Holgate Racially Abused By Firmino - The Guardian

[toffeeblue9]

Based on the referee's match report that apparently said that he didn't hear the slur when he was as close as Holgate to Firmino when it was allegedly said. And the lip readers that have spoken out on it.

At the off-camera moment, the ref was in the middle of it and surely would've heard it. The idea that Holgate would make it up to get away with a card is patently absurd, but I think it's unlikely that Firmino could've said the n-word without the ref having heard it too.

Maybe it's just the optimistic lefty in me hoping that we're beyond this [Poor language removed] in the UK in 2018.

You can ignore the lip readers entirely

They can only lip read what they can see and the footage we have access to doesn't show Firmino at the point that Holgate reacts, he is obscured by Kenny's head. Other than telling you what Firmino said in the lead-up to what Holgate was offended by, their observations are useless

As far as the ref is concerned, he clearly tells Holgate after the incident that he didn't hear what Holgate says Firmino said - the footage shows us that the ref is looking away from Firmino at the point Holgate reacts too. Should the ref have heard this? Maybe? Probably? I don't think you can say for certain given there were 50k plus people shouting and a melee going on around him

I do think the most likely scenario is that Holgate has misheard/misunderstood what Firmino said, since a) I choose to believe that the vast majority of people wouldn't use racial abuse in a confrontation and b) I choose to believe that the vast majority of people wouldn't "play the race card" when in the middle of a confrontation

Having said that, I did really believe the Suarez thing would all be a misunderstanding and when I read the transcript of the case, it fairly clearly wasn't

 

[N.S.N.O.]

Great tweet...

 

[Groucho]

In a related topic, I’m quite disappointed with Peter Beardsley.

 

[Toast]

In a related topic, I’m quite disappointed with Peter Beardsley.

A thick geordie footballer ?

Who'd have thunk it.

 

[4737carlin]

In a related topic, I’m quite disappointed with Peter Beardsley.

Can see the headlines "Ex Everton player caught up in race row" ©Daily Mirror

 

[Groucho]

Can see the headlines "Ex Everton player caught up in race row" ©Daily Mirror

Unlike some other sets of fans, you won’t see us making instant excuses.

 

[davek]

He said the N word.

Holgate said he did and that's that for me.

 

[davek]

"Holgate's pushing"
"Holgate misheard him"

...not "Firmino's gutter racism"

....see how these shameful Kopites dominate the debate when your own club doesn't get right in behind their own player at the final whistle.

 

[roydo]

"Holgate's pushing"
"Holgate misheard him"

...not "Firmino's gutter racism"

....see how these shameful Kopites dominate the debate when your own club doesn't get right in behind their own player at the final whistle.

There has hardly been a debate outside of football forums Dave. As there is an FA investigation going on, no one can anything of value anyrate.

 

[davek]

There has hardly been a debate outside of football forums Dave. As there is an FA investigation going on, no one can anything of value anyrate.

The debate such as it is tensds to be about how many games Holgate should get a ban...and others "defendng him" by saying he just misheard Firmino.

It's unreal.

He was called the very worst name a black kid can be called by a racist scumbag but no one is considering that minor detail any more.

The Kopites are masters at turning tables on their accusers.

This club of all clubs knows that and it's why the manager or someone else should have been right into the media supporting their own player and dragging the debate in one direction. If they had no one today would be talking about any one being 'misheard'.

 

[roydo]

The debate such as it is tensds to be about how many games Holgate should get a ban...and others "defendng him" by saying he just misheard Firmino.

It's unreal.

He was called the very worst name a black kid can be called by a racist scumbag but no one is considering that minor detail any more.

The Kopites are masters at turning tables on their accusers.

This club of all clubs knows that and it's why the manager or someone else should have been right into the media supporting their own player and dragging the debate in one direction. If they had no one today would be talking about any one being 'misheard'.

I have had Talksport on all day today and yesterday, and Saturday come to that. Like I said, hardly a mention.

That said, you are right about the RS track record.

 

[DrEFC]

Oh no doubt you'd call witnesses, but is somewhere loud, it's hard to hear what's said unless they're looking directly at you, and almost certainly why it'll go no further, unless you're a dufus and tell your team mates what you said/admit it, like Suarez.

Ha ha- it's an actual phenomenon https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cocktail_party_effect

 

[e.cantona]

 

[RomanReigns]

The debate such as it is tensds to be about how many games Holgate should get a ban...and others "defendng him" by saying he just misheard Firmino.

It's unreal.

He was called the very worst name a black kid can be called by a racist scumbag but no one is considering that minor detail any more.

The Kopites are masters at turning tables on their accusers.

This club of all clubs knows that and it's why the manager or someone else should have been right into the media supporting their own player and dragging the debate in one direction. If they had no one today would be talking about any one being 'misheard'.

As Joyner Lucas said in his song "I'm not racist":-

"The power in the word "N" is a different sin
We shouldn't say it but we do, and that just what it is
But that don't mean that you can say it just 'cause you got N friends
N, that word was originated for you to keep us under
And when we use it, we know that's just how we greet each other
And when you use it, we know there's a double meaning under"

 

[Cels]

Unlike some other sets of fans, you won’t see us making instant excuses.

Apart from the fact that he played for Liverpool and obviously picked up some of their racist ways