FIFA banning poppies

[royalblue66]

Its the NYFD isnt it? Sake

Haha

 

[coollino]

Sounds like the FA and the SFA are going to tell FIFA to do one.

Points deduction or fines?

You decide.

A points deduction will be great as the only people who care will be the people who insist they have to be worn.

 

[roydo]

A points deduction will be great as the only people who care will be the people who insist they have to be worn.

Dont think anyone is insisting they are worn.

 

[RaleighBlue]

Er, thats the point mate. All money donated goes to the Royal British Legion, which exists to support members and their families of the armed forces. Past and present.

No profit. And the shirts or armbands with the poppy on it are usually auctioned for the RBL. Totally unpolitical, just a day we have had for decades that revolves around folk buying a paper poppy as their way of recognising the actions of others.

We also have a Remembrance Service every year at the Royal Albert Hall. A few weeks after 9/11, members of the NYFB were invited, again, to recognise their loss.

It's objectively political to make any statement of support to an armed force of a government, though...even if the intent is to honour the members of the armed force, the inference will be (and has been by some in the past) support for the actions of that military.

Political doesn't mean bad. But it probably doesn't have a place in an international game, nor should any political statements be forced (explicitly or implicitly) upon the players/employees.

My profit statement was taking a swipe at the NFL in particular and its incessant jingoism in the name of lining its own pockets.

I still stand by the fact that I am opposed to any structured political message of this type - it should be driven by the players themselves. Politics should not be a public relations exercise - especially politics involving the military.

I am not advocating banning poppies. I'm advocating banning an organized effort to make sure the poppy is on all the players shirts. A player should be able to choose to wear an armband, but I am put ill at ease by the sorts of ill will that are whipped up by the more populist papers regarding players that choose NOT to wear the poppy.

 

[coollino]

Dont think anyone is insisting they are worn.

Have not not seen the poppy facists on social media?

 

[roydo]

It's objectively political to make any statement of support to an armed force of a government, though...even if the intent is to honour the members of the armed force, the inference will be (and has been by some in the past) support for the actions of that military.

Political doesn't mean bad. But it probably doesn't have a place in an international game, nor should any political statements be forced (explicitly or implicitly) upon the players/employees.

My profit statement was taking a swipe at the NFL in particular and its incessant jingoism in the name of lining its own pockets.

I still stand by the fact that I am opposed to any structured political message of this type - it should be driven by the players themselves. Politics should not be a public relations exercise - especially politics involving the military.

I am not advocating banning poppies. I'm advocating banning an organized effort to make sure the poppy is on all the players shirts. A player should be able to choose to wear an armband, but I am put ill at ease by the sorts of ill will that are whipped up by the more populist papers regarding players that choose NOT to wear the poppy.

It has been an ever present fixture of every single match I have been to since about 1973. The match closest to 11/11 always has a minutes silence, maybe a Last Post as well.

The poppies on the shirt has been a more recent addition, granted.

And no one is saying that all players should wear one. The more reasoned of us understand why someone may prefer not to display a poppy.

 

[joey_macmo]

Dont think anyone is insisting they are worn.

I'm sure every player bar McClean takes it upon themselves to wear one at the weekend

 

[RaleighBlue]

It has been an ever present fixture of every single match I have been to since about 1973. The match closest to 11/11 always has a minutes silence, maybe a Last Post as well.

The poppies on the shirt has been a more recent addition, granted.

And no one is saying that all players should wear one. The more reasoned of us understand why someone may prefer not to display a poppy.

I have no problem with your stance, by the way. I am all for it being allowed and for players to be allowed free expression.

I am more pointing out the conflict that arises when you take it beyond your own nation and culture. And thus have no issue with FIFA's decision, while also making a swipe at the fact that I just don't believe the geniuneness of the FA's stance - which is entirely likely due to my own rampant cynicism...a result of being surrounded by the ultimate in focus-grouped leagues.

For you it is a symbol of those that have sacrificed in war. For others it may be a symbol of oppression. As it is a symbol, neither is wrong. FIFA short circuits political unrest in this situation by saying, 'leave it off, not for here, yeah?'

I have no problem with that, just like I have no problem with this fine forum deciding where the line on allowing political discussion is set. There is unquestionably a subset of people that think not wearing the poppy is disrespectful.

Which is why it's best just to leave it out of the hands of the organization at all. Let the players decide what they believe and what they'll wear. Chances are most everyone will wear the poppy by choice anyway.

A club or ground asking for a minutes silence is very different to me than the FA or FIFA becoming involved in politics (FIFA especially). You are not their only member nation, and the poppies symbolism varies among the membership. It's just polite to not wear it.

So basically, in the league - make it players choice (you're in England afterall, where the symbolism is fairly straightforward). But for internationals? No problem with FIFA saying no.

 

[YMJ]

There are plenty of other ways that remembrance could occur at the game without having to wear a poppy on the shirt.

I should declare that I wear one by choice every year, and unless football (Everton) gets in the way I usually attend at a war memorial on Remembrance Sunday.

However, in recent years it has been seen by politicians, red top newspapers, social media idiots etc as "unpatriotic" or "disrespectful" not to wear one. If it is a symbol of patriotism, as they claim, then it is a political symbol and FIFA are correct to ban it.

 

[4737carlin]

I really hope England wear them, not because I think they should, it should be a thing of choice, but I hope they do it just because Fifa are sayng they cant. Fifa can do one, be good if they then boot us out of the stupid comp altogether!!

 

[Neiler]

Escalated quickly then.

Phoney and ingenious war, if the FA, SFA or for that matter FIFA were generally arsed about veterans or the armed forces, instead of division sign waving. They would donate the gate receipts, commercial revenue and match sponsorship to the appropriate organisations there to support service people who fall on hard times.

Anything else is bluster, politics and a publicity stunt.

 

[Kurt.]

I'm sure every player bar McClean takes it upon themselves to wear one at the weekend

If I was McLean I wouldn't wear one either.

 

[joey_macmo]

Same people probably flipped on Argentina for having a Malvinas banner that one time.

And as if by magic This has got a lot of traction today, so much so they've just tweeted again.

Not sure whether it's a coincidence that they are ignoring the fact that they got fined by FIFA

 

[dannyboy]

FIFA get plenty of things wrong, this isn't one of them.

The clamour to get people wearing poppies is nauseating. If you want to wear one that's great, if you don't then that's fine too.

 

[peteblue]

It's objectively political to make any statement of support to an armed force of a government, though...even if the intent is to honour the members of the armed force, the inference will be (and has been by some in the past) support for the actions of that military.

Political doesn't mean bad. But it probably doesn't have a place in an international game, nor should any political statements be forced (explicitly or implicitly) upon the players/employees.

My profit statement was taking a swipe at the NFL in particular and its incessant jingoism in the name of lining its own pockets.

I still stand by the fact that I am opposed to any structured political message of this type - it should be driven by the players themselves. Politics should not be a public relations exercise - especially politics involving the military.

I am not advocating banning poppies. I'm advocating banning an organized effort to make sure the poppy is on all the players shirts. A player should be able to choose to wear an armband, but I am put ill at ease by the sorts of ill will that are whipped up by the more populist papers regarding players that choose NOT to wear the poppy.

The poppy is not a statement of support for an armed force of a government. It is not a statement of support for anyone who is alive. It is a statement of our appreciation for those that have died defending our country and our people. A black armband can be worn whenever a team wishes to commemorate a death, that is precisely what the FA and SFA are doing. If FIFA really want to push this then we should tell them to do one and our PM should insist that no television, Wembley, advertising or any other funds from the UK should go to this rotten and corrupt body.......