Current Affairs Ukraine

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The Blitz were horrific. Coventry got annihilated.
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I know Coventry were blitzed. I don't know how bad, we know of the London blitz, while Liverpool was concentrated on town and the docks.

I'm stating can you imagine the whole cities being wiped out? Not just the city centre. I can't quite get my head around it. The Russians are almost playing out a computer game simulation. If only that was true.
 
I know Coventry were blitzed. I don't know how bad, we know of the London blitz, while Liverpool was concentrated on town and the docks.

I'm stating can you imagine the whole cities being wiped out? Not just the city centre. I can't quite get my head around it. The Russians are almost playing out a computer game simulation. If only that was true.
Yeah its horrific. I will say though, its not the first time its happened this century by any stretch of the imagination. Aleppo in Syria for instance was pretty much flattened. Then going back to the 90s, Sarajevo and Dubrovnik.
 
He's off being a passive aggressive bellend calling a war "a special operation" in the Ale House.

If people are banned from threads can they see quotes? I'd hate to he impolite.

@Kev The Rat , absolute cretin.
Well I mean if Kev thinks its a special military operation then maybe it is? He is a tactical genius after all, identified Russia's plan of attacking from East, West, South and North from day 1.
 
Its clear now and been clear for years that Ukraine joining NATO was wishful thinking. By saying he no longer wants to join he is challenging Putin's reason for the invasion i.e. NATO is expanding wah wah. Imo he has acted perfectly as a wartime leader.

You can't just fold to larger countries pressure imo, especially when the people of Ukraine have twice this century overthrown governments which were pro-Russian. Ukraine wants to be free of Russia.
People rely on their leaders to keep them safe. Zelenskyy knew what the outcome of refusing to back down on NATO/neutrality etc would be, and that has happened. He is now open to negotiations. I think diplomacy has to be used at all cost to first and foremost keep people safe. Instead, Ukraine are plunged into war without perhaps the physical backing Zelenskyy expected.
 
People rely on their leaders to keep them safe. Zelenskyy knew what the outcome of refusing to back down on NATO/neutrality etc would be, and that has happened. He is now open to negotiations. I think diplomacy has to be used at all cost to first and foremost keep people safe. Instead, Ukraine are plunged into war without perhaps the physical backing Zelenskyy expected.
Diplomacy works but only if you are negotiating with a side acting in good faith, aka not Russia. Russia's demands of Ukraine were very unrealistic and I wouldn't have accepted them if I was Zelenskyy.

All this death and destruction is sad but at some point you have to fight and stand up for your freedom, otherwise you end as a Belarus or Chechnya. Ukrainians are still massively in favor of this war btw according to all polls.
 
Diplomacy works but only if you are negotiating with a side acting in good faith, aka not Russia. Russia's demands of Ukraine were very unrealistic and I wouldn't have accepted them if I was Zelenskyy.

All this death and destruction is sad but at some point you have to fight and stand up for your freedom, otherwise you end as a Belarus or Chechnya.
If NATO was categorically off the table with no western forces stationed in Ukraine, neutrality guaranteed and certain terms regarding Crimea agreed, would this be happening? It will be interesting to see what terms look like if any negotiation is agreed, and if this in fact could have been agreed before how many thousand have died. The west has a huge role to play in this with it’s legitimising of Putin and Russia’s corruption. I just think that short term destruction should have been a priority to stop with then a subsequent shift on how to deal with Russia explored. I’m just not convinced Zelenskyy has truly acted in the best interest of his people by not being open to diplomacy to begin with.
 
If NATO was categorically off the table with no western forces stationed in Ukraine, neutrality guaranteed and certain terms regarding Crimea agreed, would this be happening? It will be interesting to see what terms look like if any negotiation is agreed, and if this in fact could have been agreed before how many thousand have died. The west has a huge role to play in this with it’s legitimising of Putin and Russia’s corruption. I just think that short term destruction should have been a priority to stop with then a subsequent shift on how to deal with Russia explored. I’m just not convinced Zelenskyy has truly acted in the best interest of his people by not being open to diplomacy to begin with.
I think it would still have happened as its not as simple as Russia being scared of Ukraine joining NATO. They are also scared of Ukraine joining the EU + Putin views Ukraine as rightfully Russian anyway and Ukrainians as Russians who have been led astray.

Also the only reason Ukraine wanted to join NATO was because they were invaded in 2014. Before that there was no support for NATO membership at all.
 
I think it would still have happened as its not as simple as Russia being scared of Ukraine joining NATO. They are also scared of Ukraine joining the EU + Putin views Ukraine as rightfully Russian anyway and Ukrainians as Russians who have been led astray.
I don’t know how sure we can be that Putin would have invaded regardless of assurances if NATO etc. I think he is using the Ukraine as Russia’s rightful land to get Russian citizens on board more than an actual justification to invade. This has a lot to do with the geopolitical makeup of NATO’s relationship with ex-soviet states, and Russia wanting a clear distinction between them. Again, I just think more could have been done.
 
I don’t know how sure we can be that Putin would have invaded regardless of assurances if NATO etc. I think he is using the Ukraine as Russia’s rightful land to get Russian citizens on board more than an actual justification to invade. This has a lot to do with the geopolitical makeup of NATO’s relationship with ex-soviet states, and Russia wanting a clear distinction between them. Again, I just think more could have been done.
The reason Eastern European countries want to join NATO is purely down to Russia continuing to interfere in their affairs. Its not fair really to just deny Ukraine membership of NATO or the EU, as this war is entirely Russias doing.

Since Ukraine became independent, Russia has poisoned presidents, rigged elections, annexed Crimea, armed and supported separatists for 8+ years. If they had just left Ukraine alone none of this would be happening.

Putin is a paranoid despot who thinks NATO is going to one day invade Russia, which is of course ridiculous. He has deliberately interfered in the West by supporting things like Brexit and targetting the US elections through propaganda bots. HE has bought this on himself
 
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