Current Affairs Coronavirus Thread - Serious stuff !!!

[bluelife]

Because males under 30 have a rare but possible chance of getting serious conditions from the jabs such as heart inflammation and the more jabs you get the higher the probability of you coming a cropper at some stage.

this doesn’t make sense

Its easy for someone in their 50's+ saying "oh just get another one" when they statistically have very little risk of any serious adverse reactions and a lot more chance of getting seriously ill from COVID so the trade off in risk of taking a 3rd, 4th or 10th jab is worth it for that age group - is that trade off worth it for a healthy 21 year old?

this is a selfish way of looking at it (and again doesn’t make statistical sense)

The more this goes on the more you get the feeling the younger generations are being fed to the lions by the boomers.

same as above

I'll not be getting a booster shot until they cut the adverse reactions from it - I still get weird shooting pains down my arm over 3 months on which I never had until about 2 days after my 2nd Pfizer jab.

fair enough… but your anecdotal evidence is contrary to the facts

 

[Billy Dean]

 

[BlueToff]

"Rolling out booster jabs to younger age groups could help cut Covid infection rates to low levels across the UK, a leading scientist has said.

Prof Neil Ferguson said data suggests a third jab gives significant protection, even against mild illness.
He said he saw "no reason" why younger age groups should not be offered boosters after priority groups."

Oh here we go @BlueToff it'll be jab numero 4 in six months time.

I'd be happy to have it if the evidence is there like, and hopefully it will be soon, but right now there isn't six months of booster evidence even from Israel as far as I'm aware.

There's a very thin line they're treading here and a lot of younger people won't buy it. Concentrate on the over 50s and vulnerable groups first (my mate is getting his booster soon, he's only 25 but counts in that group) and then maybe look at others. I'm certainly in no rush. Will get one if I need to.

 

[BlueToff]

this doesn’t make sense

this is a selfish way of looking at it (and again doesn’t make statistical sense)

same as above

fair enough… but your anecdotal evidence is contrary to the facts

I don't think it's particularly selfish. Getting the vaccine ultimately is the most selfish thing you can do of the current preventative measures we have for covid. Because it doesn't stop spread, it doesn't stop infection, it does stop you getting seriously ill though, which is great. But it's not a preventative measure like social distancing, self isolation, mask wearing etc is - and those are more 'selfless' acts.

It isn't selfless, at all, to get the vaccine. Nobody is a hero for getting it and nobody is a criminal for not doing so. And I say this as someone who is very pro vaccine in all this and don't get why you wouldn't get one unless you had specific medical reasoning.

Now, if everybody gets the vaccine to protect themselves, then ultimately that helps keep the virus under control and in the long run, helps others. But the act itself of all the measures is all about protecting yourself first and foremost.

But, suggesting boosters are needed for everybody just yet, it should wait, there's nothing wrong with thinking that. And it won't help vaccine hesitancy either. And you can be sure that the take up across all categories with the boosters will be lower than the initial take up of the vaccines.

 

[efcfanwirral]

Because males under 30 have a rare but possible chance of getting serious conditions from the jabs such as heart inflammation and the more jabs you get the higher the probability of you coming a cropper at some stage.

Its easy for someone in their 50's+ saying "oh just get another one" when they statistically have very little risk of any serious adverse reactions and a lot more chance of getting seriously ill from COVID so the trade off in risk of taking a 3rd, 4th or 10th jab is worth it for that age group - is that trade off worth it for a healthy 21 year old?

The more this goes on the more you get the feeling the younger generations are being fed to the lions by the boomers.

I'll not be getting a booster shot until they cut the adverse reactions from it - I still get weird shooting pains down my arm over 3 months on which I never had until about 2 days after my 2nd Pfizer jab.

I'm with you and agree, and I won't be getting a booster...but until life is back to normal and everyone else is on the same page, if that happens, its our duty to step back from life in that situation if we're not banned from it anyway. If it goes to 3rd, 4th, 5th like I suspect it will, then we have decisions to make. I'm happy to stay at home myself. I'm aware it's selfish so it's important to keep away from others as far as possible if "unvaccinated", which I expect no booster to be defined as in the next few months

 

[JLW]

this doesn’t make sense

this is a selfish way of looking at it (and again doesn’t make statistical sense)

same as above

fair enough… but your anecdotal evidence is contrary to the facts

People getting the vaccine are only protecting themselves from death or being hospitalized because they can still transmit it to other people. So no matter what any media platform or government tell us you are only protecting yourself by getting the vaccine.

