Two steps forward

[ilikecheese]

But the point I'm making is you can't say we win it 9 out of 10 times when we don't! When we lost to Sunderland in 2013/14 it was 'one of those games' because we were winning most weeks and just somehow contrived to lose that game. As you say, it happens.

This season though, 9 times out of 10, we're not winning those games. Swansea away, norwich away, Swansea at home, palace at home, today. All games you would think we should have won based on possession, shots etc but all games that we failed to win. To me that moved beyond bad luck and starts to become a pattern.

Only talking about the WBA game...we played well, we were the better team...we lost. Nothing more, nothing less.

I would say the atmosphere is not helpful at all...especially when we are playing well.

 

[kithnou]

Only talking about the WBA game...we played well, we were the better team...we lost. Nothing more, nothing less.

I would say the atmosphere is not helpful at all...especially when we are playing well.

Have to agree. I don't think I have seen/heard a more insipid Everton home crowd in over 3 decades than the one of the last year or so.
And that includes during the poor late 90s era.
Where is the life? The atmosphere? Is it not coming across through the screen as it is at the ground? Because it is embarrassing viewing it.

 

[Lanolin]

Only talking about the WBA game...we played well, we were the better team...we lost. Nothing more, nothing less.

I would say the atmosphere is not helpful at all...especially when we are playing well.

But you're saying we would have won that game 9/10 times. I'm putting forward evidence that you are incorrect because numerous similar games have also seen us fail to win.

The atmosphere really isn't that bad in the way you're making out. There was no booing until the utterly mind boggling second substitution today so let's not try to use that as an excuse (I don't boo by the way, but I inderstand those who do). It's quiet yes, but it was certainly not hostile towards the team today, nor has it been in most games.

I get annoyed with the lack of atmosphere but I honestly think the negativity of the crowd has been overstated by some.

 

[ilikecheese]

But you're saying we would have won that game 9/10 times. I'm putting forward evidence that you are incorrect because numerous similar games have also seen us fail to win.

The atmosphere really isn't that bad in the way you're making out. There was no booing until the utterly mind boggling second substitution today so let's not try to use that as an excuse (I don't boo by the way, but I inderstand those who do). It's quiet yes, but it was certainly not hostile towards the team today, nor has it been in most games.

I get annoyed with the lack of atmosphere but I honestly think the negativity of the crowd has been overstated by some.

I don't think we were as on top in those games you mentioned. We completely dominated WBA...they fluked a goal and did a Pulis. We still found ways through...we were unlucky not to score.

The atmosphere is crap...has been for a while. Toxic. Moyes got some sort of pass with our fans every season we started completely awfully under him. Martinez and his team gets groans and boos. It is not helpful.

 

[kithnou]

I don't think we were as on top in those games you mentioned. We completely dominated WBA...they fluked a goal and did a Pulis. We still found ways through...we were unlucky not to score.

The atmosphere is crap...has been for a while. Toxic. Moyes got some sort of pass with our fans every season we started completely awfully under him. Martinez and his team gets groans and boos. It is not helpful.

Agree mate. I think though that may be because the fans are over hearing Roberto talk fluffety poopoos. They are judging him much harsher than Moyes based on what comes out of his mouth....and quite possibly he being a foreigner.
However, Roberto is doing himself no favours with some staggering team selections , substitutions and love affairs with dud or finished footballers.
Frustration levels are at a high, and an eruptive crescendo is on the way I feel.

 

[Jags]

Do people even bother looking at the league table or our form anymore, or just say this sort of tosh to make themselves not have to face reality?

We do play like this most weeks, that's why we've lost seven home games.

We clearly don't though do we mate. United, Swansea, Palace. 3 games straight away where we didn't play as well. I'm trying to think did we play Arsenal at home. Norwich maybe. West Ham too.

 

[ilikecheese]

Agree mate. I think though that may be because the fans are over hearing Roberto talk fluffety poopoos. They are judging him much harsher than Moyes based on what comes out of his mouth....and quite possibly he being a foreigner.
However, Roberto is doing himself no favours with some staggering team selections , substitutions and love affairs with dud or finished footballers.
Frustration levels are at a high, and an eruptive crescendo is on the way I feel.

His positivity seems to be his kryptonite with the fans. Moyes had his frustrating favorites...regarding dud and finished footballers...see Neville.

The massive fume IMO is based on raised expectations and his positivity and falling short of CL football.

Moyes never put expectations on himself...it was always about lowering expectations. Plucky little Everton making Europe...YAY!

 

[kithnou]

His positivity seems to be his kryptonite with the fans. Moyes had his frustrating favorites...regarding dud and finished footballers...see Neville.

The massive fume IMO is based on raised expectations and his positivity and falling short of CL football.

Moyes never put expectations on himself...it was always about lowering expectations. Plucky little Everton making Europe...YAY!

That's just it. Being positive is accepted by all. Talking fluffity poopoos to justify something glaringly obvious he is missing is considered by fans as disrespecting them.
And this is coming from someone who voted for him to stay.
Interesting times ahead.

 

[ilikecheese]

That's just it. Being positive is accepted by all. Talking fluffity poopoos to justify something glaringly obvious he is missing is considered by fans as disrespecting them.
And this is coming from someone who voted for him to stay.
Interesting times ahead.

See I just don't get why that is a bother. Moyes was never downright negative...he just never raised expectations. Martinez does probably try too hard to paint a positive picture, but I'd much rather someone raising my hopes over someone downplaying them just so I felt better when we fluked a draw to a bigger opponent.

 

[kithnou]

See I just don't get why that is a bother. Moyes was never downright negative...he just never raised expectations. Martinez does probably try too hard to paint a positive picture, but I'd much rather someone raising my hopes over someone downplaying them just so I felt better when we fluked a draw to a bigger opponent.

No problem with raising hopes about a positive future. Not at all.
Telling supporters, and this is just an example, how well Tim Howard, or Antolin Alcaraz or Arouna Kone just played, after the same supporters have watched them being rubbish for a long time now, is construed by supporters as disrespecting them. Talking "fluffity poopoos".
You can't raise expectations with your words, then completely deflate them on a weekly basis with your actions, and not expect supporter disatisfaction.
He talks too much fluffity fluff mate is my point.
I like him. I want him to succeed. We'll find out soon I guess...

 

[ilikecheese]

No problem with raising hopes about a positive future. Not at all.
Telling supporters, and this is just an example, how well Tim Howard, or Antolin Alcaraz or Arouna Kone just played, after the same supporters have watched them being rubbish for a long time now, is construed by supporters as disrespecting them. Talking "fluffity poopoos".
You can't raise expectations with your words, then completely deflate them on a weekly basis with your actions, and not expect supporter disatisfaction.
He talks too much fluffity fluff mate is my point.
I like him. I want him to succeed. We'll find out soon I guess...

Meh...I think our supporters tend to focus on a few players and find flaws when they can and ignore good also when they can.

We have to have our scapegoats...it is the nature of this place.

 

[kithnou]

Meh...I think our supporters tend to focus on a few players and find flaws when they can and ignore good also when they can.

We have to have our scapegoats...it is the nature of this place.

Supporters in general aren't idiots. We are talking about the Goodison match going supporters. You usually see the match more accurately at the ground.

 

[Elong]

Supporters in general aren't idiots. We are talking about the Goodison match going supporters. You usually see the match more accurately at the ground.

Have you not been reading this forum lately????

 

[kithnou]

Have you not been reading this forum lately????

Did you miss the rest of that?

 

[Elong]

Did you miss the rest of that?

No, I was just being a nob