Hard work beats talent if talent doesn't work hard.

[Walken]

But out of the genetics lottery winners, who will be the best- the one that works the hardest. The motto belonging to this thread is applied to professional athletes. Joe bloggs could train to be a decent footballer, just not a elite pro.

so by definition of leaving this argument to top athletes and top athletes alone, you agree talent is more important, losers always whine about their best, winners go home and fcuk the prom queen

 

[Walken]

Opinions. Fair dos mate.

and i consider my duty to correct wham opinions on Ross

 

[MrGrumpy]

feel the saying was made for a certain Spanish winger we have just lost. I think it's way Koeman ultimately got rid and loaned him out to Milan. It's also why I think he Calvin-Lewin has been given a run in the team. Is there any other players or ex players that fall into this category?

Lukaku, super talent with a great eye for goal but can't be bothered half the time.

Bains. Not super talented but puts a shift in every game

 

[MrGrumpy]

so by definition of leaving this argument to top athletes and top athletes alone, you agree talent is more important, losers always wine about their best, winners go home and fcuk the prom queen

What movie is that off? It's annoying me I can't remember

 

[Walken]

What movie is that off? It's annoying me I can't remember

I'll give you a clue but not the movie, it was said by sean connery

 

[MrGrumpy]

I'll give you a clue but not the movie, it was said by sean connery

Is it The Rock.

I did [Poor language removed] the prom queen was the reply

 

[DrEFC]

so by definition of leaving this argument to top athletes and top athletes alone, you agree talent is more important, losers always whine about their best, winners go home and fcuk the prom queen

I like the quote, but if they're all talented- then hard work becomes the elevating factor.

 

[Walken]

I like the quote, but if they're all talented- then hard work becomes the elevating factor.

but they aren't at least not to the same degree, the answer lies somewhere in between on the spectrum, but as a personal preference I hate the 'hard working good pro' like neville or naismith, I want to watch talented guys try things I couldn't even attempt

 

[Bluebonic]

but they aren't at least not to the same degree, the answer lies somewhere in between on the spectrum, but as a personal preference I hate the 'hard working good pro' like neville or naismith, I want to watch talented guys try things I couldn't even attempt

The problem is the two things shouldbpnt be mutually exclusive, as Davek said, a top player generally has both! There have been few more talented that Duncan McKenzie, but he ultimately failed because he treated his body like crap and was utterly unfit!

 

[mawders]

Everyone's favourite albino Scottish superstar.

Weirdly, I think Naismith would do quite well for Koeman

 

[LydiateLee]

David Beckham vs David Bentley debate.

The latter was more naturally gifted.

 

[Amw79]

11 pages, and I just saw it as a quote to remind players not to slack off in the gym.

 

[rochdaleblue]

How would the likes of Glenn Hoddle fit in within the modern game? Even at his peak, there was complaints he was lazy and didn't 'track back' to help the team. He was arguably England's brightest talent of the early 80s and if he was Spanish, French or Italian he would have been lauded for his ability.
Our game then was as frantic as it is now, whereas nowadays terms such as athlete and 'great engine' are commonplace, when used to describe players as opposed to skilful, creative etc.
People will argue that the game has moved on since those days. Platini, Hoddle, Rikjard outstanding players of there generation probably wouldn't be accepted as much in the modern game.

 

[Tel001]

You cant have quality play without being fit enough to delver it. It's axiomatic.

But too much emphasis is placed these days on chasing and pressing and elevating basic stuff like that as a skill. It isn't. It's just the huff and puff of play that has to be there to deliver quality play when you get the ball.

The fetishisation of running distances is ridiculous. It's a mundane by-product of football.

Not having that....

 

[Tel001]

Skill + hard work will trump skill + slacking.

I believe that was the nature of the quotation in the OP as endorsed by Koeman.

That's true. But it hardly needs to be stated, and when it is it's almost always done as a means to amplify the importance of hard work and downplay skill.

It's a quotation laden with meaning...and from my p.o.v. is it's message is that grafters are more welcome than creative types.

Grafters are more welcome than creative types? Your comprehension is terrible! I read it as "you may be talented ... but you must still work hard"