Does Moyes' reign look better with hindsight given the dismal performances of his successors?

[gonetomorrow]

He did his best. There's no saying what he could have achieved at Goodison if he'd had access to today's money.
He must have done OK. A certain giant club thought it prudent to appoint him manager.

 

[Steve Wigan]

In answer to the question posed by the thread title...…..NO.

 

[Steve Wigan]

He did his best. There's no saying what he could have achieved at Goodison if he'd had access to today's money.
He must have done OK. A certain giant club thought it prudent to appoint him manager.

Wrong. A certain well known manager of a giant club decided that Moyes would be his successor, and got it wrong.

 

[mkrudden]

Genuinely cannot believe people are comparing Martinez's reign to Koeman and Allardyce's

 

[brigadier]

He did a lot of good no doubt about it, if he was more positive we would of played champions league football on a couple of occasions.
He's so dour he would of only finished 5th no matter who he signed.

 

[4737carlin]

Wrong. A certain well known manager of a giant club decided that Moyes would be his successor, and got it wrong.

Yeah he was wrong for a club that size but that dosent mean he wasnt right and did a very good job for us, he turned a winning side in to midtable one, but no one was ever going to replace Sir Alex, but he also turned a trainwreck failure of a club into a stable one, for that he will always be respected

 

[JobForTheMoyes]

He did that at West Ham to a good extent. The players liked playing for him, and he transformed Arnautovic. If he was some unknown foreign coach West Ham would have kept him on. I really do not think they will do much better under Pelligrini, despite the ridiculous wages they are paying him.

Moyes is an old fashioned football man, in the good sense. But people would rather go for the “more successful” continental model than follow the British all-powerful manager approach. Personally I think the likes of Fergie, Clough and Stein show it is a better model, but it is no longer in vogue.

Sums up my view in a complete nutshell.

I mean, look at how feted Silva was after getting Hull relegated and a good couple of months at Watford....

 

[Saint Domingo]

Genuinely cannot believe people are comparing Martinez's reign to Koeman and Allardyce's

I know, two bottom half finishes and the worst home record in our history v a 7th and 8th place finish.

 

[degsy]

In answer to the question posed by the thread title...…..NO.

This

 

[banno]

Moyes was almost binned. Players initially didn't like him. We cannot really compare his tenure as he was given 11 years the others were not

 

[Rook]

When Moyes left it was time to go. But he did a lot of good here. Brought in 2 of our all time best players (Cahill and Arteta) for peanuts (plus brought in peanuts). The squad was always likable and for what they lacked in talent worked their tails off. Was a bit unlucky (Fiorentina, Jelavic was 75% the player he was the his 1st 1/2 season we'd have had 4th and maybe even 3rd that year). Wasn't as overly defensive as some made him out to be, we were a possession side his last 2-3 years.

Other than Real Sociedad don't think he's been a bad manager post career. At Utd he wasn't allowed to spend money, RVP (who dragged them to a title the previous year) got injured again and there were a bunch of vets well past their prime. VanGaul spent a bleep-ton of money and did about the same. Sunderland utterly collapsed after he left (they would have completely collapsed if he stayed, and probably would have collapsed if freaking Brian Clough was their manager). WH is a mess right now after spending like Koenman this summer (though WH won't get relegated because good lord the bottom of the table).

I'd take him for the USMNT. He'd probably bring the team together and play hard (2 things they are extremely lacking and are correctable). He can build squads around journeymen strikers and goal scorers that aren't exactly mids and arent exactly strikers like Pulisic. Though the sediment here is to bring a "tactical genius" to "transform us into a world class side". Which is pretty laughable that people think we can bring in a bunch of limited talent players for a week or so every 2 months and turn them into Chile or the 70s Dutch sides. We tried this w/ Jurgen for years yet people never realized that sure you could play just like Germany when you have some of the best players in the world.

As far as him coaching another prem club though, yea they'll play hard and together. However his best trait, finding gems in the low end transfer market isn't really possible. We got Baines, Jags and Lescott for about 13M, that trio would cost 100+M in today's market. And guys like Arteta and Pinnear, who rode the pine before we bought them don't get unloaded for a pittance anymore. Championship stars like Cahill go for 20-30M now.

 

[JobForTheMoyes]

When Moyes left it was time to go. But he did a lot of good here. Brought in 2 of our all time best players (Cahill and Arteta) for peanuts (plus brought in peanuts). The squad was always likable and for what they lacked in talent worked their tails off. Was a bit unlucky (Fiorentina, Jelavic was 75% the player he was the his 1st 1/2 season we'd have had 4th and maybe even 3rd that year). Wasn't as overly defensive as some made him out to be, we were a possession side his last 2-3 years.

Other than Real Sociedad don't think he's been a bad manager post career. At Utd he wasn't allowed to spend money, RVP (who dragged them to a title the previous year) got injured again and there were a bunch of vets well past their prime. VanGaul spent a bleep-ton of money and did about the same. Sunderland utterly collapsed after he left (they would have completely collapsed if he stayed, and probably would have collapsed if freaking Brian Clough was their manager). WH is a mess right now after spending like Koenman this summer (though WH won't get relegated because good lord the bottom of the table).

