Current Affairs Coronavirus Thread - Serious stuff !!!

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davek said:
It wasn't messy, mate. It simply wasn't there in anything like reasonable volume.

I remember before Christmas the AZ announcement of their vaccine results was met with a tepid response from certain scientific quarters. AZ went silent on that and then came back with another statement in the new year that they'd try and strike up a partnership with another vaccine maker. Then a few weeks later we had the big announcement that it was being rolled out here.

In short: it is little wonder many looked on with scepticism. Fair enough, they took a chance and the real world data on older groups looks to be fruitful. But that was a gamble that wasn't warranted by the trials. Let's not forget that.
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I could understand the prudence mate, i think AZ rushed Oxford to the finish line, the MRNAs breaking when they did i think caught them on the hop, the whole Oxford programme was bullish from the get go.

I think the result was inadequate data on the over 70's & data that accidently stumbled on 12 week dosing strategy. Thats enough for the cautious steps some countries took and I think that is fair enough. I think under normal circumstances the way the phase 3 trial was presented and its methodology would not have been enough for authorization, its only because of the impact of the pandemic.

That's not to say AZ isn't a good vaccine, it is and id take it, no problem. Its just the way Oxford/AZ went about didn't compel a particularly strong case across all age groups or had a robust methodology from Phase 3.
 
Neiler said:
I could understand the prudence mate, i think AZ rushed Oxford to the finish line, the MRNAs breaking when they did i think caught them on the hop, the whole Oxford programme was bullish from the get go.

I think the result was inadequate data on the over 70's & data that accidently stumbled on 12 week dosing strategy. Thats enough for the cautious steps some countries took and I think that is fair enough. I think under normal circumstances the way the phase 3 trial was presented and its methodology would not have been enough for authorization, its only because of the impact of the pandemic.

That's not to say AZ isn't a good vaccine, it is and id take it, no problem. Its just the way Oxford/AZ went about didn't compel a particularly strong case across all age groups or had a robust methodology from Phase 3.
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Precisely.
 
Barnfred 55 said:
I think the newspaper headlines, and the TV media reporting of this is poor tbh. Anybody would think they were actually trying to destabilise the vaccine process which is borderline criminal if true.

There have been a small number of blood clot cases across Europe in people that had recently taken the AZ vaccine. Some countries have suspended using the vaccine whilst they investigate the cases. Italy have stopped using that particular batch of vaccines but are still using other batches of AZ. All of the countries have stated that there is no evidence to suggest that the vaccine caused the blood clots and that they are acting as a precaution. The EMA themselves have come out and said categorically that there is no link and that countries should still continue to use the vaccine. Countries like France and Spain have confirmed they are using it as usual, as is the UK where close to 20m doses have been given.

The countries involved are perfectly within their rights to play it safe and investigate the clotting cases. Personally, given the small number of cases involved, I wonder if they are more in danger of putting lives at risk through covid dues to suspending the vaccines, but that's their decision to make.

I'm just disappointed at the way it is portrayed in our media. Some websites have a poll going on whether people would even have the AZ jab which I think is disgraceful.
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Tend to agree mate the reporting is poor, yesterday was worse, some countries stopped vaccinating from a concerning batch - but it was reported that they stopped using AZ all together. I wonder if the countries who have stopped using it, maybe have had trouble identifying the concerning batch - it went to 17 countries - that speculation, but its crossed my mind.

I hear Thailand have either delayed or stopped its use today to.

Worth keeping an eye on definitely but id be taking it if offered it.
 
Neiler said:
I could understand the prudence mate, i think AZ rushed Oxford to the finish line, the MRNAs breaking when they did i think caught them on the hop, the whole Oxford programme was bullish from the get go.

I think the result was inadequate data on the over 70's & data that accidently stumbled on 12 week dosing strategy. Thats enough for the cautious steps some countries took and I think that is fair enough. I think under normal circumstances the way the phase 3 trial was presented and its methodology would not have been enough for authorization, its only because of the impact of the pandemic.

That's not to say AZ isn't a good vaccine, it is and id take it, no problem. Its just the way Oxford/AZ went about didn't compel a particularly strong case across all age groups or had a robust methodology from Phase 3.
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Their goal wasnt to jump through red tape.

Their goal was to produce a vaccine that saved lives.

Something they achieved 100%.
 
Neiler said:
Tend to agree mate the reporting is poor, yesterday was worse, some countries stopped vaccinating from a concerning batch - but it was reported that they stopped using AZ all together. I wonder if the countries who have stopped using it, maybe have had trouble identifying the concerning batch - it went to 17 countries - that speculation, but its crossed my mind.

I hear Thailand have either delayed or stopped its use today to.

Worth keeping an eye on definitely but id be taking it if offered it.
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I had it yesterday lol

My wife is a real worrier too so the timing of this couldn't be worse. She got a bit panicky when we got to the centre but she's fine now. I'd like to think the media have no idea how much effect they have on people, but ...
 
Neiler said:
Cautionary tale coming out over here today, that shows the risks in building immunity and between doses.

www.irishtimes.com

Covid-19: Nine die in Trim nursing home despite having had first vaccination

Full immunity does not kick in until at least a week after second dose
www.irishtimes.com www.irishtimes.com
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That's really sad that those people died so close to being protected. But it's widely accepted that it takes upto 3 weeks to get into your system. We've been told that from the outset and it's also in the literature handed out.

I don't think that particular outbreak proves anything as regards the timing of the second jab though. I'm not sure if you were trying to indicate this or not.
 
Barnfred 55 said:
That's really sad that those people died so close to being protected. But it's widely accepted that it takes upto 3 weeks to get into your system. We've been told that from the outset and it's also in the literature handed out.

I don't think that particular outbreak proves anything as regards the timing of the second jab though. I'm not sure if you were trying to indicate this or not.
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No not really on the dosing, I’m on record though as an advocate for the recommended intervals mind. More just the cautionary note, that can come with the relief and subsequent euphoria you can get after and between doses 1&2 and on the building immunity.

Really sad story, you can imagine how excited and relieved their families were after they had the vaccines given after a year of separation in the most part!
 
Hospital data:

Another good day with falls again everywhere on both measures but a little more slowly.

UK total:

Patients 7720 - it was 39, 248 at the peak on 18 Jan - (fall of 31, 528 in 53 days)

Ventilators 1111 - it was 4077 at the peak on 24 Jan - (fall of 2966 in 47 days)

England only:-

Patients: down 296 in day to 6391 v 8594 last week

Peak was 34, 336 on 18 Jan (fall 27, 945 in 53 days)

Ventilators: Down in day 78 to 1023 v 1417 last week

Peak was 3736 on 24 Jan (fall 2713 in 47 days)

Regions:

Patient // Ventilators // change in past 24 hours and v last week

East down 19 to 588 v 864 // down 9 to 93 v 131

London down 62 to 1273 v 1723 // down 26 to 310 v448

Midlands down 82 to 1401 v 1928 // down 13 to 229 v 291

NE & Yorks down 28 to 1049 v 1380// down 12 to 131 v 202

North West down 40 to 1040 v 1311 // down 8 to 128 v 158

South East down 48 to 798 v 1063 // down 8 to 97 v 142

South West down 17 to 242 v 325 // down 2 to 35 v 45
 
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