Current Affairs Ukraine

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Mutzo Nutzo said:
It’s not in context. Your views are biased and not relevant to this thread.

Like I said if you feel strongly about it then create a new thread and post away to your hearts content in there.
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Aren't all our views biased? I actually feel my views are pretty neutral on the whole situation and what I said was completely in context, not sure how you can dispute that, but OK I'm not here to argue about silly stuff or fall out with people. What I've said is my take on things, nothing nasty or hateful. As I said I feel I'm actually taking a neutral anti war stance rather than a biased one as I've lived somewhere affected by war so don't want to see it on a world scale. You don't have to like it and ofc feel free to disagree but even if it triggers you or whatever I'm still allowed to say what I think about a topic without being told to bog off to another forum/ thread.
 
BrendanGOT said:
The only person trying to be "edgy" here is you because of your ego so you've put your bully boy hat on now.

I actually do see the right and wrong don't know why you'd insinuate that I don't. I've never once said I support actions of Putin so how could you come to the conclusion that I don't see right and wrong? I've made it clear that I think Putin is wrong for invading and NATO /USA are wrong for poking the bear then running away to leave Ukrainian people to bare the brunt of it and furthermore prolonging the whole situation by fighting a proxy war through them.

Snake Island /ghost of Ukraine aren't the only propaganda used are they? They're just an obvious debunked example that I pointed out in reference to a post about Russian propaganda regarding their Chechen leader.

The entire unnecessary Russiaphobia going on atm is driven by propaganda/ news/ whatever you want to call it and its wrong. Most Russian people living in the West are against this whole thing as I'm sure many in Russia are too.

Also I'm not sure what you're trying to get at with the Nazi propaganda reference...

I'm anti war as I've said in previous posts and imo the propaganda from our side is to drum up support for going into Russia and starting WW3. As usual politicians starting wars that they won't fight themselves. For example, the whole, "Ukraine is winning, they just need a no fly zone and they could win this" etc etc even though a no fly zone would be considered an act of war by Putin and drag us into WW3.

I grew up in a country riddled with war and violence, I've had family members shot and shot dead and I've seen the British War Machine propaganda used against us, its not hard to spot. I'd innocent family members interned and the propaganda made the UK believe that this was acceptable and justified in the fight against the IRA. The same govt colluded with paramilitaries to kill innocent people so if you don't think our Govts do the same dastardly crap as Putin then yeah you're naive. Look at the USAs recent conquests in the last 30 years alone.

Now people are being convinced that actions that lead to WW3 are acceptable or that, with rising prices due to sanctions, living in abject poverty and cold homes are acceptable ways of life because Ukrainians have it much worse rather than forcing gas companies etc to cut profits for example. Politicians don't give a crap about us or the Ukrainians but they want us to fight and suffer for their wars and a bit of good old patriotism makes everyone forget that.

If we'd strong leaders in the world currently we probably wouldn't even be having this conversation and they'd have worked out a deal with Putin to end this without further bloodshed or escalation to WW3

But anyway I hope in trying to take the Mickey out of me and trying to make me seem stupid has made you and your ego feel better. I'm allowed to have a different perspective on events, I'm not in here preaching hate or pro Russian rubbish I'm just anti war and a realist. I won't apologise for having a different view or for how I feel events will turn out from this.
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That's a long-winded post that I can't really make heads or tails of. I did notice the whataboutery.

Correct me if I'm wrong here: are you saying the Ukraine invasion the USA/NATOs fault? Is that what you are saying regarding your "poking the bear" comment? I'm having trouble discerning the main point because you accuse USA/NATO of "prolonging the whole situation by fighting a proxy war through them" and then also write that "propaganda from our side is to drum up support for going into Russia and starting WW3" Do you think NATO should keep with the proxy war or do you think they should start WW3? I honestly can't make sense of what you are saying, and if you take that to mean I'm "taking the Mickey" out of you, that's on you, not me. What would strong leaders do differently? What kind of deal would they have worked out with Putin?...to give him the Ukraine, to let him keep Crimea?

In any case, all the whinging about my ego (a strange thing to bring up, when you call other posters here "naive") and you boldly proclaiming that you will not apologize, you are "allowed to have a different view", etc., is typical internet boilerplate: no one is censoring you so please get over yourself, and the fact that you are typing here suggests you are free to air your own views. Please carry on.
 
verreauxi said:
That's a long-winded post that I can't really make heads or tails of. I did notice the whataboutery.

Correct me if I'm wrong here: are you saying the Ukraine invasion the USA/NATOs fault? Is that what you are saying regarding your "poking the bear" comment? I'm having trouble discerning the main point because you accuse USA/NATO of "prolonging the whole situation by fighting a proxy war through them" and then also write that "propaganda from our side is to drum up support for going into Russia and starting WW3" Do you think NATO should keep with the proxy war or do you think they should start WW3? I honestly can't make sense of what you are saying, and if you take that to mean I'm "taking the Mickey" out of you, that's on you, not me. What would strong leaders do differently? What kind of deal would they have worked out with Putin?...to give him the Ukraine, to let him keep Crimea?

In any case, all the whinging about my ego (a strange thing to bring up, when you call other posters here "naive") and you boldly proclaiming that you will not apologize, you are "allowed to have a different view", etc., is typical internet boilerplate: no one is censoring you so please get over yourself, and the fact that you are typing here suggests you are free to air your own views. Please carry on.
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OK mate. Not in here to fight with you. Was here to have discussions not egotistical battles of wit. You know my opinion on the situation and you disagree, that's fine, you're not alone on that. Nothing else to really be said about it. I just hope the whole situation gets resolved soon and we don't all end up in WW3 and Ukraine can go back to being an independent country.

