Current Affairs London Protests

[Groucho]

Why don't people have marches and protests when young girls are abused in Bradford and Rochdale?

Victims are the wrong colour mate - imagine the scandal had groups of 20 odd white blokes targetted and abused young vulnerable ethnic minority girls the left would be in uproar.

Sadly its why I've lost faith over the years that the left is the answer in dealing with this problem - the right likes to pretend that racism doesn't exist whilst the left only thinks racism exists for non whites - neither will ever solve the problem.

What I would give for a modern SDP party to spring up to shake the likes of the current Labour and Lib Dem parties into touch.

I think you’re a sound poster mate but I hate this comparison or dragging of child abuse into a conversation on racism . Why’s it relevant ? It’s apples and oranges .

kids got abused and That was a disgrace and anyone who committed the offences or allowed them to happen should be punished . Let’s be clear it wasn’t SYL or the EDL that exposed this abuse there are journalists who worked hard and the various coppers and Cps eventually got their arse in gear and got people charged . Was it too late of course it was but why is this argument relevant to racism ? I’ve no clue .

I’ve nearly replied to you a couple of times when you’ve discussed it being a class thing and race not being a factor . I suspect we’re similar in lots of ways , I’m obviously a lot older and I went everywhere watching Everton in a very different time . I don’t think it was until I had a black person who I was emotionally involved with that I realised how many racist comments there are on a regular basis . Whether to them or just in conversation, I don’t mean me being over sensitive and perceiving slights when there aren’t any I mean offensive words and language I couldn’t type here . That language was always there but you’re not listening to it because it doesn’t impact on you . I’m not saying I wasn’t bothered but you just aren’t attuned. It happens a lot mate , less now than it did but still a lot . Comments , downright abuse , jokes , asides it got me into physical confrontations and it’s still going on and I haven’t experienced 1% of it . The world isn’t a nice place I know that more than anyone but I find it amazing that people deny this kind of stuff goes on .

My opinion on the grooming gangs was that the victims were working class, vulnerable white girls who were targetted by gangs of asian men on the basis that they were seen as "easy meat".

I try not to make things like that political but the reality is that those girls were the victims of racism and were also let down by the authorities - the same authorities who have also let down ethnic minority victims in this country.

The difference is though the left only highlight the abuse of the minorities and not white folk and the right only highlight the abuse of white folk and not the minorities.

Neither spectrum is fit for purpose on the issue of racism as both have inherit bias based on their political leanings.

The only way racism will be solved is with a proper centrist party imo and sadly one does not exist in the UK at present.

It's not racism.

The story there is pedophilia not racism.

You are way off with this one.

That is not racism at all.

Change all of the victims to vulnerable black/asian girls and 20+ members of a gang of groomers to be all white and 100% it would be played out as racism in the media.

Thats the reason why I've slowly drifted away from the left in recent years and moved to the centre - I realised that the left is just as short sighted as the right and the only difference is the views they stand for.

If it was just paedophilia why didnt they target any children of their own community? You do realise the majority of abused children know their perpetrator and often they will be family members and/or close friends.

They specifically targetted vulnerable white working class girls as they were seen as both beneath them and as meat. You can argue about the class system in that but you can not ignore the blatent racism.

Otherwise you may aswell claim the recent cop killing of George Floyd wasnt racist - it was just general police brutality.

I personally feel that it’s unnecessary to shoehorn child grooming into the Black Lives Matter issue.

It’s not “Only Black Lives Matter”, it’s “Black Lives Matter Too”.

 

[Harryflashman]

I personally feel that it’s unnecessary to shoehorn child grooming into the Black Lives Matter issue.

It’s not “Only Black Lives Matter”, it’s “Black Lives Matter Too”.

well for what it’s worth I think you’re correct

 

[catcherintherye]

Does the horse need to have been hit? Yes they are well trained but they are still animals and therefore susceptible to behave erratically if people are throwing flares and other missiles in their vicinity. It may have been inexperienced and only recently out of training.

