Current Affairs Anti-fascists (antifa), and a nationwide resistance of hate.

[Ruairi77]

Just to roll the conversation back a bit.

One of the things I've seen most echo'ed is the equalisation of anti-fascist groups, and the extreme right.

The extreme right want ethnic cleansing.

The anti-fascists want not that.

The problem is that they are going about it the wrong way, they are actually doing more harm than good and increasing the power of the far right.
There are far more effective ways of marginalizing the far right than getting dressed in a uniform, covering your face and then getting carried away with yourself and throwing a bin through a starbucks window.
They're ceding the moral high-ground and undoing the good work of many.

 

[Connor]

Big fan of these folks webbing far-right freaks, like.

Lots of the other stuff they do, I could do without.

But attacking Nazis, Fascists and Gammons. Big fan.

 

[dholliday]

What are Antifa fighting against here, @Number_25 ?

After threats from Antifa bookstore owned by Israelis closes

This happened in my old area where I lived for over 5 years. It's always had a bad rep, can feel quite edgy despite recent gentrification but I personally never saw any issues, people from all kinds of backgrounds live happily among each other.

The reason this bookstore got threatened by Antifa isn't because of israeli government policy, it's because one of the store owners said in a public Facebook post that one must understand the Right if one wants to effectively avoid it. Antifa, famously, isn't a fan of such thinking.

This same subgroup of Antifa (TOP Berlin) were also the same ones who disrupted AfD's march for women's freedoms (in the wake of mass sexual assaults from migrants). Other subgroups continue to disrupt women's rights marches, and in kafkaesque fashion claiming they are doing it for feminism.

Resistance to hate indeed.

Maybe now you understand a little why most of the replies to your thread are vehemently anti-Antifa? Their methods are counter-productive, and their principles messily inconsistent. Not an effective fight against anything.

And Western society is actually doing ok, in the grand scheme of things. Too much reading into online-tribalism makes it sounds like we're in a cultural war. I get sucked in too! But actually, we're all mostly doing ok.

 

[peteblue]

The problem is that they are going about it the wrong way, they are actually doing more harm than good and increasing the power of the far right.
There are far more effective ways of marginalizing the far right than getting dressed in a uniform, covering your face and then getting carried away with yourself and throwing a bin through a starbucks window.
They're ceding the moral high-ground and undoing the good work of many.

Far left, far right, they always do it........

 

[Carl O'Ancelotti]

Can see the FA taking a very dim view of this..

 

[Redstarrob]

Bunch of spineless cowards hiding behind bandanas pretending to be the peace movement.

I’m all for free speech, if I disagree with someone then I debate with them. These clowns prevent the debate by shutting down the narrative and if anyone dare disagrees they get labelled a nazi

They’re so stupid they don’t realise how easy they have it, calling for communist state and hiding behind the police whilst giving them abuse. The irony is the first thing they’d lose in a communist state would be the ability to speak up against the regime

Quite ironic that they’ll also call out the capitalist culture as being wrong yet go home and play on their consoles whilst drinking a £10 flat white Frappuccino with soy milk

Bunch of ferrets

A bit insulting to ferrets there mate

 

[mmmmsnouts]

My admittedly limited understanding of antifa is they are basically anarchists and often propped up by Russia to foment chaos. If they were a real force with any power of any kind, wouldn’t we have heard about them at all before, oh, about 18 months ago?

 

[dholliday]

My admittedly limited understanding of antifa is they are basically anarchists and often propped up by Russia to foment chaos. If they were a real force with any power of any kind, wouldn’t we have heard about them at all before, oh, about 18 months ago?

Amateur anarchists, is fair. They've been around for decades, but the cut-off point for what we're talking about is post-Fall of the Berlin Wall. There's no real association with Russia (it's amazing how much credit Russia gets for propping up stuff).

I used to hang out with some Berlin Antifa. Funny bunch who I got on with but they didn't have much of a plan between them. They mostly enjoyed drinking in parks and chilling, but at night would get the itch for edginess. I broke up a fight once as one of them kept being called a Nazi by a drunk local who seemingly kept missing the Skinheads against Nazis badges. Another time a couple of rowdy Antifa threw glass bottles towards my face screaming Kapitalistisches Schwein! because I was photographing the Maifest (May 1 demo).