Same with masks, lets say you got tested and knew you never had covid would you still wear a mask? Yes lots of people would, why? To protect themselves because if they don't have the virus then how can they spread it? So i dont buy this bull that everyone is doing it to protect others they're not, they are protecting themselves (and rightly so)

When walking into a supermarket of 100 people are you thinking when you put your mask on 'I hope i don't spread this virus i haven't even got' or are you thinking 'I'm wearing this so i don't pick up the virus from the any of the 100 people in here.'

 

[TN Toffee]

I have to say I find this generalisation around a huge group of people both unfair and a bit cringey

I qualified it by saying it doesn’t apply down to an individual level. As a collective though, their voting record over the past four decades in the US can be interpreted no other way.

 

[bluelife]

People getting the vaccine are only protecting themselves from death or being hospitalized because they can still transmit it to other people. So no matter what any media platform or government tell us you are only protecting yourself by getting the vaccine.

Same with masks, lets say you got tested and knew you never had covid would you still wear a mask? Yes lots of people would, why? To protect themselves because if they don't have the virus then how can they spread it? So i dont buy this bull that everyone is doing it to protect others they're not, they are protecting themselves (and rightly so)

When walking into a supermarket of 100 people are you thinking when you put your mask on 'I hope i don't spread this virus i haven't even got' or are you thinking 'I'm wearing this so i don't pick up the virus from the any of the 100 people in here.'

I don't think it's particularly selfish. Getting the vaccine ultimately is the most selfish thing you can do of the current preventative measures we have for covid. Because it doesn't stop spread, it doesn't stop infection, it does stop you getting seriously ill though, which is great. But it's not a preventative measure like social distancing, self isolation, mask wearing etc is - and those are more 'selfless' acts.

It isn't selfless, at all, to get the vaccine. Nobody is a hero for getting it and nobody is a criminal for not doing so. And I say this as someone who is very pro vaccine in all this and don't get why you wouldn't get one unless you had specific medical reasoning.

Now, if everybody gets the vaccine to protect themselves, then ultimately that helps keep the virus under control and in the long run, helps others. But the act itself of all the measures is all about protecting yourself first and foremost.

But, suggesting boosters are needed for everybody just yet, it should wait, there's nothing wrong with thinking that. And it won't help vaccine hesitancy either. And you can be sure that the take up across all categories with the boosters will be lower than the initial take up of the vaccines.

It is well known that the vaccine reduces fhe spread of the virus.

 

[Deleted member 48881]

What I don't understand is if Germans atm who are dying from covid 19 are unvaccinated, it is something they chose, they risked, why do we still talk about the disease? If, or, vaccines don't work that well anymore, why again do we still talk about the disease, if we die we die, science done what it could, time to move on, the unlucky always die unfortunately, has been the case, and will be the case forever.

 

[mill]

Because males under 30 have a rare but possible chance of getting serious conditions from the jabs such as heart inflammation and the more jabs you get the higher the probability of you coming a cropper at some stage.

that’s not really how probability works mate.

Do you think if you do the lottery 3 weeks in a row, you have a higher probability of winning it in the 3rd week?

 

[mill]

Getting the vaccine does reduce the spread. It reduces the likelihood of you getting it in the first place. The fewer people get it, the slower the spread. So it’s really not the ‘most selfish thing you can do’.

 

[toffee82]

Wouldn't be surprised if masks are brought back and people are advised to work from home. Would be surprised if it went further than that but who knows. I'm very pro vaccine passport, that should be brought in for most large events etc.

If masks really reduce the spread (I think that they do by the way) then they should be mandated again.
I went to Majorca a few weeks ago and loads of people (particularly locals) were wearing them. They barely had any cases but they need tourism. Even staff working outdoors which I thought was a little extreme.
Back in the UK and 40,000 cases a day but barely any masks in sight (buses, pharmacies and shops etc.).
I don't blame anyone for choosing not to wear a mask though. Especially since Boris decided it wasn't necessary in a hospital.
In short, I think that we have lost our way and sense of community so much in this country that many won't wear a mask for a short amount of time in order to reduce the spread of a virus that has already killed well over 100k people.

