Current Affairs The Labour Party

[johnblue23]

Hoovering up the green vote.

Ban fracking in UK, Jeremy Corbyn urges Boris Johnson
Labour says fracking for gas will prevent Britain meeting carbon emissions target

Ban fracking in UK, Jeremy Corbyn urges Boris Johnson - The Guardian

 

[johnblue23]

So if you automatically have to vote for Labour to be a Labour member, I'm not sure how that isn't purging people who don't support Corbyn?

You don't automatically have to vote Labour to be a Labour member. No one has to vote at all even Labour members. The current type of Labour party rule book was drawn up in 2013. Corbyn was the leader then.

 

[davek]

Yes, lame duck opposition. Both Tories and Labour support has plummeted in recent months, with Labour losing votes to the Lib Dems and the Greens, and Tories to the Brexit Party. I fully expect Johnson to go full no deal mode to try and hoover up the Brexit Party votes, but what are Labour doing to attract voters back from the Lib Dems? It seems to me that they're just hoping that the first past the post system will convince enough that Labour are the only viable alternative to a hard Brexit, which is a huge gamble. Had Labour had a different leader I suspect the Lib Dem/Green bounce simply wouldn't have happened to begin with.

A new Labour leader? What like the two puddings before Corbyn from the "centre-ground" of the party who were convincingly wiped out at the polls because the public saw they were offering what the Tories offered?

Everyone can see the character assassination carried out on Corbyn with the connivance of the LP neo-liberals and pliant BBC.

Three elections so far Corbyn has faced: two as leader which he overwhelmingly won; a GE in which a LP led by him whittled down a Tory majority to minus zero. The evidence points to him as the leader of the party, regardless of what his detractors inside and outside the party want.

 

[roydo]

The evidence points to him as the leader of the party, regardless of what his detractors inside and outside the party want.

He will win every leadership election ever.

But so what? He has to convince millions more that cant vote for him in a leadership election. Not entirely sure he, or rather those who support him, grasp how exactly to do that. But telling them they are all wrong, or pups of the BBC, or scummy wont mate much headway I am afraid.

But carry on convincing yourself.

 

[davek]

He will win every leadership election ever.

But so what? He has to convince millions more that cant vote for him in a leadership election. Not entirely sure he, or rather those who support him, grasp how exactly to do that. But telling them they are all wrong, or pups of the BBC, or scummy wont mate much headway I am afraid.

But carry on convincing yourself.

If Labour win what they won last time they're in power, or at least largest party and leading a coalition. Simple as that. The constituency is there. The Tories on the other hand have a massive Brexit Party they have to see off...which is why any notion of a pre-31st Oct election is for the birds. Brexit has to be negotiated. A no deal Brexit is the only thing that will get the Tory Party back their numbers from 2017. If Johnson delivers a deal with Europe, though, it'll be on the EU's terms, and then the Brexit Party will be back in play; if he heads over the cliff, the rest of the country and half the Tory Party will be up in arms. A GE called under either scenario will see a "progressive majority": LP+LibDems+Greens+Nationalist in Scotland and Wales.

 

[roydo]

If Labour win what they won last time they're in power, or at least largest party and leading a coalition. Simple as that. The constituency is there. The Tories on the other hand have a massive Brexit Party they have to see off...which is why any notion of a pre-31st Oct election is for the birds. Brexit has to be negotiated. A no deal Brexit is the only thing that will get the Tory Party back their numbers from 2017. If Johnson delivers a deal with Europe, though, it'll be on the EU's terms, and then the Brexit Party will be back in play; if he heads over the cliff, the rest of the country and half the Tory Party will be up in arms. A GE called under either scenario will see a "progressive majority": LP+LibDems+Greens+Nationalist in Scotland and Wales.

Thing is, the Tories have a very easy way to see off the BP. Corbyn has a harder job delivering the support he did in the last GE, simply because he doesnt want what large swathes of his northern power base do.

But some finality to Brexit changes everything, granted.

 

[davek]

Thing is, the Tories have a very easy way to see off the BP. Corbyn has a harder job delivering the support he did in the last GE, simply because he doesnt want what large swathes of his northern power base do.

But some finality to Brexit changes everything, granted.

A Tory-Brexit Party-Unionist alliance might have the numbers post Brexit.

What a mess this country would be in with a gang of backwoodsmen like that in charge.

 

[peteblue]

Hoovering up the green vote.

Ban fracking in UK, Jeremy Corbyn urges Boris Johnson
Labour says fracking for gas will prevent Britain meeting carbon emissions target

Ban fracking in UK, Jeremy Corbyn urges Boris Johnson - The Guardian

Dear god, does he even know what fracking is ?.......

