Nikica Jelavic

[bluebottle]

Also i would say Vic's movement has improved as a result of Jelavic and warrants a start ahead of him when fit at the moment,we cant keep allowing Jelavic to play himself in to form.

 

[bluebottle]

That's your opinion mate and that's fine. I'm seeing the total opposite from that performance last night.

It depends if you're looking at his overall performance or just his finishing. If you're going on his finishing, obviously we may as well have Vellios on the pitch as Jelavic was poor. But I look at it this way - he was involved often enough last night for you to actually notice he was missing. If he was completely anonymous, I'd be far, far more concerned.

Its very much his timing that is off really, his positional sense and ghosting in and around the box is fine. He does keep mistiming headers, struggling to control the ball in the box and not really hitting the ball sweetly at all. For a player who looks slightly ungainly naturally, to lose his rhythm makes it look ten times worse.

 

[Tubey]

Also i would say Vic's movement has improved as a result of Jelavic and warrants a start ahead of him when fit at the moment,we cant keep allowing Jelavic to play himself in to form.

He could have had a goal and two assists last night if Gibson and Jagielka has converted and if Jelavic was a matter of six inches closer to the ball when Ossie flicked on that header.

If he had two assists and a goal, this discussion wouldn't be happening, and we'd be talking about Jelavic as an automatic starter.

I know "if" doesn't mean much, but that's how narrow the margins are in football. If we suddenly dropped Jelavic after an encouraging overall performance like that, he'll never get scoring again.

I agree with you that Vic should be playing but I think they're different players that can play in the same team.

 

[Tubey]

Its very much his timing that is off really, his positional sense and ghosting in and around the box is fine. He does keep mistiming headers, struggling to control the ball in the box and not really hitting the ball sweetly at all.

Completely agree mate. My view is that the timing will come as long as everything else is good.

 

[bluebottle]

He could have had a goal and two assists last night if Gibson and Jagielka has converted and if Jelavic was a matter of six inches closer to the ball when Ossie flicked on that header.

If he had two assists and a goal, this discussion wouldn't be happening, and we'd be talking about Jelavic as an automatic starter.

I know "if" doesn't mean much, but that's how narrow the margins are in football. If we suddenly dropped Jelavic after an encouraging overall performance like that, he'll never get scoring again.

I agree with you that Vic should be playing but I think they're different players that can play in the same team.

I guess had this and that happened, we'd be talking of his revival. Dont get me wrong, I dont think he had a bad game, but he is forcing the issue a bit and trying to will the ball in, rather than do it naturally. Like i said before, a player who is a bit ungainly by nature, to lose rhythm makes his performances look glaringly awful when comparitive to a player like a Mirrallas or a Ba if they are missing out.

I think Vic and Jelavic up top would be a better option if our manager ever played 4-4-2. Vic offering what Fellaini does near enough in terms of holding the ball up, with a bit more going the other way. Would shore up the midfield as well.

 

[Mikey_Fitzgerald]

Also i would say Vic's movement has improved as a result of Jelavic and warrants a start ahead of him when fit at the moment,we cant keep allowing Jelavic to play himself in to form.

Vic seems to work harder as well, although it wouldn't be fair to say Jelavic doesn't work hard for the team. He's not Berbatov sauntering around almost annoyed by everyone elses prescence. Vic always puts a shift in and can give as good as he takes from defences which would cause me to play him above Jela at the moment

 

[Kevin Sheedy]

Jelavic is great.
His passion for the club and the fans should never be in question, and I for one am happy to see a striker for once caring about the team and not just his own goal scoring record, he's actually playing for the crest on his chest and not the name on the back, it's great isn't it?

His movement etc has improved in recent weeks, a lot in fact.
He's just not getting ''that bounce'' or any luck at all which he was doing last season. It'll all come good and when it does we'll be erm, boss.

 

[Brownie]

Good post. In the old days they were known as poachers, and as you say they relied on an entire system being in place to get the best out of them.

I think Jelavic has more to his game than a traditional poacher though as he gets himself about and doesn't solely rest on the shoulder of the last man (although that's where his best work is), so as proven last year he can work well as a starter in the Premier League.

Issue with a poacher is that they're by definition confidence players. What is definitely true about Jelavic is that at the moment he's almost taking a sharp intake of breath before taking on a chance and invariably fluffing his lines, because he's so desperate to put them away. You can see it on his face - even when Ossies goal went in he was devastated he hadn't got on the end of it.