 

[BlueToff]

It is well known that the vaccine reduces fhe spread of the virus.

Yes, if everybody has the vaccine it is much more likely that the spread of the virus will be prevented/lessened.

But its not the main aim of the vaccine.

1. Prevent death - it does this for the vast majority of people
2. Prevent serious illness - most people who have two doses are protected from this. Their natural immune system is usually enough anyway, even without a vaccine, so two doses on top is more than enough. However, it does wane so having boosters first and foremost for people in certain age ranges and then vulnerable groups is crucial, absolutely.
3. Prevent infection - the vaccines help with this, absolutely, but it is not the actual goal of them first and foremost. The most effective prevention to infection is either a) avoiding social contact - i.e. not realistic, or b) having got COVID already and having natural immunity. The vaccines on top then add another layer of protection. Now the more people who get vaccinated then yes, the more that helps with dropping infection rates right down.

The argument for boosters is a sound one. But rather than talk about how everybody needs a booster, let's focus on getting the people who really do need one done first, ey?

I've had COVID, I've had both jabs. I feel lucky I'd had one jab when I had COVID. I was still ill, and still aren't fully right, but I'd had one jab. The second jab set me back massively when I had it, but that probably was because I'd had COVID in between the doses. It wasn't nice though and as a fit 26-year-old I will admit even I have a bit of trepidation about going to get a booster given how crap I felt for weeks after the second jab. I'll do it if I have to, though I don't feel any particular rush to.

 

[BlueToff]

Getting the vaccine does reduce the spread. It reduces the likelihood of you getting it in the first place. The fewer people get it, the slower the spread. So it’s really not the ‘most selfish thing you can do’.

Of course it does in the long run because if enough people protect themselves first and foremost, then everyone is protected. I'm not saying that isn't the case.

But compare it to social distancing, mask wearing etc - those are actual measures where you are actively protecting others from yourself.

The vaccine isn't doing that. It's protecting you. When it starts to work in how we all want it to work (and how we've seen it work) is when the vast majority of people are vaccinated and that in turn gets infection rates down.

But having a booster should, for now, be focused on those who need it, for those of whom it is definitely safe. Then if fully fit adults need a third, if it's absolutely vital and there is absolute evidence, then sure, go ahead. But at the moment it feels like more fearmongering. Let's focus on getting people who definitely need the boosters done first, and then making sure people who still need their second doses are done too? And it is a good point about where does it stop? Is everyone going to need an annual jab against this thing? If that's the case, then we need to ask why and how this has developed the way it has.

I won't lie, I definitely have trepidation about getting a third booster. For one, I've got natural immunity that, according to my COVID pass (the NHS), lasts six months as I don't even need to get a vaccine passport for any events in that time. I have both vaccine doses, and the second one did me for weeks. I don't really want that to happen again, I'd only just got over it as it was before I then got a chest infection. It's crap. If I need one, if the evidence is there that the vaccine immunity for people in my age range and health etc wanes some, then of course I'll get it. I'm more concerned that my mum and dad get theirs, which they are doing this month.

 

[Neiler]

People getting the vaccine are only protecting themselves from death or being hospitalized because they can still transmit it to other people. So no matter what any media platform or government tell us you are only protecting yourself by getting the vaccine.

Same with masks, lets say you got tested and knew you never had covid would you still wear a mask? Yes lots of people would, why? To protect themselves because if they don't have the virus then how can they spread it? So i dont buy this bull that everyone is doing it to protect others they're not, they are protecting themselves (and rightly so)

When walking into a supermarket of 100 people are you thinking when you put your mask on 'I hope i don't spread this virus i haven't even got' or are you thinking 'I'm wearing this so i don't pick up the virus from the any of the 100 people in here.'

Thats exactly what masks do though, they protect others, the other great value is they reduce particles for all so - while no one method is a silver bullet, if two people are wearing masks interacting in a public place and one has covid there is a reduction in the transmission of the viral load.