The Moyes influence on Everton.

[Mikey_Fitzgerald]

You know what we should have all saved are time and money that day stayed at home and just gave Chelsea the cup,they were that good .
might as well have as it turned out .

You could have said the same in 1995 though

Turning out against a Man United side full of pish and vinegar having just lost the league to Blackburn

Difference is that we sneaked a goal that day and managed to hold on

Some go for you and some go against you

 

[Saint Domingo]

So your telling me ,you along with every other person in the ground couldnt see them doubling up on Hibbert from the first ten minutes, what did he do about it?
The answer was nothing ,
Just because Chelsea were a good team dosnt mean they were bound to win,look at wigan and a loads of others that have done it agaist so called better teams.
simple fact is he hasnt won a thing anywhere , won on pens agaist Man Unt Reserves and thats it in big games.,unless he goes to scotland or some league like that he never will.

Doubled up on Hibbert? Ha ha is this some sort of tactics for beginners? Do you think Hiddink thought 'I know I'll ask Cole and Malouda to target Hibbert'? We got dragged around all over the pitch that day as we had wide players in Osman and Pienaar who liked to cut inside. They had pace and strength all over the pitch and had just a week before dominated probably one of the best Barcelona sides of all time. We were missing Jags Arteta and Yakubu. Who was Moyes to bring on to deal with how quickly Chelsea moved the ball considering his bench consisted of the likes of 17 year old Rodwell and Lars Jacobsen?

They were just better, get over it. The same way a far poorer City side were still a lot better than Wigan but Aguero forgot his shooting boots. They could have won that game 5-0. We had Lampard curling them in from 30 yards though.

The cup final performance and Moyes' handling of Barkley along with 'football dinosaur', are the three most annoying revisionist myths about Moyes. There's lots to justifiably criticise Moyes for but those three are ridiculous.

 

[Saint Domingo]

The biggest difference between Martinez and Moyes is that poor performances from a Martinez team will result from an attempt to open up teams and subsequently get punished; poor performances from Moyes' teams resulted from the decision by the manager to stifle the game, keep it tight and react to the opposition rather than engage them.

Another myth. We didn't attempt to open up anyone last season we just went out pretended to do some possession training drills in our own half under no pressure whatsoever then booted it long after a while because we were so bad at it. Three holding mids, strikers on the wing and mindless possession all to try and make sure we didn't lose. It was KITAP1 with a load of Martinez baloney on top to distract everyone. The football this season and 13/14 was positive. Last season was as cautious, negative, reactive, pragmatic, rigid as anything Moyes served up which is probably why we got the league position to reflect it.

 

[Woolly Blue]

Some good stuff in here and I can't really add much to it, but will pipe up anyway.

I don't think I'll ever fully forgive him for the way he left the club, but can't deny he brought us back from the brink and laid some very good foundations.

He just wasn't able to take us any further and Martinez is the sort of manager who might be able to build on what Moyes did, rather than just deliver more of the same.

 

[Mikey_Fitzgerald]

Doubled up on Hibbert? Ha ha is this some sort of tactics for beginners? Do you think Hiddink thought 'I know I'll ask Cole and Malouda to target Hibbert'? We got dragged around all over the pitch that day as we had wide players in Osman and Pienaar who liked to cut inside. They had pace and strength all over the pitch and had just a week before dominated probably one of the best Barcelona sides of all time. We were missing Jags Arteta and Yakubu. Who was Moyes to bring on to deal with how quickly Chelsea moved the ball considering his bench consisted of the likes of 17 year old Rodwell and Lars Jacobsen?

They were just better, get over it. The same way a far poorer City side were still a lot better than Wigan but Aguero forgot his shooting boots. They could have won that game 5-0. We had Lampard curling them in from 30 yards though.

The cup final performance and Moyes' handling of Barkley along with 'football dinosaur', are the three most annoying revisionist myths about Moyes. There's lots to justifiably criticise Moyes for but those three are ridiculous.

I must challenge you on the Barkley front

The other two I'll give you, but I think Moyes handled Barkley horribly

Sent him on loan to Leeds but basically told Warnock not to do anything with him

Barkley then comes back and plays a blinder against Arsenal at The Emirates but is dropped to the bench against Southampton and then isn't even in the squad for the game with Liverpool at Anfield.

Moyes had the "attitude problems" brand all ready and primed to sear Ross for good before Martinez came in and essentially rescued him

Some knocks against Moyes are unfair, and even fatuous, but IMO the one about Barkley is bang on the money

 

[Joey66]

I feel the only time DM side looked like a football team was the Alan Irvine at no 2 era - it started the Baines - SP partnership - why he sent Shamus Coleman out on loan to me was a mystery when Hibbert was struggling with form - please remember DM had more likers than haters - completely the other way around when Gordon Lee had the club who in my opinion was a better Manager, He was the nearly man he left with dignity too, and now fans realise he was far better than they thought - DM seemed to blot his copy book the way he left - you also would have to ask would Ross and Stones have got their chances playing most weeks so early under DM????
Also would he have held on to Stones?
If you read Osman's book he treated the players unfair , but was a bit of a con man with young players, when handing contracts out!
Don't forget the Rooney saga sold far to cheaply!
Dithering Dave was a good name for him IMO!

