Current Affairs EU In or Out

In or Out

  • In

    Votes: 688 67.9%

  • Out

    Votes: 325 32.1%
  • Total voters
    1,013
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random said:
I quite agree, but when it seems like no one is bothered then when the opportunity presents itself...

And then May starts pledging money before her demise and the current idiot in no.10 seems to also be following suit then obviously something did strike a nerve
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Absolutely agree. I said earlier in the thread that the remain campaign was championed by Osborne and Cameron telling people to vote for 'stability and the status quo', to people they'd spent years telling they 'needed to take their medicine' in the form of Austerity. If you tell people with nothing to vote for the status quo, why is anyone surprised, they en masse gave a resounding 'no thanks!'
 
random said:
I quite agree, but when it seems like no one is bothered then when the opportunity presents itself...

And then May starts pledging money before her demise and the current idiot in no.10 seems to also be following suit then obviously something did strike a nerve
Click to expand...

Two broad groups that reflect the divide I think are as follows (of course this is an over simplification but still useful for a general understanding):

The "well educated", highly skilled and mobile. They went to university, moved to London or another big city like Bristol or Manchester and have skills that allow them to command high wages. They feel like they have a stake in wider society and are correspondingly empowered.

The poorly educated, low skilled and immobile. Vulnerable to low skilled immigration. Left school at 16, live close to where they grew up. Poorly paid and feel powerless. Often derided.

Our first past the post system means that there arent big shocks to society.

However, give everyone an equal vote in a referendum and suddenly those in the second group are equally as powerful and have the opportunity to make their dissatisfaction known.

The former voted to Remain.

The latter voted to Leave.
 
Hickson9 said:
However, give everyone an equal vote in a referendum and suddenly those in the second group are equally as powerful and have the opportunity to make their dissatisfaction known.
The former voted to Remain.
The latter voted to Leave.
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Absolutely. This is one of the things that those in the remain camp don't seem to grasp, yes they understand all the reasons why its better to stay in, but they are not thinking/understanding why other folks don't feel the same way.
 
RichardP said:
And in 1972 a hell of a lot more were employed. Thank you for highlighting how EU has destroyed the UK fishing industry. It is high time it was rebuilt.
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The collapse of the Newfoundland fisheries and the implementation of 200 mile domestic fishing exclusion zones for coastal states (e.g. the 'cod wars') had a large impact on the British fishing fleet.
 
random said:
Absolutely. This is one of the things that those in the remain camp don't seem to grasp, yes they understand all the reasons why its better to stay in, but they are not thinking/understanding why other folks don't feel the same way.
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I know exactly why people feel this way, my issue is that it has little to do with the EU and a lot to do with the people feeding them lies and telling them that things will be a field of roses if only there were less safeguards and less individual rights and freedoms.
 
Methuselah said:
Well lets look at how well the EU investment has done. Fish landed by UK fishing has reduced by almost 50%. The number of fishermen has almost halved since the mid 1990's. All thanks to the EU Common Fisheries Policy which allows other EU countries to take more fish out of British waters than we do. Some investment that.
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With the greatest respect what you say may be true but that doesn't take into account other factors. A lot of the old trades such as mining, steelworks and fishing are victims of globalisation. Now the EU may have helped fuel this but the genie is out of the bottle now and won't be put back in unless everyone agrees to pay £5 what they can get shipped to them from China for 50p etc.

The fact that people wanted a fair wage for a fair days pay is entirely reasonable but when that means it is far cheaper to import the goods then there is an issue. I don't presume to know the ins and outs of the fishing world but I guess it might cost more to run and tax than what other countries fishermen are willing to supply at. Obviously that will lead to more hanging up their hooks and nets.

The UK is far more productive at the moment in the services (esp. financial) and scientific sectors and these are the ones that are going to be hurt most by Brexit. So basically we are going to cause potential losses in what we can do well to try and boost industries where even out of the EU are never going to be world leading.
 
random said:
Absolutely. This is one of the things that those in the remain camp don't seem to grasp, yes they understand all the reasons why its better to stay in, but they are not thinking/understanding why other folks don't feel the same way.
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Unfortunately, the negative effects of Brexit will disproportionately impact the powerless, who were more likely to have voted to Leave.

You then have the self interest of the powerful who voted to Leave, e.g. the European Research Group, knowing they will have a larger proportion of the smaller cake.

They exploit the feeling of powerlessness amongst the disempowered masses and turn it against the rest of the powerful (think the "liberal elite").

That is why we see Boris (powerful, self interested Leave) framing the debate as the People (powerless Leave) vs the Parliament, EU and Remoaners (powerful, remain).

It is classic populism.
 
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