As with most people of any background, Antifa members are alright for the most part, but collectively they do & think some really stupid scheiße.

 

[SteveSC]

My admittedly limited understanding of antifa is they are basically anarchists and often propped up by Russia to foment chaos. If they were a real force with any power of any kind, wouldn’t we have heard about them at all before, oh, about 18 months ago?

Antifa were a legitimate peaceful group who were infiltrated by the anarchists you mention which then made them a more extreme group in parts. They were not started by anarchists.

They were well known though before Trump won but obviously with the divisiveness he brought they grew in popularity among you anarchist types. Which was not good for the main group.

Much like many groups that start out peacefuly a bad element infiltrate and try change how they do things.

I am not defending them nor do i care about them and i think they should rethink who they allow join their movement. That being said, i am guessing the original group doesn't exist and have quietly gone into the shadows and distanced themselves from what its become.

There have been a few unbiased documentaries on their cause and movement (and whats happened to them) on several legitimate sources online.

 

[ilikecheese]

Anyone who shuts down folks in the 'alt right' movement is alright by me. Their tactics need work, but there has to be a counterpoint to racism, bigotry, and hate.

I mean those alt right fudgeheads like Bannon played the identity politics card to incite hate and fear and won a big election doing so. The right try to make the left own identity politics when they use them even more...to incite fear and rage with their base.

So sick and tired of the term Identity Politics being tied to progressives when conservatives play that card 24/7.

This Earth is neither White nor Christian. Playing to that narrative is a winner atm. Sad.

 

[orchard]

How can we call militants 'anarchists' ? Once more for the slow one at the back please.

 

[dholliday]

How can we call anarchists 'militants' ?

fixed...i.e. they can mean much the same thing when describing Antifa.

 

[dholliday]

Anyone who shuts down folks in the 'alt right' movement is alright by me. Their tactics need work, but there has to be a counterpoint to racism, bigotry, and hate.

I mean those alt right fudgeheads like Bannon played the identity politics card to incite hate and fear and won a big election doing so. The right try to make the left own identity politics when they use them even more...to incite fear and rage with their base.

So sick and tired of the term Identity Politics being tied to progressives when conservatives play that card 24/7.

This Earth is neither White nor Christian. Playing to that narrative is a winner atm. Sad.

shouting "fascist!" at non-fascist people because you disagree with their views is playing identity politics: defining the other by their perceived group-belonging. i agree both sides play that game in different ways.

 

[Groucho]

Anyone who shuts down folks in the 'alt right' movement is alright by me. Their tactics need work, but there has to be a counterpoint to racism, bigotry, and hate.

I mean those alt right fudgeheads like Bannon played the identity politics card to incite hate and fear and won a big election doing so. The right try to make the left own identity politics when they use them even more...to incite fear and rage with their base.

So sick and tired of the term Identity Politics being tied to progressives when conservatives play that card 24/7.

This Earth is neither White nor Christian. Playing to that narrative is a winner atm. Sad.

In my opinion it's absolutely OK to punch a Nazi. I mean, we spent 6 years trying to blow them up so.....

Make Racism Bad Again.

 

[dholliday]

In my opinion it's absolutely OK to punch a Nazi. I mean, we spent 6 years trying to blow them up so.....

'You' spent 6 years at war with the actual Nazis, as in Nazi Germany. Nazi Germany hasn't existed since 1945.

As said before, your view here is a dangerous stance and is potentially as bad as the violent racists themselves, for you first have to define & identify a Nazi. Who is one? Nowadays most people have been called a Nazi if they've revealed certain opposing views to progressive liberalism. So saying it's ok to punch a Nazi empowers violent types to punch people they don't agree with, the victim they'll call a Nazi so as to defend their violent assault.

First, they punch Richard Spencer and I said nothing.
Then they punch Milo and I still said nothing.
Then they punch Jordan Peterson and I remained silent.
Then they punched dholliday and I laughed a little.
But then they punched my face and there was no one left to defend me.