 

[Joey66]

Better than Smith and Walker, worse than Royle or Martinez

No Complements there then!lol

 

[Joey66]

To begin with yes, but towards his final few seasons we did play good football.

60% was hoof!

 

[Joey66]

Lack of finance doesn't impose restrictions on progressive ideas on how to play football.

The myth DM was given Finance - James Beattie - The YAK - Simon Davis -Billy - all a waste of space bar the Yak!

 

[Saint Domingo]

I must challenge you on the Barkley front

The other two I'll give you, but I think Moyes handled Barkley horribly

Sent him on loan to Leeds but basically told Warnock not to do anything with him

Barkley then comes back and plays a blinder against Arsenal at The Emirates but is dropped to the bench against Southampton and then isn't even in the squad for the game with Liverpool at Anfield.

Moyes had the "attitude problems" brand all ready and primed to sear Ross for good before Martinez came in and essentially rescued him

Some knocks against Moyes are unfair, and even fatuous, but IMO the one about Barkley is bang on the money

In my mind Ross is only just now showing the type of form that demands his inclusion in the first 11. Martinez had him in the side for the last two years when he was doing 1, 2 assists per season despite playing at number 10 nearly every game? Last season he was awful. I respect Martinez's choice for doing that because he is now reaping the benefit bit are you seriously saying Moyes should have been doing this two years earlier? Ross was a precocious 17 year old but he was all over the show. Moyes gave him his debut, got him loan deals, played him away at top grounds in his best position, all of this whilst running a top 6 side which already had a very strong midfield. What other manager in the same position was letting erratic 17 year olds start in big away games at the top 4? None.

As ever with young players though once impatient fans see that first bit of quality they are ready to jump on anyone who holds them back even for their own good. I stand by Moyes' handling of Barkley, the hype in 13/14 was ridiculous as it was so exposing a 17 year old to that would have been stupid. He simply wasn't that good 4 years ago sorry, he wasn't good enough 1 year ago.

 

[davids]

I'll sit on the fence until RM has fulfilled his promise and has us in the CL and a win at Anfield and a Wembley visit would be nice,it's easy to criticise Moyes,he played Neville too often (Gareth Barry until the last few games?) his teams bottled the big occasion (our run in for a CL place, RM's debut season?) It's very easy to forget some of the really good performances his teams produced.

 

[Joey66]

In my mind Ross is only just now showing the type of form that demands his inclusion in the first 11. Martinez had him in the side for the last two years when he was doing 1, 2 assists per season despite playing at number 10 nearly every game? Last season he was awful. I respect Martinez's choice for doing that because he is now reaping the benefit bit are you seriously saying Moyes should have been doing this two years earlier? Ross was a precocious 17 year old but he was all over the show. Moyes gave him his debut, got him loan deals, played him away at top grounds in his best position, all of this whilst running a top 6 side which already had a very strong midfield. What other manager in the same position was letting erratic 17 year olds start in big away games at the top 4? None.

As ever with young players though once impatient fans see that first bit of quality they are ready to jump on anyone who holds them back even for their own good. I stand by Moyes' handling of Barkley, the hype in 13/14 was ridiculous as it was so exposing a 17 year old to that would have been stupid. He simply wasn't that good 4 years ago sorry, he wasn't good enough 1 year ago.

Ross broke his leg in two places that held him back, but one mistake away at Blackburn Rovers banished form the team yet the oldies stunk the place out picked every week, players he played on the wing Jack Rodwell. Ross Barkley, Wayne Rooney, Osman, Stephen Naismith, and ?
he did put square pegs in round holes sometimes for a long period naismith is a perfect example under RM looks a diferent player disregarding his hat trick on Sat!

 

[davek]

Another myth. We didn't attempt to open up anyone last season we just went out pretended to do some possession training drills in our own half under no pressure whatsoever then booted it long after a while because we were so bad at it. Three holding mids, strikers on the wing and mindless possession all to try and make sure we didn't lose. It was KITAP1 with a load of Martinez baloney on top to distract everyone. The football this season and 13/14 was positive. Last season was as cautious, negative, reactive, pragmatic, rigid as anything Moyes served up which is probably why we got the league position to reflect it.

Pace, pace, pace. That was what was lacking (in the PL at least, or for most of it) last season. To say we didn't go out and try to control every game we went into is ridiculous. It's the only way Martinez knows how to play.

 

[sageyefc]

Ross broke his leg in two places that held him back, but one mistake away at Blackburn Rovers banished form the team yet the oldies stunk the place out picked every week, players he played on the wing Jack Rodwell. Ross Barkley, Wayne Rooney, Osman, Stephen Naismith, and ?
he did put square pegs in round holes sometimes for a long period naismith is a perfect example under RM looks a diferent player disregarding his hat trick on Sat!

Ross had been our best playe til that one mistake, was harsh to banish him after that imo

 

[davek]

The myth DM was given Finance - James Beattie - The YAK - Simon Davis -Billy - all a waste of space bar the Yak!

Broke the record transfer fee on a few occasions. Apart from Fellaini he was awful at spending big amounts of cash. Which is why the 'I reckon Moyes would have broken through with this level of cash to spend now' arguments ring a little hollow.