Hypothetical Martinez question

Would we be in a better position right now with Martinez still in charge?


  • Total voters
    299
Status
Not open for further replies.
El Fraudo? No wayo.

He had lost the dressing room so we would probably have gone down the following season under him. The players need to take a lot of blame for what has gone on though as they downed tools under Martinez and Koeman to get both sacked and already look like they are doing the same under Allardyce. Next weekend is huge.
 
He also lost by an 8 goal margin TWICE in the same season once. One of those was 9-1 at Spurs.

NINE

Biggest defeat in prem history and also said it was good because he learned more from his players than any other game. He probably still believed that asking bramble and Caldwell to pass the ball around like bekenbaur was working even as the 8th and 9th goals were flying in
 
don't get me wrong, he deserved to go and i genuinely liked the feller as well

but honestly, I'd rather watch us get beat but have a go like we was then get beat cowardly without even having a shot like are doing now

( both in there own way is bad enough to be fair like )

Our footy is boring now but I thought it was under bobby. Even when we won it was like watching paint dry. And watching us lose 2 and 3 goal leads used to drive me insane. Bobby actually stopped me from caring about football as it's the only way I could cope with it. I never forgive him for that.
 
Our footy is boring now but I thought it was under bobby. Even when we won it was like watching paint dry. And watching us lose 2 and 3 goal leads used to drive me insane. Bobby actually stopped me from caring about football as it's the only way I could cope with it. I never forgive him for that.

hahaa I get what you mean, both different kinds of boring

now we just lump it long to nobody and sometimes under bobby it was just passed around the back 5 and not end up anywhere

it's just finding the right balance like we did in his first season, pass it around until there was space then exploit it quickly, that's how we did it so well
 
Our footy is boring now but I thought it was under bobby. Even when we won it was like watching paint dry. And watching us lose 2 and 3 goal leads used to drive me insane. Bobby actually stopped me from caring about football as it's the only way I could cope with it. I never forgive him for that.

He learned so much from his players that he subsequently went on to lose 8-0 later in the season at Chelsea. What a visionary, ahead of the curve as ever.
 
What makes you think that? He was great in his first season and then he fell apart.

His philosophy was based around possession football and not worrying too much about the defence. Possession football is pretty pointless when the passes don't lead to anything.

People shouldn't forget how bad things got under him. The worst case being that derby defeat at Anfield 4-0.

Possession 33%
Liverpool shots: 37, Everton 3
Liverpool shots on target 13, Everton 0
Liverpool corners: 9, Everton 1

And people make out like Big Sam is the sole reason for us going to grounds in the top 6 and rolling over. Quite clearly not true.

Indeed. He’s just carrying on R******’s good work.
 
Our footy is boring now but I thought it was under bobby. Even when we won it was like watching paint dry. And watching us lose 2 and 3 goal leads used to drive me insane. Bobby actually stopped me from caring about football as it's the only way I could cope with it. I never forgive him for that.

Exactly how I see it. That Bournemouth game was something else. First giving up a 2 goal lead. Then scoring what looked like a 95th minute winner and then conceding in the 98th minute. A collapse no fan should have to endure ever. Yet under him, he manged to replicate it just a few months later at Stamford Bridge with a near identical result. Now that doesn't excuse poor refereeing or our players conceding but how can a manager let that happen?

The West Ham was the final straw for me. My most unenjoyable season of attending Goodison in the 20 years i've had my season ticket. The Sunderland away 3-0 was an embarrasment in every way possible too all down to his 'leadership'. We took 700 fans to an away game, that is what he had reduced us to lol.
 
At the time I think he should have been sacked, but I do feel our players sold him short, and I think the fans turned rather quickly - especially given supposed lower expectations.
If you think about it now he was the only manager to demand top 4 -yes that was Kenwright's statement during his press conference- and tried to instill a winning mentality around the club: one example simply showcasing our past history around Finch Farm and leaving a blank canvas up in a nod to making your own.

Similarly under Martinez and his 'philosophy' we did give the 'top 6' a game - not to say it didn't have it's gapping flaws, but the principle stands we tried to influence the game in a positive way and he came as close to any as breaking a few ducks. Currently -and going back to last season- we don't seem to want to influence the game, instead we try to contain teams and grind out a result of sorts.

If we get the balance right I think we can start looking up the table instead of consolidating 'best of the rest'.
As we've all alluded too -although little to go off- Martinez's first season was something of a stepping out of the dark moment, everything seemed to click and we all got carried away [who knows what would have happened if we got forth that season, we had to be the team to get the most points and not get in]. That's not saying Martinez's Everton is the blueprint to follow, but I genuinely feel we were building something of an identiy. Probably an over used superlative but we had an aura about us, the big teams were talking about us in concerned ways, we 'loaned' our way to success, and a fair few thought Barca were gonna sweep him away.

I fully agree his mantra didn't work when the chips were down, but I feel we lacked conviction and believe when we had a run of poor results. I think weve said for a long time we lack leaders, and don't have characters in the dressing room, it just seems to me we resorted to type, and then the manager becomes the scapegoat. Look at Koemans 1st season after the first 5 games, it when south very fast after the Norwich cup game, we're a defeat or two from collapsing. Koeman to his credit switched it up, but we resorted to a style lacking in his pressing vision.

I thought the period under Martinez -who I wanted as manager when he was at Swansea- has been massively exaggerated as to how bad it became - saying that there is little to know denying his time was up. You could say I'm being misty eyed and taking Martinez's performance against the 'top 6' out of content given he has been the only manager since supporting Everton I've seen 'take the game' to them. That being said under Martinez i've left the game early for the first time -away to Liverpool- but also left a game thinking 'wow' (Arsenal away first season) there was just no middle ground, it was either a top performance or a complete shambles. To be fair the players threw both him and the fans under the bus during his 2nd/3rd season.

I think the blueprint Martinez tried to instil was bearing some fruition, but we seemingly took one step forwards, two steps back, or in Martinez's case an extra sideways pass before being caught in possession and conceding. Saying that -not that its something to celebrate- but i'm sure in his final season we had the best away record, be that for x amount of years, or in one of the best in the league, it was oddly the home form that cost us,

Other managers have damped our ambitions and we've just become complacent so for what its worth Martinez with money and buying players to suit his style would be much better then the dross we've been served since.

If you're the slightest bit interested this is my opinion on Martinez - typed when coming back from Wembley:
http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/everton-fan-qa-roberto-martinez-11272823
 
Let’s be honest, at least under Moyes there was hope. I never thought ‘I’m so apathetic about Everton’, I never thought ‘I want us to lose so this clown gets fired’ I never thought ‘we’re going down’. There weren’t many times that I thought the players didn’t care under Moyes. Every game you could go into thinking ‘we’ve got a chance’ even if it didn’t work out.

Since then there’s been numerous times i’ve thought ‘how many will it be this time?’

Basically Moyes was a complete godsend during a period we should have gone down (everyone else did). Since then we’ve behaved like any other bottom 14 club hiring crap managers and letting gh buy crap players.
 
Absolutely no question.

He had a paper thin squad, an aging defence & a keeper who was finished. If he'd had half the money Koeman had, we'd be a lot better off.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar Threads

Welcome

Join the Everton conversation today.
Fewer ads, full access, completely free.

🛒 Visit Shop

Support Grand Old Team by checking out our latest Everton gear!
Back
Top