To answer a previous question of yours, horses are the primary source of crowd control for British police forces. They've been at every professional football match I've ever attended. And from what I understand these were helping guard the Prime Ministers office at Downing Street. I'd have been amazed if police horses weren't on duty in London yesterday, and I'm equally amazed that somebody of your intelligence is even posing the question why they were there.

And I don't know about you, but I'd much rather see police horses used in crowd control than armoured trucks, CS gas and water cannon.

In reality no, it doesn't matter. However the officer clearly comes off the horse having run into a traffic light. It looks an awful accident, but obviously if someone has hit that horse there is some culpability there, thats all.

I have no issue with horses being used per se, I suppose I've just been in different situations where police horses have been used and people have been peaceful. I don't really know if that was the case yesterday, but it would appear as if some missiles were being thrown. What was the chicken or the egg in this situation I'm unsure. I think it's a real shame that people have behaved that way. Again just my experience, but it tends to be people who are not really associated to the protest who do this, and then the whole message gets let down by it. I know BLM protestors in America tried to protect both police officers, and buildings from damage. It's a shame people do that. As with football, it's often a minority, but we all pay the penalty really, and the consequences in this instance seem to include an officer coming off his horse.

 

[ForeverBlue92]

They didn't target their own community (you make it sound like they are shopping in tesco...) because that was not what was being asked for.

I get what you are saying but its not racism. You are just wrong here.

The definition of racism is targetting someone based off their race. The fact a grooming gang of all one race was targetting victims of all one other particular race speaks volumes.

Social economic factors played a part in it but it was a racist incident the same way the George Floyd murder was racist.

The reason why I have become so disenfranchised with politics is that its become so tedious - the left are entrenched in what they view as right/wrong as do those on the right - you'll have those in the left who think 20 asian blokes targetting only white girls isnt racist and then you'll have those on the right who will argue George Floyd was just the victim of general police brutality and simply couldnt have been racially motivated.

Its all so tedious its why I dont believe spectrum politics work in modern society as nothing ultimately gets achieved- the sooner things move to the centre the better for society in general imo.

 

[Connor]

 

[catcherintherye]

My opinion on the grooming gangs was that the victims were working class, vulnerable white girls who were targetted by gangs of asian men on the basis that they were seen as "easy meat".

I try not to make things like that political but the reality is that those girls were the victims of racism and were also let down by the authorities - the same authorities who have also let down ethnic minority victims in this country.

The difference is though the left only highlight the abuse of the minorities and not white folk and the right only highlight the abuse of white folk and not the minorities.

Neither spectrum is fit for purpose on the issue of racism as both have inherit bias based on their political leanings.

The only way racism will be solved is with a proper centrist party imo and sadly one does not exist in the UK at present.

It's a difficult issue for the left, and not one we should duck. I met the woman who broke the story (or tried too) some years ago. A left wing, radical feminist. Editors wouldn't print it. This was years before Tommy Robinson and his goons got involved in it. Robinson and his lot harass the likes of her still, and womens organisations who try to support women, but do so in a manner that is not about screaming what they are doing to the rooftops to gain credibility. There are multiple women's organisations who do a lot of good, but they have to also work against the likes of Robinson and his supporters (they recently clogged the phone lines of a rape crisis centre, presumably for a laugh). It's quite intimidating for women, who have often fled from violent men to be subjected to this.

One thing I would highlight though, is white men go abroad, to places like Thailand to go and sleep with women and girls who are coerced and forced into it, the majority begin "working" as prostitutes as young as 12 or 13 and many will be around that age when these sex tourists will "sleep" with them (I think a fairer descriptor is rape them).

It's the same issue process in reverse when you boil it down, yes the context of where and how it happens varies, but essentially it's men raping women and girls. We don't attach the same monstrosity to it though.

I mean to be quite honest with you, you can make a lot of sense of the world if you view it through the praxis that it turns via men trying to rape women. Men will tell themselves all sorts of stories to justify this, but it goes on in all settings. And yes it's really disappointing that too many sections of the left are unwilling to speak as frankly as that, because they feel they will be ridiculed as it's not political correct.

 

[GwladysBlue]

Destroying memorials to slave traders is fine by me.

