Current Affairs Ukraine

[JammyP]

And there it is.
Why do you think Russia is at war?
When NATO is in Ukraine, its either nuclear war or Russia will be gone.
Why do people think the West has a right to take over the world and its resources for its own means and gains.
You might be warm in your bed bc of Ukraine gas has been taken by NATO but we'll have rendered a poor region of the world much much poorer still. But sure that's what the West has done for many centuries to acquire the wealth and resources it has now.
But we are better than them, right?
Are we back at the Crusades.
Has anyone thought through the consequences of when Eastern Russia and Western US are bridged through NATO. One endless NATO across the world.
When the West has run out of dissent from Russia and China, internally the same people, the same human nature that got us there will turn on the dissent of its own 'people'.

If Ukraine, a sovereign state, wants to join NATO, that is a decision for them. NATO has no interest in invading Russia. Russia has invaded Ukraine.

By your logic, if Russia absorbs Ukraine, so Russia borders NATO in Poland, there will be no option but nuclear war.

The clearest possible confirmation you are spouting tendentious crap about most of this is that Kev agrees with you.

 

[BlueToff]

To be fair to @Kev The Rat , I am of the understanding that Zelenskyy has done something along the lines of those accusations. Apparently when UKR first asked about joining NATO, they were told quite firmly that the corruption in UKR was a barrier to membership.

I have now seen the evidence @Kev The Rat was referring to. But I also did say a few days ago now from what I knew about VZ I wasn't exactly comfortable with him being hero-worshipped.

But it doesn't equate to him being in the wrong here, which is kind of the point that was insinuated

 

[Tree13]

And there it is.
Why do you think Russia is at war?
When NATO is in Ukraine, its either nuclear war or Russia will be gone.
Why do people think the West has a right to take over the world and its resources for its own means and gains.
You might be warm in your bed bc of Ukraine gas has been taken by NATO but we'll have rendered a poor region of the world much much poorer still. But sure that's what the West has done for many centuries to acquire the wealth and resources it has now.
But we are better than them, right?
Are we back at the Crusades.
Has anyone thought through the consequences of when Eastern Russia and Western US are bridged through NATO. One endless NATO across the world.
When the West has run out of dissent from Russia and China, internally the same people, the same human nature that got us there will turn on the dissent of its own 'people'.

Except that NONE of the oil or gas issues have ever been cited as a concern by Putin.

It's persecution of Russians in the Donbass.

No, actually it's NATO nuclear weapons in Ukraine.

No, sorry, it's a US-led coup in 2014 bringing down a Russia-friendly government.

No, I meant it's neo-nazis in power. Neo-nazis led by a Jew, no less.

Now Russia, the world's biggest producer and exporter of gas, is going to be starved and frozen to death by Ukraine producing slightly more gas than Australia?

Sod off back to Russia you loon. It is Putin's greed, plain and simple.

 

[Tree13]

I have now seen the evidence @Kev The Rat was referring to. But I also did say a few days ago now from what I knew about VZ I wasn't exactly comfortable with him being hero-worshipped.

But it doesn't equate to him being in the wrong here, which is kind of the point that was insinuated

I believe it's clear that I fundamentally disagree with Kev's warped agenda!

The mad thing is that any prior justifiable criticism of Zelenskyy will be completely drowned out by his elevation to war-hero status. And who's gifted him that status? Putin, the absolute spud puffin.

 

[Tree13]

I think there is a rational reason Russia/Putin have done it. This video explains a couple possible reasons that I had not considered before:


Dismissing it as the actions of a madman only blinds you to look in the short term.

Good video, that.

 

[Tree13]

And the little known Kevratland apparently!

12.

I'm possibly losing count.

 

[bcblue1878]

12.

I'm possibly losing count.

I was no’ 4 ?!

 

[DanEFC92]

 

[Kev The Rat]

Facebook Announces ‘Narrow Exception’ for Previously Censored Neo-Nazi ‘Azov Battalion’.

thenationalpulse.com

For Facebook the ends justifies the means. But for the Azov battalion, most of them are probably already dead, and the rest are experiencing a little of what it must of been like for the Germans at Stalingrad.

 

[Tree13]

Zero chance of 7,000 dead after 7 days - they’d be in full retreat if that was the case

No they wouldn't.

Soviet military doctrine is based on attritional capacity "we have so many more troops than you we can afford to keep losing them - you'll run out before we do." Look at practically every Soviet military operation from Stalingrad onwards. Look at post-Soviet Russian operations in Afghanistan, Chechnya, take your pick.

Ukraine has a total population of 45m - at least it did before Putin started murdering them - and Russia has 25m men of military service-eligible age... Plus conscription.

Russia wants the gas and oil, and deployed troops it is perfectly happy to sacrifice in order to take control of the gas and oil. If Putin loses 100,000 troops to kill 100,000 Ukrainian soldiers, he'll have destroyed 50% of the UKR military for the cost of maybe 10% of his own. But his pool of potential conscripts is far larger and his crushing control of state media means he can draw drops from various parts of Russia and no-one inside the country would ever see the bigger picture.

He's not withdrawing in the face of 10,000 or 20,000 Russian casualties. Not a chance.

 

[coollino]

76

 

[Spadge Vernacular]

And there it is.
Why do you think Russia is at war?
When NATO is in Ukraine, its either nuclear war or Russia will be gone.
Why do people think the West has a right to take over the world and its resources for its own means and gains.
You might be warm in your bed bc of Ukraine gas has been taken by NATO but we'll have rendered a poor region of the world much much poorer still. But sure that's what the West has done for many centuries to acquire the wealth and resources it has now.
But we are better than them, right?
Are we back at the Crusades.
Has anyone thought through the consequences of when Eastern Russia and Western US are bridged through NATO. One endless NATO across the world.
When the West has run out of dissent from Russia and China, internally the same people, the same human nature that got us there will turn on the dissent of its own 'people'.

That is quite a lot of hot air, mate.

 

[Lobster Johnson]

I was no’ 4 ?!

Can we get shirts like with squad numbers?

 

[Blue Roo]

If Ukraine, a sovereign state, wants to join NATO, that is a decision for them. NATO has no interest in invading Russia. Russia has invaded Ukraine.

By your logic, if Russia absorbs Ukraine, so Russia borders NATO in Poland, there will be no option but nuclear war.

The clearest possible confirmation you are spouting tendentious crap about most of this is that Kev agrees with you.

I'll just stick to the two facts you stated. The rest is pile.
'NATO has no interest in invading Russian' - they don't need to, they have the markets to do that.
'Russia invaded Ukraine- yes

 

[Tree13]

Is the neighbour thing significant. Keep seeing that. Is it different when it's your neighbour when you invade?

In the context of explaining why your neighbour (Ukraine) is scared of you, given that during your previous period of occupation you murdered almost four million people by deliberately engineering a famine (Holodomor, 1932 - 1933) ? Some might say yes.

It might also explain why your neighbour wants to join the neighborhood watch (NATO), making it more of a paradox for you to say "You mustn't join the neighborhood watch. I am your friend. If you join the neighborhood watch I will break into your house, beat your family and destroy all your possessions before stealing all your oil and gas"... and then doing it anyway.