Strikers under Moyes

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dholliday said:
But it's not in general, that's the point. Among the teams who regularly finish top 10, it's a problem unique to Everton during the Moyes-era.
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Yes I think I acknowledged that In the initial post, good to see a few agree, cheers ( Elong too)

But...


I would add Moyes loves to try and change strikers apparently?

Both defensively and offensively,

1. AJ - the number 1 example of a player seeking to run channels and losing the ability to live inside the area = looked lost after his 2 second season. ( injury prone )

2. Yak - Goat covered him, but please explain the Blackburn resurgence? ( bad injury too )

3. Anchiebe - 5,6 years of persistence of a awful perception of his attitude and body language have resulted in a 3 month or so purple patch of 'form' = jury still out, but no longer spending half the time on the floor moaning. ( bad injury too)

4. Jelavic - has turned into Torres, as natural goal scoring talent and excited blues like no other striker did for a very long time, taken into consideration what Sheeds has alluded to, and the usual second season dip in form from Everton strikers makes sense for his diabolical scoring record this season, notably most of the plaudits are for his work ethic (!!!!)

Summary for me is the massively defensive coaching line up we have, an the heavy reliance on Fellaini and the won't go away " hoof ball" we resort to far too often, and is not successful.

LFC had a higher percentage of succesful long balls yesterday, with a lower percentage attempts.
 

Btw there's a thread from 3or so years ago that discusses more offensive/tactical coaches under Moyes being a lack :)
 

dholliday said:
agreed.

solution?
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Obviously someone with striking experience, but that doesn't always translate to being a good coach does it.

Better tactical awareness of the abilities of your current strikers and playing to their abilities and not forcing them to relearn and retrain.
 
Bryan said:
Yes I think I acknowledged that In the initial post, good to see a few agree, cheers ( Elong too)

But...


I would add Moyes loves to try and change strikers apparently?

Both defensively and offensively,

1. AJ - the number 1 example of a player seeking to run channels and losing the ability to live inside the area = looked lost after his 2 second season. ( injury prone )

2. Yak - Goat covered him, but please explain the Blackburn resurgence? ( bad injury too )

3. Anchiebe - 5,6 years of persistence of a awful perception of his attitude and body language have resulted in a 3 month or so purple patch of 'form' = jury still out, but no longer spending half the time on the floor moaning. ( bad injury too)

4. Jelavic - has turned into Torres, as natural goal scoring talent and excited blues like no other striker did for a very long time, taken into consideration what Sheeds has alluded to, and the usual second season dip in form from Everton strikers makes sense for his diabolical scoring record this season, notably most of the plaudits are for his work ethic (!!!!)

Summary for me is the massively defensive coaching line up we have, an the heavy reliance on Fellaini and the won't go away " hoof ball" we resort to far too often, and is not successful.

LFC had a higher percentage of succesful long balls yesterday, with a lower percentage attempts.
Click to expand...

We use our strikers as the first line of defence, not the focal point of attack. It's as obvious as Jordans tits. That's why we don't score many from our front man. That and an abysmal style of play for at least 6 years of Moyes reign.

Marcus Bent was the perfect Moyes forward. Jela is bang out of form and confidence. He should be put on pens, free kicks and told to stop running and just score until he gets it back.

He won't because Moyes doesn't see the real value of a top striker.
 
steken1 said:
We use our strikers as the first line of defence, not the focal point of attack. It's as obvious as Jordans tits. That's why we don't score many from our front man. That and an abysmal style of play for at least 6 years of Moyes reign.

Marcus Bent was the perfect Moyes forward. Jela is bang out of form and confidence. He should be put on pens, free kicks and told to stop running and just score until he gets it back.

He won't because Moyes doesn't see the real value of a top striker.
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That last line is critical to my point though! Why doesn't he? What's going on on his head? Doesn't he give credit to natural goal scorers?

Arguably the best 'striker' Moyes ever bought was Cahill and he ran him into the ground! Is that the reason he uses him as a benchmark?

Cost buttons and never stopped!
 
Bryan said:
That last line is critical to my point though! Why doesn't he? What's going on on his head? Doesn't he give credit to natural goal scorers?

Arguably the best 'striker' Moyes ever bought was Cahill and he ran him into the ground! Is that the reason he uses him as a benchmark?

Cost buttons and never stopped!
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That last line is critical for me. Why is that even a requirement for a striker? Their job is to score goals regularly. We're a defensive team by nature anyway. Surely we can use our striker just to score. It's not like if Jela stopped harrying full backs we'd get beat 3-0 every week?

Strikers have to work hard for Moyes because all players must be equal, free of ego and right into the cause of the team. For most players thats sound. But, strikers should be arrogant, should have an ego and should have it stroked sometimes.

Do you think Moyes does that with ours???
 
steken1 said:
That last line is critical for me. Why is that even a requirement for a striker? Their job is to score goals regularly. We're a defensive team by nature anyway. Surely we can use our striker just to score. It's not like if Jela stopped harrying full backs we'd get beat 3-0 every week?

Strikers have to work hard for Moyes because all players must be equal, free of ego and right into the cause of the team. For most players thats sound. But, strikers should be arrogant, should have an ego and should have it stroked sometimes.

Do you think Moyes does that with ours???
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Precisely. Cahill was a grafter and a goal scorer, loads of boss strikers get labelled as lazy or disinterested but still score.


Prime example is berbatov, what I mean is because Cahill set an example of how he responded to Moyes and his retraining, Moyes has persisted with that technique with other strikers and its begun to 'dumb' them down, you are exactly right

Strikers are natural and ( for me) can't be trained.
 

Bryan said:
Precisely. Cahill was a grafter and a goal scorer, loads of boss strikers get labelled as lazy or disinterested but still score.


Prime example is berbatov, what I mean is because Cahill set an example of how he responded to Moyes and his retraining, Moyes has persisted with that technique with other strikers and its begun to 'dumb' them down, you are exactly right

Strikers are natural and ( for me) can't be trained.
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Cahill never ever scored enough for me to justify that style either TBH.

I do think strikers can be trained and improved though. I've seen it happen with players over the years. Teaching them where to find space, make runs for others, read the game better, practice shooting from likely angles, volleying and stuff like that. IMO you can't polish a turd and instinct will always be a big part but they can be helped.
 
I agree with most of you but I think*the real problem is Moyes doesnt play for the striker. That hoof crap just doesnt work, just look at how Jelavic played last season, always in the box and players where actually looking to get him the ball. Now they look for Fellaini or Anichebe (big, strong players who can head or hold the ball) neither natural scorer. So how the [Poor language removed] does Moyes really expects Jelvic to score I dont know.

Obviously Jela is low on confidence at the moment and nothing seems to fall for him but he was allowed to take a penalty or two just to get that feeling that confidence up and the team actuallu tried to get him the ball in good positions I think Jelavic would get to his very best again.
 
Jelavic looked really out of touch with his teammates for the first time yesterday. Exchanging words with Osman and Pienaar over passes he felt should come his way.

Did he get a backheader on that corner that came in and just whistled past the post 2nd half (lot of pushing in the box beforehand) or was that Jagielka? If it was Jel;avic it was his only decent contribution.
 

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