I'd take him for the USMNT. He'd probably bring the team together and play hard (2 things they are extremely lacking and are correctable). He can build squads around journeymen strikers and goal scorers that aren't exactly mids and arent exactly strikers like Pulisic. Though the sediment here is to bring a "tactical genius" to "transform us into a world class side". Which is pretty laughable that people think we can bring in a bunch of limited talent players for a week or so every 2 months and turn them into Chile or the 70s Dutch sides. We tried this w/ Jurgen for years yet people never realized that sure you could play just like Germany when you have some of the best players in the world.

As far as him coaching another prem club though, yea they'll play hard and together. However his best trait, finding gems in the low end transfer market isn't really possible. We got Baines, Jags and Lescott for about 13M, that trio would cost 100+M in today's market. And guys like Arteta and Pinnear, who rode the pine before we bought them don't get unloaded for a pittance anymore. Championship stars like Cahill go for 20-30M now.

The price tag is not really relevant. He had a great eye for a player and scouted himself to make sure he was getting good value.

What I love is he had lined up Toni Kroos for Man Utd, but they binned him and scrapped the deal. And his two signings, Fellaini and Mata, are still important squad members all these years later.

West Ham were very stupid to bring in Pellegrini over Moyes. He is over the hill and basically an ideologue like Martinez. Moyes would have made them a top half team within a season or two. Now they just look like a collection of strangers and even Arnautovic is playing poorly as his free role has been taken away.

 

[TraffordBlue]

The one thing you can say about the Moyes reign is, t was modestly successful.

He deserves utmost respect for transforming us on a shoestring.

But no trophies, only one final. That’s what he’ll be remember for. Before my time, was it Billy Bingham who never won a trophy?

He never gets remembered fondly, just for underachieving.

Look back now, it’s clear Moyes is yet to evolve with the times, and he’s in the same style of football Mark Hughes was successful with. Football has evolved, he has not.

Moyes wasn't perfect but how did we underachieve under him? I see over achievement when taking everything to account like where we were before he came in, the overall consistency of finishes we achieved under him and where we are now. People down play the resources aspect too, which were extremely limited. Especially in comparison to what the managers since have had.

That’s true. But I’m ambitious in life, and I want to be the best always. Being happy for a 4th place and nearly qualifying is not something I can be content with.

We’re making waves and hopefully when I grow older and have kids of my own, they’ll be able to share the same Grimace I have for Moyes final 6 years in charge as I do!

He deserves credit, absolutely deserves credit. His work in turning us roundwas magificent and I’m grateful. But he believed his hype, never changed his ways and football caught up and fooled him.

Dinosaur football = unsuccessful.

Have you used the wrong number there with final 6 seasons? In his final 6 seasons we finished 5th, 5th, 8th, 7th, 7th, 6th.

The 5th in 2008 was arguably our most well rounded in the Premier League era with us getting to the Semi Final of the League Cup and the last 16 of the UEFA Cup, going out unfortunately to Fiorentina.

In 2009, we came 5th and got to the FA Cup Final.

I think Evertonians are deluding themselves about where we are as a club in the Premier League era too. What Moyes achieved there is the level we're aiming to get back to in the next few seasons. We all hope we can push on, but the likelihood is that even achieving those kind of seasons again is going to be a huge challenge.

 

[JobForTheMoyes]

Moyes wasn't perfect but how did we underachieve under him? I see over achievement when taking everything to account like where we were before he came in, the overall consistency of finishes we achieved under him and where we are now. People down play the resources aspect too, which were extremely limited. Especially in comparison to what the managers since have had.



Have you used the wrong number there with final 6 seasons? In his final 6 seasons we finished 5th, 5th, 8th, 7th, 7th, 6th.

The 5th in 2008 was arguably our most well rounded in the Premier League era with us getting to the Semi Final of the League Cup and the last 16 of the UEFA Cup, going out unfortunately to Fiorentina.

In 2009, we came 5th and got to the FA Cup Final.

I think Evertonians are deluding themselves about where we are as a club in the Premier League era too. What Moyes achieved there is the level we're aiming to get back to in the next few seasons. We all hope we can push on, but the likelihood is that even achieving those kind of seasons again is going to be a huge challenge.

It is somewhat ironic people denigrate Moyes, while aspiring to get back to the level he achieved on a shoestring!

Perhaps it is all because of the “boring” football. Personally I think he maximized the results with the resources he had available

 

[mkrudden]

I know, two bottom half finishes and the worst home record in our history v a 7th and 8th place finish.

Contextual revisionism my friend. You're comparing apples and pears.

Martinez was pre-Mohiri funds, the other two post-Moshiri.

And before you waffle on about David Moyes- he was given ELEVEN YEARS to create what he did. And one of his finishes was 17th!