The 2 years since Martinez left.

[davek]

He was a second rate, relegated manager who had seen his Wigan side get lucky in a cup.

He was then lucky enough to take over a consistently finishing top 6 side and turned them into a side only good enough to finish 11th 2 seasons on the bounce.

Ergo, he took us backwards. the players knew it, the majority of the fans knew it and his bosses knew it, hence him getting potted after yet another humiliating defeat at Leicester when the whole nation was laughing at how bad we had become.

You can't slate Koeman for the bad start he had this season and not apply the same rules for Martinez.

Oh boy.

 

[BernieH]

2 11th placed finishes and shipping goals for fun, no, sorry he had his chance and blew it because his philosophy didn't include defending or practicing set pieces.

 

[Thomasc]

Oh boy.

Amazing retort to a load of hard cold facts lol

Remember when he called Mcgeady a worldie and said Tom Cleverley was basically the best midfielder in the country?

What a time to be alive.

 

[hktoffee]

You just need to look at the funds available;

Signings over 10mil made under Martinez -- Lukaku, McCarthy, Niasse (Mori was 9.5mil but a 50% profit could have been made on him too).
Lukaku was a major success
McCarthy would have been a success but for injuries and was heavily linked to Arsenal.

Signings over 10mil made under Koeman -- Schneiderlin, Bolasie, Williams, Klaassen, Keane, Pickford, Sigurdsson.
Pickford has been a major success.

Signings over 10mil made under Allardyce -- Tosun, Walcott.
Jury is out.


Quite clearly Martinez spent larger transfer fees far more wisely than Koeman.

I think if Martinez was given the 190mil Koeman spent on those 7 signings above he would have theoretically signed superior players to fit into his system and would therefore have had far greater success.

Add on the 50mil odd Allardyce has spent on two players who wouldn't be first choices in the top 6 and its hard to argue against that.

Been saying this for ages and some fans seem to ignore it. ￡13m spent in 2013 is not the same as the ￡13m spent in 2017. That's a massive inflation.

While you laid all the blame on Koeman you got to remember Walsh is equally share the blame while Martinez did not have a doj at his back and BK had tolerated him for 2 years.

Moshiri did the right thing and sacked Martinez so to say if he got whatever available to him is out of the question. He got 29.33% winning rate in the league between 2014-2016 and he would have relegated Everton by now.

McCarthy would leave on a free when he is fit again. Mori and Niasse we don't know who are going to pay for them (And for how much). To say Martinez's signings are better is unjust and unfair.

 

[Thomasc]

Been saying this for ages and some fans seem to ignore it. ￡13m spent in 2013 is not the same as the ￡13m spent in 2017. That's a massive inflation.

While you laid all the blame on Koeman you got to remember Walsh is equally share the blame while Martinez did not have a doj at his back and BK had tolerated him for 2 years.

Moshiri did the right thing and sacked Martinez so to say if he got whatever available to him is out of the question. He got 29.33% winning rate in the league between 2014-2016 and he would have relegated Everton by now.

McCarthy would leave on a free when he is fit again. Mori and Niasse we don't know who are going to pay for them (And for how much). To say Martinez's signings are better is unjust and unfair.

Phenomenal

 

[TraffordBlue]

...erm, because he was played by Moyes AS A FORWARD.

He was playing as an attacking midfielder/target man. He wasn't an out and out forward but I agree he was more than just a normal attacking midfielder.

Regardless, he was a midfielder who was capable of being utilised in that role to contribute 12 goals in 36 appearances - 1 goal in 3 games and therefore your dismissal of him as a galoot as if he was a poor player is wrong.

Wish we had someone like him in our team now.

 

[davek]

Amazing retort to a load of hard cold facts lol

Remember when he called Mcgeady a worldie and said Tom Cleverley was basically the best midfielder in the country?

What a time to be alive.

lol
"Facts"? Well, they're cold and hard and brown anyway.

 

[Zatara]

He was a second rate, relegated manager who had seen his Wigan side get lucky in a cup.

He was then lucky enough to take over a consistently finishing top 6 side and turned them into a side only good enough to finish 11th 2 seasons on the bounce.

Ergo, he took us backwards. the players knew it, the majority of the fans knew it and his bosses knew it, hence him getting potted after yet another humiliating defeat at Leicester when the whole nation was laughing at how bad we had become.

You can't slate Koeman for the bad start he had this season and not apply the same rules for Martinez.

