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[tsubaki]

What about Grenfell Tower? The treatment of Diane Abbott? Of course there is systematic racism in the UK.

TBF not sure how Grenfell Tower was an example of British racism, so much as an example of British indifference to the poor living / working / being put in obviously dangerous conditions.

There are loads of these of course - Hillsborough, Bradford, Ibrox, Aberfan, most mining disasters etc etc

 

[Hickson9]

But last week it wasn't about them? It was about one man in America , then that anger grew for every man and woman in America affected over decades by this.

So British people including themselves in that is 100% just piggybacking so they don't seem racist.

Because no-one was talking about it until a black man was murdered by police in America.

Why wasn't it important enough a week ago?

But why does that have to be now?

Why didn't anyone have a fight for black UK rights last week? Last month? Last year?

Is it only worth fighting for because another country is fighting for far more?

But why are white people raising this? The past 2 days all I have seen is white people talking about this country. I haven't seen a single person who would be affected by this saying anything, I have however seen them showing their support for America.

It's the pc society , can't convince me otherwise. Have to protest for black UK rights as well so people don't think we are racist. That's literally what this is.

I specifically asked you about black British people saying it is about them.

You, a white British person I presume (?), telling black British people that this isn't also about them, makes you part of the problem.

 

[PhilM]

But last week it wasn't about them? It was about one man in America , then that anger grew for every man and woman in America affected over decades by this.

So British people including themselves in that is 100% just piggybacking so they don't seem racist.

Because no-one was talking about it until a black man was murdered by police in America.

Why wasn't it important enough a week ago?

But why does that have to be now?

Why didn't anyone have a fight for black UK rights last week? Last month? Last year?

Is it only worth fighting for because another country is fighting for far more?

But why are white people raising this? The past 2 days all I have seen is white people talking about this country. I haven't seen a single person who would be affected by this saying anything, I have however seen them showing their support for America.

It's the pc society , can't convince me otherwise. Have to protest for black UK rights as well so people don't think we are racist. That's literally what this is.

You're right, for some people it may be protesting because they feel obliged to or it's part of their social image, but for many it's not. It's a real-life issue.

Even if it is the case where it's misuse which has it's own issues, this shouldn't negate that their is awareness of the issue and the momentum is building.

It's a glib argument saying well why didn't it happen yesterday because it should have. It should do, tomorrow, the next day, the next day.... and so on.

I don't see this as an issue of black vs. white or purely racism: it's discrimination and this is a tip of the ice-berg; however, if it's discussed then it's the start.

If it's solidarity for the US, discussing it here or talking about it abroad (like China) its a start for what will take a long, long time for human society to cleanse itself.

I've saw first hand what bigotry does: sectarian hatred and killings in NI; seeing young men buried in a shallow ditch in Kosovo with bullets in back of their heads.

Talking about racism and bigotry, whatever the reason, shouldn't be criticised; there'll be those who maybe aren't sincere but those who are should be listened to.

 

[Deleted member 48881]

What about the one where he said the protesters should be shot in the leg and not the head?

yeah that was an unfortunate bit

 

[the sniderman]

firstly well done @Prevenger17 on a super head mounting of a fierce competitor in dan. secondly some of u have outed urself and will not be subject to the CRUSH. thirdly it has been a good debate well done @RAFUH for keeping it flowing alone. lastly i truly admire a few of u for supporting the everton yet being completely against everything the club community and people stand for it must take some devotion or complete thick ignorance.

 

[Kenshin]

It’s not an American cause though. It’s about equality for all people of colour.
The ‘well it’s not as bad as in the US’ isn’t a valid argument.
The fact is it exists. It’s something that people have to live with every day.
I don’t see why this can’t be a good time to address the issues in places other than the US. It doesn’t invalidate or diminish that cause. It strengthens it.
What you are saying is that, because we don’t see the scale of police brutality, in the U.K. then we shouldn’t do anything about it. That we should maintain the status quo.
this is an opportunity for people to educate themselves, to challenge themselves, to challenge the status quo, to consider the experience of all people of colour in this country and to do something about it.

Or this is nothing to do with that and everything to do with police racism in America .

Because that's what this is. That's been hijacked with a different agenda (not my words , someone who would be affected by racism said that ) to serve the story of the week for the social media generation.

What about that lad who got killed years ago in the UK? What caused the riots? Where was the black lives matter campaign on this scale then?

There wasn't one.

Why does it have to be turned into something else? Why can't people support the issue instead of turning it into something else that won't be mentioned again in a couple of weeks.

That's the reality of it. This is so important yet it will all just go away soon enough when it's not trendy anymore.

But Americans will still be fighting their case.

What about Grenfell Tower? The treatment of Diane Abbott? Of course there is systematic racism in the UK.

