Current Affairs Ukraine

[Spadge Vernacular]

 

[LinekersLegs]

Well his explanation seems reasonable: he did what he did to prevent a probable escalation that would have threatened everyone. Destroying the Black Sea fleet would have been catastrophic and not what the US Government would have wanted for sure. I think (for once) he's made a good call. And I bet the US Government thought so too...maybe they even advised it. You and I and everyone else dont want to know what happened next in that eventuality. It's too frightening to ponder.

But underlying this attack on Musk is what the Ukraine see as Moscow use of Twitter to spread their message. That's at the heart of this. Beyond social media sites like Twitter / X there is no influence for Russia. That's front and centre here.

Oh and just for a follow up.

Why are you believing Musk when he says this?

Elon Musk sabotaged Ukrainian attack on Russian fleet in Crimea by turning off Starlink, new book says

Top Russian official praises Musk’s move to shut down Starlink during Ukraine’s strike attempt.

www.politico.eu

Isaacson writes that Musk reportedly panicked when he heard about the planned Ukrainian attack, which was using Starlink satellites to guide six drones packed with explosives towards the Crimea coast. After speaking to the Russian ambassador to the United States — who reportedly told him an attack on Crimea would trigger a nuclear response — Musk took matters into his own hands and ordered his engineers to turn off Starlink coverage “within 100 kilometers of the Crimean coast.”

Which do you think more likely
a) the Russian official that he talked to warned that an attack would lead to nuclear war
b) the Russian official that he talked to warned that an attack supported by Starlink would mean they would shoot down Musk's satellites?

Now obviously the second would be an escalation, and a particularly bad one for Musk along with Ukraine, but it seems to me to be a far more likely (and proportional) response to an attack on the Black Sea fleet than nuclear war.

Rather than single handedly trying to save the world from nuclear destruction perhaps Musk is just protecting his financial investment?

 

[Noisy noise annoys]

Well his explanation seems reasonable: he did what he did to prevent a probable escalation that would have threatened everyone. Destroying the Black Sea fleet would have been catastrophic and not what the US Government would have wanted for sure. I think (for once) he's made a good call. And I bet the US Government thought so too...maybe they even advised it. You and I and everyone else dont want to know what happened next in that eventuality. It's too frightening to ponder.

But underlying this attack on Musk is what the Ukraine see as Moscow use of Twitter to spread their message. That's at the heart of this. Beyond social media sites like Twitter / X there is no influence for Russia. That's front and centre here.

Just as if the massive ego-headed wimp thought for one second about this

Some of you well and truly have your head up your arses

 

[Noisy noise annoys]

Oh look, musk helping save the world again:

https://edition.cnn.com/2022/10/13/politics/elon-musk-spacex-starlink-ukraine/index.html

 

[davek]

Oh and just for a follow up.

Why are you believing Musk when he says this?

Elon Musk sabotaged Ukrainian attack on Russian fleet in Crimea by turning off Starlink, new book says

Top Russian official praises Musk’s move to shut down Starlink during Ukraine’s strike attempt.

www.politico.eu

Which do you think more likely
a) the Russian official that he talked to warned that an attack would lead to nuclear war
b) the Russian official that he talked to warned that an attack supported by Starlink would mean they would shoot down Musk's satellites?

Now obviously the second would be an escalation, and a particularly bad one for Musk along with Ukraine, but it seems to me to be a far more likely (and proportional) response to an attack on the Black Sea fleet than nuclear war.

Rather than single handedly trying to save the world from nuclear destruction perhaps Musk is just protecting his financial investment?

As I said to you before, the Ukraininas have Twitter in their sights really. That's a bug bear for them because it hands Russian invasion supporters and the Russian state a platform it's denied elsewhere.

The Ukrainian top brass are blaming just about anything and everyone for the failure of the counter offensive.

That's what we're seeing here.