I totally disagree with this...you only need to look at the facts;

Season 1 Martinez spent about 20mil and brought in 40mil approx.
Season 1 Koeman spent about 77mil and brought in 55mil

Season 2 Martinez spent about 35mil and brought in 2mil
Season 2 Koeman spent about 155mil and brought in 90mil

In comparable terms Koeman had a positive swing of 42mil year one and 33mil year 2.

Also Koeman was able to sell Stones and Lukaku (who Martinez had developed) benefitting from Lukaku's goals as well.

Clearly if Martinez had failed so badly then the improvements in those two players wouldn't have net us an approx 90mil profit enabling Koeman to waste it on total overpriced dross (bar Pickford).

Also, in his first 2 seasons Martinez signed 10 players and Koeman has signed closer to 20...theoretically gutting the squad and signing his own players who 'should' have fit his strategy and playing style...

The only comparatively large signing was Lukaku under Martinez...


I personally believe that if after Martinez finished 5th he was given similar backing in the transfer market he would have achieved success.

 

[davek]

He was playing as an attacking midfielder/target man. He wasn't an out and out forward but I agree he was more than just a normal attacking midfielder.

Regardless, he was a midfielder who was capable of being utilised in that role to contribute 12 goals in 36 appearances - 1 goal in 3 games and therefore your dismissal of him as a galoot as if he was a poor player is wrong.

Wish we had someone like him in our team now.

Top whack for us of £15M.

Defo not the best use of resources ever made. It took him about a season to be persuaded to keep his elbows from smashing in the face of opponents and putting us down to 10 men.

 

[Rudolf Hucker]

Why would we have gone down, we had no problems winning away games under him and the defensive shambles was largely down to the ongoing Stones saga.

I’d say the defensive issues were mostly down to Howard. He was great for us in his first few seasons, but by the end he was making big mistakes every game.

He couldn’t sweep either, which Martinez philosophy relied on, similar to the calamity defending of Pep’s first season.

Some blamed Stones for a pass back to Howard, who instead of moving towards the ball, backed off it, then realised Vardy was closing in, took him out..

Back four has to have confidence in the Keeper. Martinez should never have dropped Robles when Howard was fit.

 

[Abraders]

'Leaking goals for fun'

Yet we've conceded considerably more this season than in any of Martinez's I believe

 

[Steve Wigan]

17 goals in two seasons. Great record signing.

Actually, Moyes had AJ running hell for leather to the corner flag as our 'out ball' instead of attacking the opposition goal.Never has there been a more obvious misuse of a strikers natural talent.

 

[Zatara]

Been saying this for ages and some fans seem to ignore it. ￡13m spent in 2013 is not the same as the ￡13m spent in 2017. That's a massive inflation.

While you laid all the blame on Koeman you got to remember Walsh is equally share the blame while Martinez did not have a doj at his back and BK had tolerated him for 2 years.

Moshiri did the right thing and sacked Martinez so to say if he got whatever available to him is out of the question. He got 29.33% winning rate in the league between 2014-2016 and he would have relegated Everton by now.

McCarthy would leave on a free when he is fit again. Mori and Niasse we don't know who are going to pay for them (And for how much). To say Martinez's signings are better is unjust and unfair.

Martinez developed Stones (47.5mil) and Lukaku (75mil--90mil) which was spent by Koeman on; Schneiderlin, Bolasie, Williams, Klaassen, Keane, Pickford, Sigurdsson.

Let that sink in for a while.


Martinez signed Lukaku for 27mil including the loan fee + McCarthy for 13mil + Niasse for 13mil.

McCarthy was wanted by Arsenal for 20mil+ and got an extension. It's absolutely obvious that the sales of his players %wise are far more profitable than what will be seen from the Koeman signings.

Have a think about that for a while.

These are as close to facts as you can get as opposed to your bizarre opinions and hatred for a manager.

I can only assume you've not been supporting the team for very long.

 

[Zatara]

He was playing as an attacking midfielder/target man. He wasn't an out and out forward but I agree he was more than just a normal attacking midfielder.

Regardless, he was a midfielder who was capable of being utilised in that role to contribute 12 goals in 36 appearances - 1 goal in 3 games and therefore your dismissal of him as a galoot as if he was a poor player is wrong.

Wish we had someone like him in our team now.

lol he was used as a forward most of the time.

 

[TraffordBlue]

lol he was used as a forward most of the time.

Jelavic was also playing. Fellaini wasn't leading the line from memory.

Even so, how many midfielders can be utilised as a 'forward' and score 12 goals in 36? For a club outside the CL, i'd say a player like that should be valued, not labelled a galoot as an example of a failed signing.