Racism exists everywhere.

Dianne abbot isn't being murdered by police though.

That's what this is about. Police brutality in America that's everything to do with racism there. That's what they are protesting.

I specifically asked you about black British people saying it is about them.

You, a white British person I presume (?), telling black British people that this isn't also about them, makes you part of the problem.

It isn't about them.

It's about police racism in America.

And that is part of the problem. You say I'm part of the problem yet I'm championing supporting America's cause rather than piggy back on top of it. I'm so part of the problem for suggesting that instead of making it about something else that everyone just supports where this all came from.

Yeah I'm part of the problem. For not wanting to dismiss the point of all this rather than ask why noone give a damn about this before.

But you assume my skin colour based on what? Words? You dismiss me because of the colour of my skin that you have assumed. But it's fine or other people with the same colour skin to talk about it? Is that what you are saying? My opinion isn't valid?

What if I was black? Would you give my opinion more weight? After all you don't know if I am, but you are establishing that based on what I think and guessing. So dismissing what I say based on skin colour.

Isn't that racist?

 

[Debunkology]

Thank you for this response,

Well, thank you for your response. A lot better than the usual snide comment that doesn’t contribute anything to the debate (Normally in the form of one sentence).

you have just confirmed to me exactly what you are. This type of response is the modus operandi with people of your ilk who hold these types of objectionable views. I've crossed paths with hundreds of you over the years.

Well thank you. My “modus operandi” when discussing politics is actually talking about real information. Rather than solely attacking others. Although you spelled "Objective" wrong.

Objective:
Not influenced by feelings or opinion and representing facts.

You see, what you are doing is disguising your rhetoric as well researched opinion, hoping people will come in and debate you so that you can keep your little platform going in which to spew your bile and build an audience. You'll never make any of your points or say any of your beliefs directly, but disguise them as other peoples in the form of quotes and links.

The reason I started producing links to actual peer reviewed studies and official statistics from the U.S government. Is because others produced links from the likes of the Washington Post and Huffington post to back up their “claims”.

You see the difference is that I actually read peer reviewed studies and produce an opinion of my own, looks like you've ignored the links I provided, otherwise you wouldn't have wrote what you just did.

I'd rather do that, than be lazy and regurgitate left-leaning (or right-leaning) opinion based biased new’s articles and vomit them out over this echo chamber.

I have no interest of building a platform on here, I have said my views directly. I've been here for years. I'd rather talk about Everton personally. It is amazing though how I simply started on here by disputing a comment. You think I'm trying to build an audience because you know so much about me. Deary me. So much projecting going on here.

And then when people call you out, you go crying about 'civilized debate' and go on about 'critical thinking' (a tactic to undermine the person who is calling you out for what you are) in this case, me.

I see right through you, clear as day.

Attacking people for the information they provide is not "calling someone out". Using this tactic rather than disputing the information itself, is not only unreasonable, but also foolish and childish. All it tells me is that you have NOTHING.

Attack, make accusations, attack, make snide comments *rinse and repeat*

And then you have the nerve to call my rhetoric disgusting?

So, rather than making one sentence attacking me rather than the information. You just made a few paragraphs attacking me rather than the information.

Pathetic.

 

[coollino]

yeah that was an unfortunate bit

You've just got to hope he picks a good VP if he gets in, can't see how he will last long because of his health.

 

[mill]

Or this is nothing to do with that and everything to do with police racism in America .

Because that's what this is. That's been hijacked with a different agenda (not my words , someone who would be affected by racism said that ) to serve the story of the week for the social media generation.

What about that lad who got killed years ago in the UK? What caused the riots? Where was the black lives matter campaign on this scale then?

There wasn't one.

Why does it have to be turned into something else? Why can't people support the issue instead of turning it into something else that won't be mentioned again in a couple of weeks.

That's the reality of it. This is so important yet it will all just go away soon enough when it's not trendy anymore.

But Americans will still be fighting their case.




Racism exists everywhere.

Dianne abbot isn't being murdered by police though.

That's what this is about. Police brutality in America that's everything to do with racism there. That's what they are protesting.




It isn't about them.

It's about police racism in America.

And that is part of the problem. You say I'm part of the problem yet I'm championing supporting America's cause rather than piggy back on top of it. I'm so part of the problem for suggesting that instead of making it about something else that everyone just supports where this all came from.

Yeah I'm part of the problem. For not wanting to dismiss the point of all this rather than ask why noone give a damn about this before.

But you assume my skin colour based on what? Words? You dismiss me because of the colour of my skin that you have assumed. But it's fine or other people with the same colour skin to talk about it? Is that what you are saying? My opinion isn't valid?

