Current Affairs Irish Border and Brexit

[Barnfred 55]

An act of union between those two countries - hasn't that been tried before?

The one that prevented Catholics from being MPs you mean? Or even allowed to vote.

That was always going to work out well.

 

[Carl O'Ancelotti]

Why?

We have spent the best part of 800 years trying to throw off the shackles of the union so we hardly going to join it again, ever.

Besides, we haven't even reached the end of the road to independence yet.

 

[Armaghtoffee]

Prices will fly up over night in the north in event of reunification

I don't think the ROI can afford the huge investment that will be needed in the north's infrastructure deficit

You are missing the point that NI shouldn’t exist in the first place as it was never a viable economic nor political entity. It is a classic Unionist argument to dismiss the reality of forced partition.

Any decision for unity will have wider political and economic support from beyond Ireland alone.

 

[roydo]

You are missing the point that NI shouldn’t exist in the first place as it was never a viable economic nor political entity. It is a classic Unionist argument to dismiss the reality of forced partition.

Any decision for unity will have wider political and economic support from beyond Ireland alone.

As an utterly depressed Englishman, all be it with celtic roots from way back, if I was Irish of any colour, so to speak, I honestly cant see the point of hanging onto being part of the UK instead of being a united island within the EU.

And I do get it that many in NI would find that probably insulting. Not meant to be.

 

[Armaghtoffee]

In the event of reunification, would you not expect the unionist paramilitary to kick off, in much the same way as the Nationalists would if there were a hard border enforced by Brexit?

If they did, do the ROI have the infrastructure and financial ability to cope with it?

Unionist paramilitaries were staffed, trained and funded by U.K. security services and I would suggest that without this master/puppet relationship then they could be effectively removed by counter terrorism.

History would support it anyway.

 

[Armaghtoffee]

As an utterly depressed Englishman, all be it with celtic roots from way back, if I was Irish of any colour, so to speak, I honestly cant see the point of hanging onto being part of the UK instead of being a united island within the EU.

And I do get it that many in NI would find that probably insulting. Not meant to be.

It isn’t insulting at all, it’s how our own demographics and the world in general is going.

I must say though, any thoughts of an independent Ireland countenancing joining the U.K. is crazy talk.

 

[roydo]

It isn’t insulting at all, it’s how our own demographics and the world in general is going.

I must say though, any thoughts of an independent Ireland countenancing joining the U.K. is crazy talk.

I was literally just musing when I posted that. As in, these last few years have thrown up a ton of stuff that would have been dismissed as crazy once.

 

[Armaghtoffee]

I was literally just musing when I posted that. As in, these last few years have thrown up a ton of stuff that would have been dismissed as crazy once.

I know @roydo, crazy times indeed but I can’t see a scenario of how that could ever happen given the political effort it is requiring to achieve unity in the first place.

Brexit has been a god send in focussing minds though.

 

[Carl O'Ancelotti]

Alliance Party leader and MEP Naomi Long has said she is profoundly concerned by the new proposals on Brexit and thinks they are "designed to move further towards a no-deal."

She said she believes that it is "Boris Johnson's objective" to get a no-deal Brexit and "have someone else to blame for the consequences of that."

She said the British prime minister should be held to account for what he is doing.

"The reality is the substance of this is not workable, it is profoundly flawed at almost every conceivable level and completely disregards advice he received from Northern Ireland businesses and crucially from the majority of Northern Ireland politicians."

Ms Long said while there should be discussion, it has to be a discussion on the workability of these proposals.

She said it has gone from no new border to two new borders, "one in the Irish sea and one in some unknown place."

She said she thinks it has been clearly stated that a border would put a huge administrative burden on businesses but also means businesses are left to decide the terms of not just the membership of the single market but of the single energy market".

"Given that the Assembly hasn't sat in three years, and hasn't been able to get its act together to deal with the regular run-of-the-mill politics, how on earth could you hand a veto in that assembly to the DUP over these arrangments so they could choose to block us going forward in the single energy market and effectively opt to switch off the lights.

"This is a crazy kind of situation", she said.

 

[Disgruntledgoat]

Unionist paramilitaries were staffed, trained and funded by U.K. security services and I would suggest that without this master/puppet relationship then they could be effectively removed by counter terrorism.

