Current Affairs Israel is an apartheid state

[Spadge Vernacular]

Awful. How can people see scenes like that at the end and think, yeah thats a solution to getting rid of Hamas.

The family in their home as the bombs were going off all around them. They'll all have PTSD. It was bad enough watching it on telly, imagine being in the middle of it! It's a disgrace that this is happening to innocent people.

 

[Wizard]

Completely agree, but would you personally have the ability to just shrug off the 1400 dead, in the most appalling circumstances, and the taking of 200 hostages. I’m not sure I could tbh…..

As I said Pete I don’t know as I luckily haven’t had to live through that. I would hope I would be able to take a wider view on it than a purely personal one. I hope I’m never in the position to have to deal with that reality.

 

[Tramps_mate]

Israel are masters at it and there are quite a few fools on here who have totally fallen for it all.

If bin Laden was still around the Israelis would be telling us Hamas are in cahoots with him..

 

[peteblue]

Yeah, it does appear to be missed that the leaders of Hamas are sitting pretty, well out of it. No surprises.

Unfortunately, whilst what you suggest is far preferable (if not ideal), it's really out of our control. I just don't see this Israeli Govt doing anything other than a George W Bush public showing of revenge.

And that’s the emotive and political bit. It doesn’t sort out the future for both peoples. Get rid of the cancer, get rid of the terrorists then maybe you have a chance….l

 

[Ferguson1878]

i’m

I've seen it around.
I follow a few Israeli DJ's/producers who were either at or knew people at the music festival that was attacked and have seen a few of their followers post the Hamas is ISIS thing as a hashtag.

It seems that one of the justifications some people in support of Israel are trying to put forward is that the US/UK bombed both Iraq and Afghanistan into near oblivion to get to Al Qaeda/ISIS, so therefore it is ok for them to do it to get to Hamas.

guy gerber v deep dish

 

[DrEFC]

So, imagine you are Israel. 1400 innocent people are murdered and another 200 taken as hostages. What do you do ? Say well never mind it’s just Hamas, maybe get a little upset or decide to do something. Now no bullshit guys, if you were in Israel what would you demand happened….please, no history, no whataboutery, just say what in that instance what would you want done……

E.g the brutal subjugation, murder, brutalisation for 75 years means nothing. Just pathetic.
How many dead bodies of innocents satiate that blood lust. Why is only one side a victim here, the side backed heavily with billions, and backed by US and Britain? Why are Arabs worth less to you?

 

[Daveysgingerlovechild]

Completely agree, but would you personally have the ability to just shrug off the 1400 dead, in the most appalling circumstances, and the taking of 200 hostages. I’m not sure I could tbh…..

At some point both sides are going to have to look past violence, bloodshed and atrocities.

Which is a very very very hard thing to do. But no progress will be made until the will to look to the future and have some reconciliation is there. Its certainly existed in the past (Oslo accords/process). As I understand its those on the harder edges of both protagonists who cause the problems.

 

[peteblue]

As I said Pete I don’t know as I luckily haven’t had to live through that. I would hope I would be able to take a wider view on it than a purely personal one. I hope I’m never in the position to have to deal with that reality.

Indeed. And that’s no doubt what many feel. But just imagine if it happened in our own countries. Someone bursting in, all of those innocent deaths of kids at a music festival, small villages and children butchered in the most horrific fashion. My guess would be that any Western state, or Russia or China, and it’s people would demand those responsible be obliterated…..it’s not even a case of right or wrong, sometimes it’s just emotion…..

 

[peteblue]

E.g the brutal subjugation, murder, brutalisation for 75 years means nothing. Just pathetic.
How many dead bodies of innocents satiate that blood lust. Why is only one side a victim here, the side backed heavily with billions, and backed by US and Britain? Why are Arabs worth less to you?

Again, no history, just say what you would do, no obfuscation, no whataboutery, what would you demand …

 

[Wizard]

Indeed. And that’s no doubt what many feel. But just imagine if it happened in our own countries. Someone bursting in, all of those innocent deaths of kids at a music festival, small villages and children butchered in the most horrific fashion. My guess would be that any Western state, or Russia or China, and it’s people would demand those responsible be obliterated…..it’s not even a case of right or wrong, sometimes it’s just emotion…..

I agree but that is my idealistic point. You would hope that emotion can be taken out of incredibly damaging and dangerous consequential decisions.

 

[peteblue]

At some point both sides are going to have to look past violence, bloodshed and atrocities.

Which is a very very very hard thing to do. But no progress will be made until the will to look to the future and have some reconciliation is there. It’s certainly existed in the past (Oslo accords/process). As I understand its those on the harder edges of both protagonists who cause the problems.

Absolutely. I’ve said earlier in this thread, Germany, France,Britain all got over their wars as time moved on. But continuing terrorism will stop this from happening. NI is in the process of getting over the ‘troubles’ because the terrorists are not currently active…….people need time and peace …..

 

[peteblue]

I agree but that is my idealistic point. You would hope that emotion can be taken out of incredibly damaging and dangerous consequential decisions.

You would hope, but evidently it’s not happening…..

 

[Blue 1]

Indeed. And that’s no doubt what many feel. But just imagine if it happened in our own countries. Someone bursting in, all of those innocent deaths of kids at a music festival, small villages and children butchered in the most horrific fashion. My guess would be that any Western state, or Russia or China, and it’s people would demand those responsible be obliterated…..it’s not even a case of right or wrong, sometimes it’s just emotion…..

I'd really like to think I wouldn't want to see at least three times the number of innocent lives on the other side taken in vengeance, but I suppose you never really know until you're put in that position.

It doesn't stop being a matter of right and wrong though. That's partly why laws exist, isn't it? To take the emotion out of it?

And Israel is answering war crimes with even greater war crimes.

 

[peteblue]

I'd really like to think I wouldn't want to see at least three times the number of innocent lives on the other side taken in vengeance, but I suppose you never really know until you're put in that position.

It doesn't stop being a matter of right and wrong though. That's partly why laws exist, isn't it? To take the emotion out of it?

And Israel is answering war crimes with even greater war crimes.

It is……

 

[peteblue]

Anyway, time to take my wife to bed…goodnight all……