Martínez is transforming Everton

[Del]

if this is our poor run, i'll take it!

Nope

Thats going to come in our next 5-6 games IMO

 

[davek]

I said a few weeks ago that we would hit a poor run of form, Every club does

There's a certain section of our fan base who are ready to jump all over him when this happens

It's staggering mate. If I was of a mind to want Martinez out (as there obviously has been since day one amongst some people) I think I'd pick a different point than one loss out of eleven games to start criticizing him. We'll see far worse than this situation and I can only imagine the level of fume stored up ready to come out then.

 

[Groucho]

I said a few weeks ago that we would hit a poor run of form, Every club does

There's a certain section of our fan base who are ready to jump all over him when this happens

It's staggering mate. If I was of a mind to want Martinez out (as there obviously has been since day one amongst some people) I think I'd pick a different point than one loss out of eleven games to start criticizing him. We'll see far worse than this situation and I can only imagine the level of fume stored up ready to come out then.

Unfortunately, that's the nature of some football "fans" in the modern world.

It's wrong and I don't like the attitude personally. I'm all for patience. It's the 24hr culture we have, people want instant results, NOW! We need to go back to playing the long game - we gave Moyes 11 years, so why some are ready to jump on Martinez after 11 games is beyond me. I think he's doing alright so far.

 

[Del]

Unfortunately, that's the nature of some football "fans" in the modern world.

It's wrong and I don't like the attitude personally. I'm all for patience. It's the 24hr culture we have, people want instant results, NOW! We need to go back to playing the long game - we gave Moyes 11 years, so why so e are ready to jump on Martinez after 11 games is beyond me. I think he's doing alright so far.

If you would have been told 6 months ago that after 11 games we would have 20 points with only one defeat against City you would have been over the moon

The fella is trying to change a mind set that has been drilled into a side over an 11 year period

 

[deipnosophist]

Agree with Groucho. This is truly a transitional period. RM has 'inherited' a squad brought up on a different philosophy. We actually played some lovely football last year under David Moyes so we know the players have the capacity to execute 'aesthetic football'. I am becoming more convinced however that (some of the) the players 'buy-in' to the new regime is half hearted at best. RM needs to build his own squad...like the dude at Southampton has done (in quick time like!). I kind of get the feeling that RM is not the gaffer in the minds of some of our players. And after 11 years under OFM, that is (given human nature's reluctance toward change)understandable.
As I said, a transitional period. Can we make such transition in such short time as Southampton?...I think they might be wealthier than us ....so no.

 

[Jamo Martinez]

Correct.

 

[BlueAmigo]

Unreal some peoples reaction. I'd much rather see us playing measured football, out from the back but the transition to this is never going to be overnight. I don't believe there's a lack of passion, the reason you don't see our players tearing round foaming at the mouths is because WE have the ball more. We just need to make more from the possession, and I think this will come in time. I think Martinez is intelligent enough to see the lack of cutting edge and the likes of Barkley / Deulofeu will get more starts.

 

[Del]

Unreal some peoples reaction. I'd much rather see us playing measured football, out from the back but the transition to this is never going to be overnight. I don't believe there's a lack of passion, the reason you don't see our players tearing round foaming at the mouths is because WE have the ball more. We just need to make more from the possession, and I think this will come in time. I think Martinez is intelligent enough to see the lack of cutting edge and the likes of Barkley / Deulofeu will get more starts.

Great post mate

 

[bicycleheader]

Unreal some peoples reaction. I'd much rather see us playing measured football, out from the back but the transition to this is never going to be overnight. I don't believe there's a lack of passion, the reason you don't see our players tearing round foaming at the mouths is because WE have the ball more. We just need to make more from the possession, and I think this will come in time. I think Martinez is intelligent enough to see the lack of cutting edge and the likes of Barkley / Deulofeu will get more starts.

That is a great post. The point about us having the ball more and therefore not needing to show that blood and guts play like under the last boss is a good one.

The match threads are a joke to be honest. If I was sitting in a bar listening to half of those comments during or after a game I'd be laughing.

As for Martinez and our current play, I have to say that even in todays game I could see the benefit of the CBs playing out from the back even when under pressure. There were 3 or 4 passes Distin played out which, ok, were close to being closed down but the result was he found Baines in a lot of space to move forward as the player marking him had pushed Distin.