But it'll come. I can see the talent hasn't gone and he'll find the net soon enough, and we'll start laughing at people suggesting we get rid for £5m in the summer etc.

I disagree, I think he's actually got less to his game than a traditional poacher, or at least a good one. I've said before about his runs in behind, often they're decent runs and he bases a lot of his game on them, but how often have you seen him get into a one on one with the keeper? He's not quick, he can't outmuscle centre backs and you rarely see him get through in yards of space, which would indicate that his runs aren't brilliant anyway.

As much as he tries to get involved in the rest of the game, I don't think getting himself about cuts it to be honest. He doesn't offer much in general play. There have been similar types of players over the years that have a far superior all round game. The thing is most of them have cost a decent amount of money, whereas we have someone who cost 5 million as our main striker.

 

[Tubey]

I guess had this and that happened, we'd be talking of his revival. Dont get me wrong, I dont think he had a bad game, but he is forcing the issue a bit and trying to will the ball in, rather than do it naturally. Like i said before, a player who is a bit ungainly by nature, to lose rhythm makes his performances look glaringly awful when comparitive to a player like a Mirrallas or a Ba if they are missing out.

I think Vic and Jelavic up top would be a better option if our manager ever played 4-4-2. Vic offering what Fellaini does near enough in terms of holding the ball up, with a bit more going the other way.

Agree with all of that completely. Definitely forcing the issue, which is why I said this:

What is definitely true about Jelavic is that at the moment he's almost taking a sharp intake of breath before taking on a chance and invariably fluffing his lines, because he's so desperate to put them away. You can see it on his face - even when Ossies goal went in he was devastated he hadn't got on the end of it.

It's sad to see as you can see the lad putting so much in so you just want him to get the goal he craves. That's not enough to blind me to him if he's genuinely poor though.

 

[Tubey]

I disagree, I think he's actually got less to his game than a traditional poacher, or at least a good one. I've said before about his runs in behind, often they're decent runs and he bases a lot of his game on them, but how often have you seen him get into a one on one with the keeper? He's not quick, he can't outmuscle centre backs and you rarely see him get through in yards of space, which would indicate that his runs aren't brilliant anyway.

As much as he tries to get involved in the rest of the game, I don't think getting himself about cuts it to be honest. He doesn't offer much in general play. There have been similar types of players over the years that have a far superior all round game. The thing is most of them have cost a decent amount of money, whereas we have someone who cost 5 million as our main striker.

In the old days poachers weren't quick though, that's why I didn't compare him to someone like Owen, for example. An Ian Rush wasn't rapid, for example, but he got on the blind side of defenders early and often.

I disagree on your analysis of him there though. His running is top drawer IMO - you have to watch him off the ball to get an accurate view of his overall play.

For example;

http://www.soccer-blogger.com/2012/...pienaar-jelavic-hibbert-heitinga-goals-video/

Hate using that clip over and over again but it's a great example - not his actual goal, but Pienaars. If you watch, he makes the run in behind, drags a defender away, Pienaar is then not closed down until it's too late, he gets the shot off and scores.

That's what I mean by intelligence. You can say that's what you'd "expect" a striker to do, but there definitely is an art to doing it well.

I appreciate what you're saying though; I wouldn't claim he's the complete striker, but I wouldn't say he's massively limited either. I see enough quality there, and it was evidenced by his stellar performances over a sustained period of time last year - that sort of quality doesn't just disappear totally, and it hasn't with Jelavic.

 

[micknick]

Look guys I dont think you're being fair. Both foot long hot dog and Tubey have quit their jobs so they can concentrate on debating this.

Show them some respect ffs.

 

[Brennan]

The dead horse has been flogged so much it doesn't even look like a horse anymore, it's just a load of squishy horse meat and broken bones.

I hope you're proud.

 

[ToffeeMike]

I really hope he can start getting goals again, I fear he may be sold by Moyes in the summer if he doesn't start banging them in.

I miss last season's Jelavic

 

[Steven Naismith]

Just wait until it's sunny again, he's boss in the sun

 

[pfim]

The dead horse has been flogged so much it doesn't even look like a horse anymore, it's just a load of squishy horse meat and broken bones.

I hope you're proud.

Ready to be processed into lasagna?