The cynics might say it will done under the guise of moderating Brexit, but will actually be to push a yellow Tory agenda.
Current Affairs The General Election
- Thread starter summerisle
- Start date
- Status
abelard
Player Valuation: £35m
It's a disgraceful question too, really - but I suppose it will keep being asked, to serve the greater good of insinuating that Corbyn is a Vegislamocommiefenian
Imagine if there were the same energy, scrutiny and attention to 'expert' testimony applied to Brexit as has been to Labour's manifesto...Michael Gove quoting expert economists as a means to trash Labours spending plans is worthy of Juvenal.
I'd suggest anyone complaining about the hit they will take on their personal and business finances go and look at what the same expert economists says will be the effect of any form of Brexit on those two areas. Swing voters talking about the effect on personal finances and small businesses that Labour's spending plans will have, seemingly oblivious or unwilling to listen to the impact Brexit will have on them.
And a Tory party that have delivered little on their manifesto promises across the last 9 years holding Labour to account against every single proposal they have made is laughable.
Regardless if you think Labour are too reckless or too socialist - the alternative is Brexit under Boris Johnson and the lunatics in the ERG - it will not be a Brexit that is simple, seamless and pain free. It will be long, torturous and the financial hit (the same finances that are strong enough to survive under no deal but can't under Labours plans!!!) will be significant and it won't just be the top 5% of earners and corporations that will suffer, it will be everyone but those groups, with the most vulnerable being hit the hardest.
Last edited:
abelard
Player Valuation: £35m
Yes, the 'responsible' media class is now being hoist into Brexit by its own hysterical anti-Corbyn petard, and unfortunately dragging us all along with it
The thing is, it only requires the most basic levels of critical thought to see that.
I tell you what happens if that scenario occurs, Johnson refuses to resign. Forget the custom about Queens speeches which has already been broken, he just refuses to resign.
davek
Player Valuation: £150m
it wouldn't last long. The Tories simply have to get a sizeable majority - one that cant be wiped out over the course of a parliament - or they cant govern.
evilwebby
Player Valuation: £50m
It's starting to look desperate for Labour.. at least looking at the betting markets.
Its odds-on that they are now heading for fewer than 206 seats.
I mean, I know that betting markets can be wrong, but not THAT wrong. Johnson may or may not get a decent sized majority depending on how many seats the minor parties can pick u... but everything is pointing towards a very heavy defeat for Corbyn.
Sometimes in British elections the tide goes against you and defeat is inevitable, but how you lose is still important.
For the future of your Party, you need to avoid heavy defeats so that you are able to regroup and have a chance the next time around. Remember, Michael Foot fell to 209 seats in 1983 and that pretty much condemmed them to another 14 years in opposition. Likewise, William Hague ran a disastrous campaign in 2001 and the Tories stood still at that election, which meant they were not in a position to challenge in 2005 and even 2010 was a massive ask.
Its odds-on that they are now heading for fewer than 206 seats.
I mean, I know that betting markets can be wrong, but not THAT wrong. Johnson may or may not get a decent sized majority depending on how many seats the minor parties can pick u... but everything is pointing towards a very heavy defeat for Corbyn.
Sometimes in British elections the tide goes against you and defeat is inevitable, but how you lose is still important.
For the future of your Party, you need to avoid heavy defeats so that you are able to regroup and have a chance the next time around. Remember, Michael Foot fell to 209 seats in 1983 and that pretty much condemmed them to another 14 years in opposition. Likewise, William Hague ran a disastrous campaign in 2001 and the Tories stood still at that election, which meant they were not in a position to challenge in 2005 and even 2010 was a massive ask.
I imagine so but for me, i cant see how a Labour leader can be wanting total state control whilst plonking himself at the top as the King and yet to my knowledge has zero experience or ability in running businesses.
It makes absolutely no sense to me at all...and Abbot ive only seen making a show of herself on video. She doesnt even know what shes saying...its odd from such a high salaried person.
It seems to me like Corbyn is the same as one of those guys in the movies who go and live in a cabin in the mountains for many years writing a end of days...manifesto...to create doom.
How can they get voted in and how can they qualify being paid such amounts of money...
Honestly, if either werent in politics do they have any other background experience or qualifications to fall back on?
How can these people want state control on so many companies...surely its a power trip or even worse its a suicidal act before writing a book and going on a speaking circuit.
Im looking at the poll on here and gobsmacked people would vote for them
Yes there's a lot in that Zat. I mean Abbot was a very well regarded solicitor and one of the first black women to go to Cambridge to study law. I know she has become a figure of fun, which suggests a fair bit of benign sexism/racism within our media but she's clearly a very bright and successful woman. I don't think she's in the least bit adaptable to what modern politics dictates, and doesn't remember figures very well but I can't say she's not a very successful woman in her own right.
As for Corbyn, in truth neither he nor Johnson have the CV to be PM. Corby's strength is he's a very strong empath. Johnson's strength is he's good at telling jokes.
Where I think there is some difficulty in the position, is that I'm not sure the skill set required to run a business, or to be a successful trader is really the same skill set required to lead a country. I mean a business owner is accountability to their shareholders. It's a very narrow group of people and there are not really wider questions beyond that. A PM's role is to cater for all aspects of the country.
I'd perhaps argue being successful in business may even preclude you from being able to understand the perspectives of ordinary people. That seems the case a bit with Trump, who despite running successful business (albeit having failed at quite a few as well) seems to lack much understanding that running a country is a very different job MO.
We seem to have MP's for the most part who are overwhelmingly from a certain set of society and who for me protect their interests first. I'm not sure many have any real understanding of what or how ordinary people survive.
But yes, the big money they get is really from what they can do as politicians. I mean you can surmise anything you want from potential conflict of interests in them sitting on boards while doing that job. To me it's not a great situation but it persists never the less.
Edit apologies I missed the bit about the manifesto. I think there's a fair bit of truth in what you say. However Mcdonnell is really the manifesto man. Corbyn isn't a policy guy.
Whatever ones personal view of what he's trying to do, I'd say Mcdonnell is representing it quite well. He's putting quite a common sense view of the value of a big state. He's got most of the other parties now adopting tax/borrow and spend policies. The orthoodox economic thinking that preceded him has gone.
Last edited:
There seems to be a school of thought that their problems in the 90's and recently was down to bad apples. And now they've magically got rid of the bad apples (to me very dubious) that the deep chasms that exist within their organisation will disappear.
I tend to lean to a more structural view. A Tory PM cannot govern without a workable and sizeable majority. If an election comes and he has a majority of under 40, or specifically under 20 and the plotting begins. You have to grasp the psyche of these people. They are not bred to think thats sh1thouse behaviour. They are bred to think thats dynamic, churchillian, entrepreneurial, dynamic leadership to cut down your own PM and strive for glory yourself irrespective of the consequences for anyone else.
The moment a small majority comes in, they all just start thinking "how can this benefit me" and know that they only need a handful of others to work in unity and they are back to dictating to the PM.
A new Remain fringe and a new hard leave fringe will emerge quite quickly and start shoving Johnson around if they do not win a clear majority. The system generates that.
This is the scale of obdurate selfishness we are plagued by in this country. This utter div would stand to be taxed about £8 per month more under Labour's plans.
And despite his complete ignorance, the BBC sees it fit to be shared it with a wider audience.
We're doomed.
peteblue
Welcome back Wayne
I think the Tories will win comfortably......
neil999
Player Valuation: £80m
peteblue
Welcome back Wayne
Have you thought that perhaps Labour gets negative press and Tories get positive press because of what they want to do.....
- Status