Kenwright and investment

[Neiler]

This is the really interesting question. I'd along ask "does the club have a plan/mechanism by which they expect to sell the club". i.e. is Bill pitching for a full sale, share issues, a series of individual transactions etc.

It is mate is he meeting potential investors as his role as chairman with the agreement of other shareholders that selling is their intention or simply as a shareholder willing to sell his % of the shares.

A share issue is the really intresting one, which makes me question the intentions of some of the majority shareholders and their goals in buying shares in Everton. In the present climate, im sure a share issue would be extreamely undesirable for shareholders even if there is a market, if ever desirable.

 

[lordyefc]

Oh, there's one other thing I should say, and that's the difference between equity investment and debt.

The generaly opinion is that debt is bad, and equity (i.e. new investors, the type who are looking to make money rather than the benefacters) investment is good. But one of the first things you get taught in financing is not to think of them as two totally seperate things, but rather slightly different forms of the same thing.

Why is debt bad? Obviously, because you have interest payments for years that reduce your potential expenditure, right? But an investor who is looking to make money out of the club would want a return too. In fact, because he is taking on more risk that a loan, he would actually want a higher return than a bank offering a loan.

There are two standard arguments against that:

(1) An investor would want a return, but in doing so he'd grow the club. But so would a loan; a loan of £50m would grow the club in exactly the same way as an equity investment of £50m.

(2) An investor might not take his money directly from the club (as Glazier does), but rather by increasing the sale value of the club. As such, the the investors profit doesn't actually cost the club anything.

Again, when you look at it, it's no different to debt. You could issue new shares for £50m, double in size, and the investors sells his share on - no cost to the club. Or, issue new shares, which are now worth twice as much*. The investor's cut HAS cost the club the opportunity to sell a share at it's peak price.


So basically I just wanted to point out loans are essentially no worse than this kind of investment (in fact, for tax reasons, loans are very slightly better). Again, obviously, a benefactor trumps everything.

 

[Azzbot]

Lordy, stop being so clever, your confusing me.

 

[Goat]

Too late for me now, way too tired. Im in witty comments and downright insults mode. We can continue this tomorrow. And lordy, ya mar is ur auntie lerd.

 

[lordyefc]

Too late for me now, way too tired. Im in witty comments and downright insults mode. We can continue this tomorrow. And lordy, ya mar is ur auntie lerd.

I have literally no idea what that means. 50-50 shot that it's either witty or a downright insult though, so I guess I'm insulted.

 

[Azzbot]

Insult lid.

Just say his mums a donkey, not a goat.

 

[Goat]

I have literally no idea what that means. 50-50 shot that it's either witty or a downright insult though, so I guess I'm insulted.

I was aiming somewhere in the middle really.

 

[DENNIS STEVENS]

the points made here about the other main shareholders intentions have concerned me in terms of the clubs future far more than Kenwright's bullshit over the years. I guess anybody with a majority share-holding could under-write a new share issue & probably substantially increase their % share-holding as a result.

I note that barrycrocker**** seems to think the lack of a new stadium is the critical factor, despite the fact that this hasn't prevented successive take-overs at Pompey. Don't forget any new owner would be paying for that new stadium in the increeased price for the club - maybe they'd prefer to choose how to spend that money themselves, especially as the current proposal seems to be less than universally popular. I also note that as well as seeing the future, barrycrocker**** thinks those who don't agree that a new stadium is essential are naive knobheads - I can't wait to see what's in his 2nd post!

 

[McBain]

If was the boss of the club, seriously reading this I'd tell you to go shove it.

If you knew what running a club was like, you'd all be Chairmen, but you're not.

Reading your posts about 'Such and such has this and such and such does that' is really embarrassing. Like kids with ice-cream.

If your so great at running footy clubs, I'd suggest you stand up and run for Chairman yourself. Do you really have any idea what selling a whole club to people who usually deal in other industries entails? Do you think Moyes buys players without running the absolute strictest of rules over everyone of them? Do you think if the right offer came in and everybody was happy, and the CLUB benefited the most it wouldn't happen?

You would all sacrifice the work they've done so far and spend ludicrous amounts on the Bellamy's of the game. Do you want 9 strikers all on a hundred grand a week sitting around playing cards hoping they get a run out? Get a grip. Stop thinking Kenwright is some megalomaniacal dictator atop piles of cash throwing grapes at his subjects.

You want to be Pompey, Villa or City? Or would you rather be Everton and get the basics right before lunacy steps in. Why do you think they are better than us? Your deluded by modern commercialism, blinded by shiny overpriced luxuries at the expense of your own judgment. You think the club is in such serious trouble why don't you go and work for Everton, work your way into a position on the board and get to have a legitimate say in the way the Club is run? Too much like hard work. You wanted handed on a silver platter from a Butler who earns more than an astronaut.

In the words of a famous and well respected Antipodean journalist, SHAME, SHAME, SHAME.

WE are the club the rest want to be like, not the other way around.

 

[Goat]

I cant be Chairman, I dont have the required cashflow needed to buy Kenwrights share, so that my friend, is a very weak arguement.

I would like to say, if I was Chairman, I wouldnt lie my arse off to the fans.

 

[DENNIS STEVENS]

If I had the billions & gained control of the club, I'd probably want Kenwright to carry on as the public face of the Board of Directors. However, the messages he was delivering would hopefully be a little more palatable for both him & the rest of the supporters.

 

[McBain]

I cant be Chairman, I dont have the required cashflow needed to buy Kenwrights share, so that my friend, is a very weak arguement.

I would like to say, if I was Chairman, I wouldnt lie my arse off to the fans.

Required Cashflow?

Weak argument?

Just telling you geniuses to pull your heads in.

If you were Chairman Goaty, we'd be screwed anyway.

 

[DENNIS STEVENS]

Required Cashflow?

Weak argument?

Just telling you geniuses to pull your heads in.

If you were Chairman Goaty, we'd be screwed anyway.

what a load of patronising [Poor language removed] - regardless of what you think, people should post their opinions as regards the club freely.

 

[TX Bill]

Required Cashflow?

Weak argument?

Just telling you geniuses to pull your heads in.

If you were Chairman Goaty, we'd be screwed anyway.

Nailed on.

Too many Evertonians think that they know what's better for our club than the people running it.

Pisses me off to be frank.

 

[Goat]

what a load of patronising [Poor language removed] - regardless of what you think, people should post their opinions as regards the club freely.

I cant be chairman, I dont have enough money. So thus your arguement is weak.

Nailed on.

Too many Evertonians think that they know what's better for our club than the people running it.

Pisses me off to be frank.

And the Evertonians that think the club are doing a good job piss me off. I guess thats why forums work, because people have different views.