What if I was black? Would you give my opinion more weight? After all you don't know if I am, but you are establishing that based on what I think and guessing. So dismissing what I say based on skin colour.

Isn't that racist?

Do you think there is a racism problem in the U.K.? Would you like to do something about it? If so, when? (If not now).

 

[peteblue]

That isn't true though, Pete - if you wish people to read differently in to your posts it may be worth looking in to why so many people see your posts as different to what you intended.

Perhaps... but if you read my original post again, you may well now see it in a slightly different light......

 

[Kenshin]

Do you think there is a racism problem in the U.K.? Would you like to do something about it? If so, when? (If not now).

Everywhere has a racism problem.

However when a country is protesting a specific level of racism that literally involves murder of its own people , I would prefer if people supported that right now

And not do a half arsed white people care agenda that will just go away in a week or two.

Like I say. British people will forget all about this in a week or two. Americans won't. I know which one is the more credible fight to back.

 

[mill]

Everywhere has a racism problem.

However when a country is protesting a specific level of racism that literally involves murder of its own people , I would prefer if people supported that right now

And not do a half arsed white people care agenda that will just go away in a week or two.

Like I say. British people will forget all about this in a week or two. Americans won't. I know which one is the more credible fight to back.

British people of colour will not forget about this in a week or two.

 

[ForeverBlue92]

Or this is nothing to do with that and everything to do with police racism in America .

Because that's what this is. That's been hijacked with a different agenda (not my words , someone who would be affected by racism said that ) to serve the story of the week for the social media generation.

What about that lad who got killed years ago in the UK? What caused the riots? Where was the black lives matter campaign on this scale then?

There wasn't one.

Why does it have to be turned into something else? Why can't people support the issue instead of turning it into something else that won't be mentioned again in a couple of weeks.

That's the reality of it. This is so important yet it will all just go away soon enough when it's not trendy anymore.

But Americans will still be fighting their case.




Racism exists everywhere.

Dianne abbot isn't being murdered by police though.

That's what this is about. Police brutality in America that's everything to do with racism there. That's what they are protesting.




It isn't about them.

It's about police racism in America.

And that is part of the problem. You say I'm part of the problem yet I'm championing supporting America's cause rather than piggy back on top of it. I'm so part of the problem for suggesting that instead of making it about something else that everyone just supports where this all came from.

Yeah I'm part of the problem. For not wanting to dismiss the point of all this rather than ask why noone give a damn about this before.

But you assume my skin colour based on what? Words? You dismiss me because of the colour of my skin that you have assumed. But it's fine or other people with the same colour skin to talk about it? Is that what you are saying? My opinion isn't valid?

What if I was black? Would you give my opinion more weight? After all you don't know if I am, but you are establishing that based on what I think and guessing. So dismissing what I say based on skin colour.

Isn't that racist?

I always find that funny when you supposedly can not have an opinion on anything because you're white.

Like saying women cant have an opinion on suicide because it affects men more.

 

[Hickson9]

It isn't about them.

It's about police racism in America.

And that is part of the problem. You say I'm part of the problem yet I'm championing supporting America's cause rather than piggy back on top of it. I'm so part of the problem for suggesting that instead of making it about something else that everyone just supports where this all came from.

Yeah I'm part of the problem. For not wanting to dismiss the point of all this rather than ask why noone give a damn about this before.

But you assume my skin colour based on what? Words? You dismiss me because of the colour of my skin that you have assumed. But it's fine or other people with the same colour skin to talk about it? Is that what you are saying? My opinion isn't valid?

What if I was black? Would you give my opinion more weight? After all you don't know if I am, but you are establishing that based on what I think and guessing. So dismissing what I say based on skin colour.

Isn't that racist?

The spark for this was racist police brutality in the US. However, the wider movement is about racial inequality, including in the UK.

Cutting through all of your bull, if you're a white British person telling black British people this isn't about them, then you are part of the problem here, in this country.

If you can't grasp this, put yourself in a black person's shoes and imagine a white person telling you that you are wrong to be protesting and should just go home.
And I asked if you were white (?) because the above premise, a white person telling black people they are wrong to be protesting about racism, is part of the problem here in the UK. Also, the vast majority of people on this forum (an Everton forum) will be white.

 

[Moomin]

Why are people protesting UK black rights now in the UK?

THIS ISN'T ABOUT THEM !!!!!!

Jesus why is everything have to be a meme.

People are protesting one particular location on earth for very specific reasons. Why does other people have to piggyback onto it just so they feel like they are joining in?!

Can't the world just join together for one cause without turning it into some online fad that everyone has to be a part of?

Amazing , you seem to be drawn to racial incidents and always have a opinion.

I can smell the white privilege from your posts.