Current Affairs Ukraine
- Thread starter Mutzo Nutzo
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The problem I have with the West is that there's been a total lack of leadership over the past few years. The West has been so busy naval gazing about the environment and all manner of social issues that they've utterly gone to sleep over the rising threat of Russia and potentially China.
Putin should have been slapped down the minute he set foot in Crimea. Dependence on Russian oil has been a known issue for decades and we've known exactly who these oligarchs are when they've been buying property and football clubs for the last 20 years.
I'd be willing to call Putin's bluff on his nuclear threat, nobody wants to rule over a wasteland and, as I've said previously, I'm certain his own side will see him off before the worst could happen. They all enjoy multi million dollar super yachts and property around the Med.
I've changed my tune on air strikes, I was previously non-interventionist and understand the position of Sweden and Finland and their desire to "not poke the bear". The problem is now that the bear is running amok in Europe and has just gored your neighbour in their tent. It's time to put the bear down.
Putin should have been slapped down the minute he set foot in Crimea. Dependence on Russian oil has been a known issue for decades and we've known exactly who these oligarchs are when they've been buying property and football clubs for the last 20 years.
I'd be willing to call Putin's bluff on his nuclear threat, nobody wants to rule over a wasteland and, as I've said previously, I'm certain his own side will see him off before the worst could happen. They all enjoy multi million dollar super yachts and property around the Med.
I've changed my tune on air strikes, I was previously non-interventionist and understand the position of Sweden and Finland and their desire to "not poke the bear". The problem is now that the bear is running amok in Europe and has just gored your neighbour in their tent. It's time to put the bear down.
Yarrgh
Player Valuation: £80m
Big bluff calling that!
Joking apart, the west needs to buck its ideas up with regards to dealing with non-democratic and potentially aggressive nations.
One to not be under their thrall as per Russia and oil; two to ensure they don't get away with aggression to others and 3 that we don't allow their leaders to use us to launder and protect their power and ill gotten loot.
We have enabled Putin to think he can get away with this.
Cool_Blue
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The Russians heads have completely fallen off here, the absolute bo11ocks these spokespeople are coming out with day any day.
Tennessee Blue Mike
Player Valuation: £50m
They are plum crazy that rhetoric won't work on the West. Listen to Medvedev today. We will nuke you if Finland joins NATO. Doesn't he expect two or three coming back at him. Nobody wins.
Again conventionally they are a shambles and will regress even more due to finances losing the trust of the West. They are basically isolated. It will be interesting to see China and India's response in the future.
The problem is, I dont think Putin and Medvedev care if the nukes go the other way, their families will be in a non-nuclear country and they are "safe" underground. MAD is only factor when both sides care about the mutual bit.
roydo
in memoriam - 1965-2024
They might not, but the guys who actually deliver the missiles via the coding most certainly will.
There isnt a red button in a suitcase. Or on a desk.
How do you know?
We assume that Russia "follows" the Western way of making not 1 person in charge of things.
I really doubt thats the case in Russia and also, I would imagine he has people he can trust/rely on in the places that matter.
Im aware that 1 brave Russian saved the world 40 years ago by the way.
roydo
in memoriam - 1965-2024
Well, I dont "know" the internal launch procedures for nukes being lobbed about by Vlad. But I would be 100% sure that if he triggered a launch, the military bods would at least have a chat among themselves. Cos they know the real state of their war in Ukraine.
Hope Im right anyrate.
I doubt he has people in position of power that he hasnt fully brainwashed.
roydo
in memoriam - 1965-2024
Maybe. But they, the military folk, will have seen the same that this thread has shown up, plus tons more.
If Vlad allows one nuke to come over, the response will, at first, be in proportion. Helsinki for Moscow for example. So, would the launch procedure get past that equation, which will be considered, by a chain of command, who (I hope), are reasonably sane?
I think if somebody refuses to "press the button" they will be replaced, after leaving a window, I know this, they know this.
Putin isnt surrounding himself with hippy types, no doubt they all think like him, RUSSIA IS THE BEST.
roydo
in memoriam - 1965-2024
Thats what I am saying mate. It isnt ONE person. (well, I doubt it). They ALL know what the reaction will be, so they would, hopefully, make a decision. Destruction of Moscow, or following a madman.
My point is they wont see it as the destruction of Moscow, they will see it as beating the West.
tsubaki
Player Valuation: £90m
I am not sure about that, at all. There is a great book by a defector called Viktor Suvorov called "Inside the Soviet Army" where he claims (and he would know) that the USSR never understood that American line of thinking of escalation to a conflict - IIRC he describes it like a cowboy fight where one man brings out a pistol, the other man a shotgun, so the first gets a rifle and so on.
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