The 2 years since Martinez left.

[hktoffee]

I'm still yet to read any confirmation that "we were offered Lukaku". How do you know it wasn't told to enquiring clubs earlier in the summer that Lukaku wasn't available hence going for Ba instead (as the story goes). Seems rubbish to me and no-one (to my knowledge) has substantiated the claims that we weren't interested in Lukaku at all.

Plus, wasn't it Lukaku signed for Martinez permanently after year 1. So it's a moot point whether we were after him on loan or not.

Finally Macca my friend, do you concede that if Martinez had £200m to spend as Koeman did, he would have bought different players to the ones he bought during his time at Everton, in the main?

I'd imagine he would still have gone and got McCarthy, Lukaku and Deulofeu. Any else you'd put your hat on?

If Steve Walsh is the dof, like a senior advisor to Martinez, what do you think the outcome will be?

The only great signing was Lukaku there was nothing to suggest he can spot some good gems out of nothing.

 

[TraffordBlue]

Oh look....



....you appear to be wrong....AGAIN.

He's not wrong though when you look at the 2 failed seasons which is what we're contesting here. The 13/14 seasons he got us an impressive 8 league wins out of 19 so doubt anyone would argue about that.

In 14/15 and 15/16 he won us 5 league games out of 19 both times. That isn't a good return at all and look at the teams he got the wins against:

14/15: West Brom, Burnley (19th), Crystal Palace, QPR (20th), West Ham
15/16: Southampton, West Brom, Newcastle (18th), Stoke, Aston Villa (20th)

That away record is very similar to what we have had to endure for years. Rolling over for the 'big teams' and managing a couple of wins against the worst sides in the league who you'd expect us to beat.

 

[hktoffee]

He's not wrong though when you look at the 2 failed seasons which is what we're contesting here. The 13/14 seasons he got us an impressive 8 league wins out of 19 so doubt anyone would argue about that.

In 14/15 and 15/16 he won us 5 league games out of 19 both times. That isn't a good return at all and look at the teams he got the wins against:

14/15: West Brom, Burnley (19th), Crystal Palace, QPR (20th), West Ham
15/16: Southampton, West Brom, Newcastle (18th), Stoke, Aston Villa (20th)

That away record is very similar to what we have had to endure for years. Rolling over for the 'big teams' and managing a couple of wins against the worst sides in the league who you'd expect us to beat.

Martinez won 21 league games in one season then he needs 2 full seasons to win another 21. The stats in 2013/2014 will always look impressive but that also proved that how horrendous the following 2 seasons were.

 

[Gwladysstreetlad]

Oh look....



....you appear to be wrong....AGAIN.

Sound Dave, wonderful return that. Martinez had the second best away win record of any Everton ever. You'll have to excuse me while I scream laughing uncontrollably for the next couple of hours!

Let's put the away LEAGUE results for his second and third year out there for everyone to see shall we? In 14-15 We won five away games, along with four draws and ten defeats. In 15-16 We won just five away games (which is one less then even I thought, can't believe I've been giving that fool more credit then he derseves!) along with five defeats and NINE draws. Keep using cup wins against the likes of Barnsley and reading all you want but you and I both know your talking crap. I'm not saying your a lair Dave, I just think you have a very flexible relationship with the truth.

You know as well as I do that those statistics are misleading at best. One would almost think that you being deliberately dishonest and were using flawed statistics to suit your false narrative........

 

[davek]

He's not wrong though when you look at the 2 failed seasons which is what we're contesting here. The 13/14 seasons he got us an impressive 8 league wins out of 19 so doubt anyone would argue about that.

In 14/15 and 15/16 he won us 5 league games out of 19 both times. That isn't a good return at all and look at the teams he got the wins against:

14/15: West Brom, Burnley (19th), Crystal Palace, QPR (20th), West Ham
15/16: Southampton, West Brom, Newcastle (18th), Stoke, Aston Villa (20th)

That away record is very similar to what we have had to endure for years. Rolling over for the 'big teams' and managing a couple of wins against the worst sides in the league who you'd expect us to beat.

Oh I see, the stats dont back up the argument you wish to make? 8 away wins / 5 away wins / 6 away wins.

Go and compare that sequence with any other three season one in the last 20 years.

 

[marsh]

Are people moaning at Martinez for winning 5 away games? When last season we won 4 and this season we are currently on 2?

 

[mkrudden]

If Steve Walsh is the dof, like a senior advisor to Martinez, what do you think the outcome will be?