 

[LinekersLegs]

As I said to you before, the Ukraininas have Twitter in their sights really. That's a bug bear for them because it hands Russian invasion supporters and the Russian state a platform it's denied elsewhere.

The Ukrainian top brass are blaming just about anything and everyone for the failure of the counter offensive.

That's what we're seeing here.

Err none of that addresses the point I was making - do you truly believe Musk when he claims his reasoning was to stave off nuclear war?

 

[davek]

Kyiv have let their own fighting men down badly.

 

[Rita_Poon]

View attachment 226692


Kyiv have let their own fighting men down badly.

who else's fighting men could they have let down? just out of curiosity....

 

[davek]

Err none of that addresses the point I was making - do you truly believe Musk when he claims his reasoning was to stave off nuclear war?

He didn't say nuclear war, he said escalation. His biographer claimed it was to avert nuclear war.

And one thing Musk is right on: it's not his job to facilitate military operations by nation states and hand them satellite internet services to sink war ships.

Imagine believing it is.

 

[davek]

who else's fighting men could they have let down? just out of curiosity....

Quite.

 

[Wizard]

He didn't say nuclear war, he said escalation. His biographer claimed it was to avert nuclear war.

And one thing Musk is right on: it's not his job to facilitate military operations by nation states and hand them satellite internet services to sink war ships.

Imagine believing it is.

He can’t have it both ways. He made a huge deal of how great it was that Starlink was helping Ukraine. He can’t then just switch it off. If he’s worried about it creating problems he shouldn’t have offered it in the first place. As usual with him he blunders into these situations and once things get real he runs away and blames it on other people.

 

[peteblue]

It does not seem reasonable at all to me.


Backing down to Putin’s threats only seem to lead to more escalation, not less.


You even saw it with the coup attempt, when under pressure Putin deals but when he feels safe he retaliates.

Those black sea boats are responsible for huge civilian casualties, this isn’t just about messaging.

Absolutely and Musk should be made to suffer for this.….

 

[LinekersLegs]

He didn't say nuclear war, he said escalation. His biographer claimed it was to avert nuclear war.

And one thing Musk is right on: it's not his job to facilitate military operations by nation states and hand them satellite internet services to sink war ships.

Imagine believing it is.

You also were strongly hinting at that

Well his explanation seems reasonable: he did what he did to prevent a probable escalation that would have threatened everyone. Destroying the Black Sea fleet would have been catastrophic and not what the US Government would have wanted for sure. I think (for once) he's made a good call. And I bet the US Government thought so too...maybe they even advised it. You and I and everyone else dont want to know what happened next in that eventuality. It's too frightening to ponder.

Sink the Black Sea fleet and that would have seen a major continental incident. There's absolutely no way Russia would have not retaliated in a major way. Theyld have seen NATO finger prints all over it and escalated beyond what we've seen so far. A 'coup' by a war lord who immediatley bent the knee does not come under the same level of provocation as sinking the Russian fleet.

I'll speak for myself then: there's no way I want this country dragged into an un-winnable war that threatens all of us with annihilation.

Satellites are going to be used to facilitate military operations by nation states, all communication systems have been used for that purpose throughout history.
World War One: How radio crackled into life in conflict http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-27894944

If you don’t want to get into that line of work you don’t have to, nobody forced Musk.

 

[LinekersLegs]

Absolutely and Musk should be made to suffer for this.….

If he can do it to Ukraine he can do it to the US too. I fully expect there will be hearings in congress about whether one man’s control of satellite systems is a danger to national security.

 

[Wizard]

If he can do it to Ukraine he can do it to the US too. I fully expect there will be hearings in congress about whether one man’s control of satellite systems is a danger to national security.

It is a massive danger. I’m amazed he is allowed to keep on firing so many of these things into space. SpaceX have made a huge leap in terms of reusable rockets for sure and that is amazing for us exploring the Solar System. But Starlink is littering the sky with these satellites and we have no idea what amount of information they are mining. And as we now know he has the ability to change the course of a major war by shutting them off at will.