 

[tsubaki]

So you would rather people are forced to vote for someone they dislike enormously due to the absurdity of the first past the post electoral system than replace Corbyn with someone the wider electorate can truly get behind? That's pretty much where we are, isn't it?

It isn't, no. This idea of a candidate that "the wider electorate can truly get behind" is a myth that reality should have exploded for you years ago - the public are told what to believe, repeatedly and across almost all of the media.

That is why Corbyn is disliked so much, and why (in the 2017 GE) when they were legally required to maintain some sort of balance he suddenly become more likeable; its why Boris is seen as such a good chap despite everything he did as Mayor of London, as Foriegn Secretary and in his private life. Its why Blair was (and is) seen as the ideal Labour leader despite a record of quite staggering wrongness.

This next election is going to be about Brexit. Do you want to stop it?

 

[Blue 1]

You don't automatically have to vote Labour to be a Labour member. No one has to vote at all even Labour members. The current type of Labour party rule book was drawn up in 2013. Corbyn was the leader then.

No he wasn't. He won the leadership in 2015.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

It isn't, no. This idea of a candidate that "the wider electorate can truly get behind" is a myth that reality should have exploded for you years ago - the public are told what to believe, repeatedly and across almost all of the media.

That is why Corbyn is disliked so much, and why (in the 2017 GE) when they were legally required to maintain some sort of balance he suddenly become more likeable; its why Boris is seen as such a good chap despite everything he did as Mayor of London, as Foriegn Secretary and in his private life. Its why Blair was (and is) seen as the ideal Labour leader despite a record of quite staggering wrongness.

This next election is going to be about Brexit. Do you want to stop it?

Johnson has an approval rating of around 30%, so given that a good number of those people will be Tories, I'd say it's far from clear that people think he's a good chap. He's certainly not popular in London any more. As for stopping Brexit, I'd say I want to more than Corbyn does (or ever has). You only have to look at the reaction of DaveK whenever anyone even remotely Blairite leaves (or is thrown out of) the party. Such is the hatred, he'd send them to the gallows if he could, yet Labour need people like that to vote for them. That's what I mean by the fundamental disconnect between hardcore Corbynites and the wider electorate. It's a chasm.

 

[NilSatisOptimum]

Johnson has an approval rating of around 30%, so given that a good number of those people will be Tories, I'd say it's far from clear that people think he's a good chap. He's certainly not popular in London any more. As for stopping Brexit, I'd say I want to more than Corbyn does (or ever has). You only have to look at the reaction of DaveK whenever anyone even remotely Blairite leaves (or is thrown out of) the party. Such is the hatred, he'd send them to the gallows if he could, yet Labour need people like that to vote for them. That's what I mean by the fundamental disconnect between hardcore Corbynites and the wider electorate. It's a chasm.

Corbyn voting record is positive when it comes to the EU there are some aspect where he shows scepticism, however, overall in favour further integration.

There is salient fact, or regurgitated media opinion, which tends to be right and neo-liberals telling fibs, and then just repeated by various unknown partisans on the internet and other medium.

As for the referendum, there is no clear mandate apart from attaining some sort of deal! And Labour deal is a customs union, a strong single market relationship and protection of environmental regulations and rights at work.

And if the current government continues with its stance Corbyn states they need put their deal, or No Deal, back to the people in a public vote.

And in those circumstances, Corbyn its clear, Labour would campaign for Remain against either No Deal or a Tory deal that does not protect the economy and jobs.

It's that simple...

 

[peteblue]

Corbyn voting record is positive when it comes to the EU there are some aspect where he shows scepticism, however, overall in favour further integration.

There is salient fact, or regurgitated media opinion, which tends to be right and neo-liberals telling fibs, and then just repeated by various unknown partisans on the internet and other medium.

As for the referendum, there is no clear mandate apart from attaining some sort of deal! And Labour deal is a customs union, a strong single market relationship and protection of environmental regulations and rights at work.

And if the current government continues with its stance Corbyn states they need put their deal, or No Deal, back to the people in a public vote.

And in those circumstances, Corbyn its clear, Labour would campaign for Remain against either No Deal or a Tory deal that does not protect the economy and jobs.

It's that simple...

How come Corbyn and his front line have been quite unable to explain all of this for the past couple of years then.....

 

[johnblue23]

I

No he wasn't. He won the leadership in 2015.

Missed out the n't as in wasn't the leader. So couldn't be a Corbyn purge.

 

[Khalekan]

Dear god, does he even know what fracking is ?.......

I would imagine Mr. Corbyn knows more about fracking than your good self, Peter.