The only great signing was Lukaku there was nothing to suggest he can spot some good gems out of nothing.

Absolutely no problem you wading in HK but do me the pleasure of answering the question:

Do you concede that if Martinez had £200m to spend as Koeman did, he would have bought different players to the ones he bought during his time at Everton?

Yes or no?

Yes- you believe they would have been of a greater quality given they would cost more (the general equation when signing players)

No- you believe, armed with an arsenal of 200m he would have bought Alcaraz, Kone, Cleverley et al.

What will it be good sir / lady?

 

[Gwladysstreetlad]

Oh I see, the stats dont back up the argument you wish to make? 8 away wins / 5 away wins / 6 away wins.

Go and compare that sequence with any other three season one in the last 20 years.

Wrong. It was five away wins in 15-16. Do try and keep track of your fibs........

 

[mkrudden]

Sound Dave, wonderful return that. Martinez had the second best away win record of any Everton ever. You'll have to excuse me while I scream laughing uncontrollably for the next couple of hours!

Let's put the away LEAGUE results for his second and third year out there for everyone to see shall we? In 14-15 We won five away games, along with four draws and ten defeats. In 15-16 We won just five away games (which is one less then even I thought, can't believe I've been giving that fool more credit then he derseves!) along with five defeats and NINE draws. Keep using cup wins against the likes of Barnsley and reading all you want but you and I both know your talking crap. I'm not saying your a lair Dave, I just think you have a very flexible relationship with the truth.

You know as well as I do that those statistics are misleading at best. One would almost think that you being deliberately dishonest and were using flawed statistics to suit your false narrative........

Or you're ignoring the objectivity and factual basis of Dave's arguments

 

[Gwladysstreetlad]

Are people moaning at Martinez for winning 5 away games? When last season we won 4 and this season we are currently on 2?

Meanwhile we also have won nine hime games this season which is two more then Martinez for in 14-15 and three more then 15-16 with two games to spare......

 

[bitter-no-better]

Best football I have seen in a very long time under bobby. But you cannot go into a game needing 2 or 3 goals just to get something. sometimes we need to eat some humble pie and say with him we had a better chance of winning something than now which seems a million miles away.

If bobby had more money he may well have ended up another wenger but even he still wins trophies.

 

[Gwladysstreetlad]

Or you're ignoring the objectivity and factual basis of Dave's arguments

He doesn't do objectiveity. He does propaganda and bs.

 

[davek]

Sound Dave, wonderful return that. Martinez had the second best away win record of any Everton ever. You'll have to excuse me while I scream laughing uncontrollably for the next couple of hours!

Let's put the away LEAGUE results for his second and third year out there for everyone to see shall we? In 14-15 We won five away games, along with four draws and ten defeats. In 15-16 We won just five away games (which is one less then even I thought, can't believe I've been giving that fool more credit then he derseves!) along with five defeats and NINE draws. Keep using cup wins against the likes of Barnsley and reading all you want but you and I both know your talking crap. I'm not saying your a lair Dave, I just think you have a very flexible relationship with the truth.

You know as well as I do that those statistics are misleading at best. One would almost think that you being deliberately dishonest and were using flawed statistics to suit your false narrative........

Here's our season away record data from the last 25 seasons (starting with 93/94 and descending to the current season - Martinez three seasons in bold):

Away Wins

4
3
7
3
2
5
5
5
3
6
1
6
6
4
8
9
5
4
5
4
8
5
5
4
2


...d'you see now how you haven't got a leg to stand on?

Our average away wins per season in that 25 year period has been 4.76. Ergo: in every season Martinez was here we over performed against that average.

 

[mkrudden]

Here's our season away record data from the last 25 seasons (starting with 93/94 and descending to the current season - Martinez three seasons in bold):

Away Wins

4
3
7
3
2
5
5
5
3
6
1
6
6
4
8
9
5
4
5
4
8
5
5
4
2


...d'you see now how you haven't got a leg to stand on?

Our average away wins per season in that 25 year period has been 4.76. Ergo: in every season Martinez was here we over performed against that average.

It's a terrible return given all the money he spent.
Wait, WHAT?!

By the way, look at that last row after spending 200m. Absolutely laughable.

 

[davek]

It's a terrible return given all the money he spent.
Wait, WHAT?!

By the way, look at that last row after spending 200m. Absolutely laughable.

6 away wins for £300M = £50M each.

Now that's what I call value for money.