off the troops, who let’s face it don’t want to be there anyway.

Be interesting to see what weapon systems the US ships next time around as this will indicate the next phase of this war.

Forgive my ignorance, but aren`t the forthcoming Winter months, going to play a very big part in everything too ?

I know that the Russian military are very experienced at Winter fighting, but surely fighting in the mud, snow and freezing conditions is going to have a big bearing in the next few months ?

 

[Bluerover]

Done the Beamish Brewery a couple of times on stag do’s. Great place.

Have you Cork connections? I have never been to the brewery, although I did the distillers' in Middleton.

 

[Alan Whittle]

Have you Cork connections? I have never been to the brewery, although I did the distillers' in Middleton.

No, Brewing Industry connections in my working life. Cork is a great City. I loved The Crawford Gallery, had a good day at the races.Also got down to Kinsale, another beautiful place.

 

[Yarrgh]

Forgive my ignorance, but aren`t the forthcoming Winter months, going to play a very big part in everything too ?

I know that the Russian military are very experienced at Winter fighting, but surely fighting in the mud, snow and freezing conditions is going to have a big bearing in the next few months ?

Yep. I guess it will make defence far more preferable to attack. I can see Russia hunker down and rely on shear numbers in the next 6 months or so.

Other than that, hitting power and water utilities are going to be even more devastating so I wouldn't be surprised if they get hit. Both sides will do this.

Any weakness in logistics and supply systems will be exploited and I think Ukraine will go this route.