Current Affairs Ukraine

[ramacca]

I doubt that argument is going to impress the 'holdout Republicans'.

I know that says the beneficiaries are some red states like Texas and Alabama, but where's the incentive for the Republicans to hand a foreign policy victory for Biden or to see his administration expand the industrial economy going into an election year?

The electioneering has started in earnest. The Democrat warmongers are using the patriotic, 'boost US industry' card to firstly, keep the warmongering going in Ukraine and secondly, 'its the economy stupid' that wins elections. The US economy is floundering and it wants a Keynesian boost-pump public money into industry to counter the growing sense by some Americans to 'spend at home'. Which leads to questioning the US Empire's proxy war in Ukraine.

 

[ramacca]

West centric, benefits and losses, view of the world from Haley.

 

[davek]

The electioneering has started in earnest. The Democrat warmongers are using the patriotic, 'boost US industry' card to firstly, keep the warmongering going in Ukraine and secondly, 'its the economy stupid' that wins elections. The US economy is floundering and it wants a Keynesian boost-pump public money into industry to counter the growing sense by some Americans to 'spend at home'. Which leads to questioning the US Empire's proxy war in Ukraine.

In reality what would the benefits to swing states be? And if it's substantial enough to get Biden a boost then why would Republicans help this package through Congress?

 

[davek]

The benefit goes entirely to red states like Arkansas that Biden always loses.

It turns out (I have proved this with data) that DoD, at least under Cheney/Rumsfeld, does care about consequences for voters. It also only cares in battleground states like Pennsylvania and Florida. If you're from someplace like Arkansas or Wyoming, you can go hang so long as the Republicans are in power. I doubt the Democrats holding the presidency changes that calculus.

The report stats that swing states like Arizona, Pennsylvania and Nevada benefit too.

 

[Spadge Vernacular]

 

[Spadge Vernacular]

Imagine supporter the war criminal empower Putin, the fiend directly responsible for creating the situations described here.

Only a subhuman scumbag would be in support of Putin.

 

[davek]

Wow...it's come to this?

 

[Martin Alvito]

The report stats that swing states like Arizona, Pennsylvania and Nevada benefit too.

I point blank do not buy your claim. Munitions production happens in very red states. Swing states at best feel that process tangentially.

If I'm wrong here, prove it. I do realize that Pennsylvania does have the artillery production plant up near Scranton, but I will still tell you that it's an anomaly as far as the statistics are concerned.

 

[davek]

I point blank do not buy your claim. Munitions production happens in very red states. Swing states at best feel that process tangentially.

If I'm wrong here, prove it. I do realize that Pennsylvania does have the artillery production plant up near Scranton, but I will still tell you that it's an anomaly as far as the statistics are concerned.

They're not my claims, it's stated in that report...did you not read it?

"Patriot missiles for air defense batteries, made in Arizona. Artillery shells manufactured in 12 states across the country, in Pennsylvania, Ohio..."

 

[Spadge Vernacular]

What a heroic woman. Ultimately she is fighting for countries freedom but she is also putting her life on the line for all of the Democratic west. The Russia, Iran, North Korea axis with the support of China would see all of the hard fought for freedoms that we enjoy removed, and their dictatorial boots put upon the throats of all across the world if allowed.

 

[Martin Alvito]

They're not my claims, it's stated in that report...did you not read it?

"Patriot missiles for air defense batteries, made in Arizona. Artillery shells manufactured in 12 states across the country, in Pennsylvania, Ohio..."

It would appear that you think Patriot missiles matter to the bottom line.

They might in the sense that Jon Hamm can convince you they do. They are also a tiny sliver of what is spent.

Reality is that what we spend is mostly dumped into the cheap labor states, in much the same way that American cars are assembled by parts built elsewhere, usually in another cheap labor state.

 

[davek]

It would appear that you think Patriot missiles matter to the bottom line.

They might in the sense that Jon Hamm can convince you they do. They are also a tiny sliver of what is spent.

Reality is that what we spend is mostly dumped into the cheap labor states, in much the same way that American cars are assembled by parts built elsewhere, usually in another cheap labor state.

*sigh*

 

[Martin Alvito]

*sigh*

It is fair to state that if we cannot agree on the facts, we cannot have a conversation.

I am grateful that you are pointing this out at the start, rather than after two decades of marriage. /respect

 

[ramacca]

In reality what would the benefits to swing states be? And if it's substantial enough to get Biden a boost then why would Republicans help this package through Congress?

You're right about why would the Republicans get it through Congress. But there's splits and political paralysis in the US. The Empire's hegonomy is crumbling, and it has become a pariah state over Palestine, which is causing further paralysis. The Global South won't follow the US over sanctions against Russia, it's lost that area for influence. This is further compounded by Palestine, greater making it a pariah state, again leading to splits and paralysis. Warmongering is the name of the game and I think the warmongering Republicans what that more than anything. Hence, Pence throwing in the towel is significant. The survival of the US Empire is more important to the political class than party politics. Because isn't the US party politics all about the US Empire's interests in the world.

There are those saying ditch Ukraine and solely concentrate on Palestine because they know they can't fight on two fronts. Others are saying no, we need three front fight Russia, China Iran. Russia they'be got proxies to do it, so no US body bags. China, they're busy trying to get an alliance going to do the dirty work, Australia, South Korea and Japan and others, to take on China. Still no US body bags. Iran is the real goal around the Palestine issue for the US. The colonial occupiers are their proxy warmongers and have always been. But, it's not looking good for their proxies in Israel as the Arab and Muslim world have become inflamed. The Vietnam syndrome kicks in and it resulted in US further direct involvement, after the French lost the will to fight because they had other issues to deal with. The US will be forced to get further involved, than the military sdvisors already in Palestine, if it's start to goes belly up for Netanyahu.

Ukraine is dispensable for the US Empire. There are bigger issues to deal with. Palestine being the immediate troubling issue for them.

 

[Spadge Vernacular]

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