History would support it anyway.

Well at least they'll know where to find them all.

 

[Bluerover]

I cant see what the UK will look like in 10 weeks time Tubes, let alone 10 years. You never know, the EU might crash and burn as some predict/hope, or the Euro does the job for all but Germany and France. Maybe the ROI will want to join the UK as a result.

Sounds barmy I know, but it isnt completely out of the question. If the last few years have taught us anything, its that nothing is off limits.

Roydo,

ROI will not be re-joining the UK I can assure you. It was floated that we might re-join the Commonwealth in recent years but there was no interest amongst the general population.

Without even going into the nationalist debate, from a constitutional point of view it is a non-runner.

We have a written autochtonous constitution that works very well and is very democratic. We are content with the republican (small r) nature of this constitution, and the fact that it closely regulates the Courts, Legislature and the Executive, and these have often been brought to heel by the Constitution (Bunreacht na hEireann)..

The people of Ireland would have to vote to abandon this, and go to an unelected monarchy with an unwritten constitution in order to re-join the UK. I cannot see that happening.

 

[Armaghtoffee]

Well at least they'll know where to find them all.

Exactly lol

 

[Khalekan]

Being half Irish, having lots of family over there, living so close to Ireland and having so many Irish colleagues and work associates over the years, I have always felt a much closer affinity to Ireland than I do to the rest of Europe. I don't consider a union of Great Britain and Ireland as impossible in the future. Unlikely but not impossible. It would certainly do a lot towards solving the problems in Northern Ireland as you could have a united Ireland that is part of a union.

It is.

Why?

Up until Brexit I sort of thought along those lines, Barney.

I always believed Ireland should be one united country...the only question for me was whether or not that should mean an independent Ireland or a devolved (or Home Rule) Ireland within the UK ( or some new dispensation within these islands)

And I still firmly believe that.....but where I once thought the latter was the preferred option I am now 100% in favour of the former option.

Why have I changed my mind so vehemently?

Because of buggers like this.






Sadly I have come to realise that this fellow represents the prevailing and majority cavalier attitude towards Ireland and its people and that he and his ilk have always been around in the Conservative Party and they always will be.

He, nor his fellow travellers in Manchester this week, does not give a toss about the hardships Brexit will inflict on the Irish people, not even those Irish people living in the United Kingdom part of Ireland.

England is fast descending into a political cesspit that will take at least a generation to cleanse.

The Irish would want to be mad to seek to be yoked to us IMO.

Heck, I judt wish the City of Liverpool coukd gain independence from Brexit Britain

 

[davek]

Up until Brexit I sort of thought along those lines, Barney.

I always believed Ireland should be one united country...the only question for me was whether or not that should mean an independent Ireland or a devolved (or Home Rule) Ireland within the UK ( or some new dispensation within these islands)

And I still firmly believe that.....but where I once thought the latter was the preferred option I am now 100% in favour of the former option.

Why have I changed my mind so vehemently?

Because of buggers like this.






Sadly I have come to realise that this fellow represents the prevailing and majority cavalier attitude towards Ireland and its people and that he and his ilk have always been around in the Conservative Party and they always will be.

He, nor his fellow travellers in Manchester this week, does not give a toss about the hardships Brexit will inflict on the Irish people, not even those Irish people living in the United Kingdom part of Ireland.

England is fast descending into a political cesspit that will take at least a generation to cleanse.

The Irish would want to be mad to seek to be yoked to us IMO.

Heck, I judt wish the City of Liverpool coukd gain independence from Brexit Britain

I cant believe the Scots turned down the offer of leaving the UK in their referendum. FFS, all they had to do was put a x on a piece of paper...other nations have had to spill a lot of blood to get from under that butcher's apron.

I bet they vote to leave next time though. Cant blame them either, English towns and cities chocca with gammon faced nobheads, and neo-fascist gangs on the cusp of becoming paramilitaries. If I were the Scots, I'd add another 20 foot onto Hadrians Wall.

 

[thirdmantackle]

It isn’t insulting at all, it’s how our own demographics and the world in general is going.

I must say though, any thoughts of an independent Ireland countenancing joining the U.K. is crazy talk.

Exactly.
If we could move the country closer to France and away from the UK most people would be delighted