 

[catcherintherye]

Mate. I think it's fair to say that you are one of the cleverer and more intelligent posters on here. You can see the amount of effort and research that has gone into some of your posts. Which makes it all the more surprising to see you now make a conclusion on such a highly debateable subject, on the strength of a video just a few seconds long.

Thanks buddy. I suppose I see it a bit differently to some others. I don't agree with the violence, but I'm just saying what I see. I appreciate it may not be the most PC thing in the world. As I've put, I hope the officer makes a full recovery. If I was on the protest, I would have gone over, risked arrested and probably being hit with an iron bar by one of his colleagues to try to attend to him.

 

[catcherintherye]

Separation is a way of trying to justify segregation for yourself. And again he’s not saying supporting your community, he’s supporting your own race by boycotting others.

Well it's not really justifying it to myself, as I have no horse in this fight. I don't agree with him, I'm not black and I don't think massively choosing to spend money on racialised grounds would be my solution. In the end you will just create lots of rich black people who will then exploit people as (some) white business owners do.

What he is saying though has a long tradition in the black community, and Malcolm X in particular was keen to point out he was in favour of separation not segregation.

 

[catcherintherye]

Victims are the wrong colour mate - imagine the scandal had groups of 20 odd white blokes targetted and abused young vulnerable ethnic minority girls the left would be in uproar.

Sadly its why I've lost faith over the years that the left is the answer in dealing with this problem - the right likes to pretend that racism doesn't exist whilst the left only thinks racism exists for non whites - neither will ever solve the problem.

What I would give for a modern SDP party to spring up to shake the likes of the current Labour and Lib Dem parties into touch.

What do you think is going on in every city, every red light district etc in Europe? Predominately white blokes, buying underage girls, most of who'm were forced to start "working" in that area under the age of 16. Nobody cares. Nobody even raises it as a problem. And you're right, large sections of Labour now try to call it progressive. It's madness. Women (particularly working class women) are being let down in our society.

 

[PhilM]

What's interesting is the demographics of the people attending. Now, I'm not saying other ethnicities can't or shouldn't participate in the BME camapgin, far from it.

However, it does seem somewhat balanced in the other direction from what I can see. Is this a fair representation of Bristol?

 

[Billy Dean]

Destroying memorials to slave traders is fine by me.

About time IMO

 

[The binman chronicles]

Destroying memorials to slave traders is fine by me.

It's going to cost the tax payer a load of money to clean up what those thugs have done. Last time I checked it was illegal to damage property and they weren't social distancing to boot.

I haven't got a particular truck in the matter should there be statues of this bloke, but by all accounts he did more for Bristol than just deal in slaves. If we retrospectively start going down historical figures and checking do they actually deserve to be seen in streets nowadays I think we'll find ourselves on sticky wickets. These things can be used as discussion points in education, this bloke did a, b and c that was good but also did x, y and z that wasn't.

 

[PhilM]

It's going to cost the tax payer a load of money to clean up what those thugs have done. Last time I checked it was illegal to damage property and they weren't social distancing to boot.

I haven't got a particular truck in the matter should there be statues of this bloke, but by all accounts he did more for Bristol than just deal in slaves. If we retrospectively start going down historical figures and checking do they actually deserve to be seen in streets nowadays I think we'll find ourselves on sticky wickets. These things can be used as discussion points in education, this bloke did a, b and c that was good but also did x, y and z that wasn't.

George Washington is a good example of this: should his name, reputation and the numerous statues be blotted from the history books?

 

[GwladysBlue]

It's going to cost the tax payer a load of money to clean up what those thugs have done. Last time I checked it was illegal to damage property and they weren't social distancing to boot.

I haven't got a particular truck in the matter should there be statues of this bloke, but by all accounts he did more for Bristol than just deal in slaves. If we retrospectively start going down historical figures and checking do they actually deserve to be seen in streets nowadays I think we'll find ourselves on sticky wickets. These things can be used as discussion points in education, this bloke did a, b and c that was good but also did x, y and z that wasn't.

I’m pretty sure that trading human beings as slaves outweighs any of the good this scumbag ever did.

These ‘thugs’ have saved the taxpayer having to foot the bill for removing his statue as they have thankfully done it free of charge.