Now granted in this game Baines kept slowing it down rather than bombing on and using this space but the point remains that previously those balls would have been hoofed and the majority of the time the opposition would take it down and attack us. I can definitely handle the few hairy moments at the back for what it gains us in general in control of the game and attacking faster, when this part finally clicks.

 

[Sozzled]

I dont think it's gone. You dont pick up 20 points from having no commitment to what you're doing. There's plenty of effort and concentration out on the pitch. It might be the way we play - in a more measured and controlled manner - that lends itself to that perception. The hustle and bustle we tend to associate with 'passion' isn't really passion, it's just high octane play by players limited in their ability (or who've had their ability suppressed by a manager who plays in a certain way).

McCarthy and Barry partnership is counter productive for me. Tippy tally sideways passing. That's why we need Ross in there. Without him we look out of sorts! They sit too deep and I say it over and over again. I am yet to be convinced the our central midfield is sorted!!

 

[bicycleheader]

McCarthy and Barry partnership is counter productive for me. Tippy tally sideways passing. That's why we need Ross in there. Without him we look out of sorts! They sit too deep and I say it over and over again. I am yet to be convinced the our central midfield is sorted!!

I would agree with you if I thought Barry and McCarthy were not able to play risky forward passes, or just forward in general....but the thing is they can. Also McCarthy starts deep but gets further up the field a lot because he has the engine to get up and down.

I think it's more to do with movement up front which I don't think has been right since the start, although there were passes available to both in yesterdays game which I couldn't understand why they were not making them. I think there is definitely a mindset with a footballer that they change up during a game, so when they play it in to Lukakus feet for example, and he miscontrols or tries a layoff that doesn't come off....eventually they stop going for that option or at least don't go for it so quickly because they are key to controlling the game and will see it as too risky at the time.

 

[davek]

McCarthy and Barry partnership is counter productive for me. Tippy tally sideways passing. That's why we need Ross in there. Without him we look out of sorts! They sit too deep and I say it over and over again. I am yet to be convinced the our central midfield is sorted!!

We've conceded 10 so far in 11 games. Having two CMs who dont get forward that often must contribute to that. Tinker with it and it might expose Jagielka/Distin, who play miles apart these days.

But you answer your own question, really. When Barkley plays we have a blend in that area, as Barkley is a good pivotal player between the CMs and the likes of Lukaku and Mirallas. - he has the pace and strength to funnel back and carry the ball forward. The system makes no sense with Osman in there instead of barkley. Martinez surprises me that he doesn't see it.

 

[rascal]

As has been stated it'll take time and time is what RM will be given. I am fully confident it'll come good.

 

[mrb85]

Great post mate

What we still don't know is whether RM can put into practice what he preaches. 4 games out of 11 with no goals, and a fair amount of insipid stuff played in between, says that we are far off getting things right. The teams that play this type of football well pass the ball in much tighter configurations - they operate in groups of 3 or 4, playing short sharp passing between themselves before then quickly moving the ball into a part of the field that has opened up. With the odd link up down the left, we don't do this. Instead most of our passes are between players stood a seemingly regulatory 15 - 20 yards apart. Our surprise factor is nil.

To me we are where the RS were this time last season - playing predictable (Suarez apart), slow, methodical football, albeit while keeping possession. Rodgers has stepped the pace up in the last 12 months or so and is reaping the rewards. Martinez will have to do the same at some stage but I wouldn't expect that to happen just yet.

Martinez will obviously get the time to show he can walk the walk. At the moment he's getting decent results, some way above what I had expected. We are also keeping control of most games. Only for an hour at City and 30 minutes against Spurs and Chelsea have we lost control of games, testament to the value of the passing game. We are also being let down with the underperforming of key players like Mirallas.

So in all, a good start by the new manager but it would be nice as the season develops to see more going forward, and some more incisive passing.

 

[Sozzled]

We've conceded 10 so far in 11 games. Having two CMs who dont get forward that often must contribute to that. Tinker with it and it might expose Jagielka/Distin, who play miles apart these days.

But you answer your own question, really. When Barkley plays we have a blend in that area, as Barkley is a good pivotal player between the CMs and the likes of Lukaku and Mirallas. - he has the pace and strength to funnel back and carry the ball forward. The system makes no sense with Osman in there instead of barkley. Martinez surprises me that he doesn't see it.

Personally I think McCarthy can do that job on his own. Barry has done well but it's like we are missing an extra attacking player when we go forward!