Edit: again I don't know if you're acting like you can't understand in attempt to make me look silly but to answer your question - they're fighting a proxy war now because there isn't public/ political support for all out WW3 hence the point of drumming up support for it. Don't know about you but I don't want that.
 
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BrendanGOT said:
Aren't all our views biased? I actually feel my views are pretty neutral on the whole situation and what I said was completely in context, not sure how you can dispute that, but OK I'm not here to argue about silly stuff or fall out with people. What I've said is my take on things, nothing nasty or hateful. As I said I feel I'm actually taking a neutral anti war stance rather than a biased one as I've lived somewhere affected by war so don't want to see it on a world scale. You don't have to like it and ofc feel free to disagree but even if it triggers you or whatever I'm still allowed to say what I think about a topic without being told to bog off to another forum/ thread.
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Sorry I fail to see what your family’s experience in Ireland has got to do with the current situation in Ukraine.
 
Mutzo Nutzo said:
Sorry I fail to see what your family’s experience in Ireland has got to do with the current situation in Ukraine.
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It was in reference to how propaganda is used by Govts which is currently happening now. So yes its relevant imo. You're also picking out one tiny part of the original post, the bulk of it was firmly about Ukraine and Russia.
 
BrendanGOT said:
It was in reference to how propaganda is used by Govts which is currently happening now. So yes its relevant imo. You're also picking out one tiny part of the original post, the bulk of it was firmly about Ukraine and Russia.
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I don’t see that. This war is at the mercy of open source intelligence. It’s being fought with smartphones and laptops as well as tanks and missiles.

You just have to know the legit sources of OSINT as opposed to the non-legit stuff.

The daily defence intelligence brief along with the daily pentagon briefs are good sources of govt updates. They don’t sensationalise nor can they be identified as propaganda.

I use these sources and correlate them with other respectable OSINT outlets to provide me with a balanced view.

Stay away from MSM as it’s generally re-hashed and sensationalised - but I’m sure you know that already.
 
BrendanGOT said:
OK mate. Not in here to fight with you. Was here to have discussions not egotistical battles of wit. You know my opinion on the situation and you disagree, that's fine, you're not alone on that. Nothing else to really be said about it. I just hope the whole situation gets resolved soon and we don't all end up in WW3 and Ukraine can go back to being an independent country.

Edit: again I don't know if you're acting like you can't understand in attempt to make me look silly but to answer your question - they're fighting a proxy war now because there isn't public/ political support for all out WW3 hence the point of drumming up support for it. Don't know about you but I don't want that.
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This is such bollox
 
Mutzo Nutzo said:
I don’t see that. This war is at the mercy of open source intelligence. It’s being fought with smartphones and laptops as well as tanks and missiles.

You just have to know the legit sources of OSINT as opposed to the non-legit stuff.

The daily defence intelligence brief along with the daily pentagon briefs are good sources of govt updates. They don’t sensationalise nor can they be identified as propaganda.

I use these sources and correlate them with other respectable OSINT outlets to provide me with a balanced view.

Stay away from MSM as it’s generally re-hashed and sensationalised - but I’m sure you know that already.
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Thanks for the info mate and fair enough. Imo what I see mainly from MSM atm is intelligence agencies /Govts feeding stories to bang the war drum tbh and its sad. The world doesn't need WW3 after 2 years of a pandemic. Not only will we have battlefield deaths but we could be looking at a complete economy crash on the back of this.

Putins completely in the wrong but it can be settled in other ways and Ukraine can keep their sovereignty. Maybe that requires giving in to Putin and recognising the Donbass Republics, those people mostly consider themselves Russian anyway, but surely that's better than the alternative. Then take it from there diplomaticly. Everyone just needs to take a step back on both sides as every action I've seen taken so far has caused further escalation.
 

atomized bomb​

The social disunity of Russian society is worse than a nuclear war​


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BrendanGOT said:
Thanks for the info mate and fair enough. Imo what I see mainly from MSM atm is intelligence agencies /Govts feeding stories to bang the war drum tbh and its sad. The world doesn't need WW3 after 2 years of a pandemic. Not only will we have battlefield deaths but we could be looking at a complete economy crash on the back of this.

Putins completely in the wrong but it can be settled in other ways and Ukraine can keep their sovereignty. Maybe that requires giving in to Putin and recognising the Donbass Republics, those people mostly consider themselves Russian anyway, but surely that's better than the alternative. Then take it from there diplomaticly. Everyone just needs to take a step back on both sides as every action I've seen taken so far has caused further escalation.
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Fact is we are very, very close to WWIII. If Ukraine gives in to Putin’s demands now then he won’t stop there, he’ll take transanistra then he’ll come back for the Baltic states.

He wants confrontation with NATO, he wants WWIII. He’s really disturbed and dangerous.

The US and U.K/NATO do not want WWIII but are happy to watch Putin blunt his knife on Ukraine, to watch his army / Air Force collapse and degrade. So will continue to supply weapons, ammo, meds and intelligence to assist Ukraine.

The longer Ukraine holds out and the more it degrades Russias military then the better the deal they will be able to negotiate.

War is [Poor language removed] but Ukraine is fighting now for its future - they need to stay strong and the US, U.K. and the world need to keep supplying them.
 
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