Current Affairs Ukraine

[Spadge Vernacular]

As I say, that sort of stuff doesn’t wash with me. Israel is every bit the aggressor - they have gone way beyond reasonable self-defence. The west has fallen over itself in its hypocrisy and craven appeasement of a far-right headbanger terrorist Israeli government.

I do not disagree with anything you are saying, mate, it is incredibly upsetting to see what that mad man is doing to those poor people. The stories about kids being operated on without anesthesia is the stuff of nightmares.

 

[Cecil]

As I say, that sort of stuff doesn’t wash with me. Israel is every bit the aggressor - they have gone way beyond reasonable self-defence. The west has fallen over itself in its hypocrisy and craven appeasement of a far-right headbanger terrorist Israeli government.

All captured in 4K too and yet the western world, bar a few, are absolutely silent. If I was punched by someone and in self defence I punch them back, punch their nan, punch their kid, kick their dog and blow their house up is that a reasonable response?

 

[Runub]

Russian jet crashes carrying Ukrainian PoWs - Moscow

A Russian transport plane with 65 Ukrainians onboard crashes in a region bordering Ukraine, says Russia.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Spadge Vernacular]

All captured in 4K too and yet the western world, bar a few, are absolutely silent. If I was punched by someone and in self defence I punch them back, punch their nan, punch their kid, kick their dog and blow their house up is that a reasonable response?

This should really be in the appropriate thread but as said earlier, and following your analogy, it isn't a matter of a person being punched, it is one of the biggest terrorist atrocities to have ever been committed. Killing over a thousand people, raping and kidnapping the same was always going to provoke a severe response. We can all agree that the response has been truly horrific and not reasonable at all but Hamas/Iran green lighted this and I am sure did so knowing what would follow.

 

[Noisy noise annoys]

This should really be in the appropriate thread but as said earlier, and following your analogy, it isn't a matter of a person being punched, it is one of the biggest terrorist atrocities to have ever been committed. Killing over a thousand people, raping and kidnapping the same was always going to provoke an severe response. We can all agree that the response has been truly horrific and not reasonable at all but Hamas/Iran green lighted this and I am sure did so knowing what would follow.

In no way in the world is this response justified by October 7th m, not even to Netanyahu- it’s just a very convenient way for him to destroy Palestine under the ‘self defence’ lie

 

[tsubaki]

This should really be in the appropriate thread but as said earlier, and following your analogy, it isn't a matter of a person being punched, it is one of the biggest terrorist atrocities to have ever been committed. Killing over a thousand people, raping and kidnapping the same was always going to provoke a severe response. We can all agree that the response has been truly horrific and not reasonable at all but Hamas/Iran green lighted this and I am sure did so knowing what would follow.

TBF there are still a lot of questions about that which should cause the official account to be at least re-examined.

I mean we know that the local military were reporting concerning things happening including practicing assaulting the fence; we know the Nova festival was moved to near the fence against local security forces wishes; Hamas’ capabilities and strengths were known and subsequent attacks have suggested the IDF still have a lot of intel within Gaza itself.

Hamas obviously carried out the initial attack, killing hundreds of civilians and hundreds more military and security personnel- but I do have a horrible feeling that some people thought that such a horror would allow them to do all manner of things that they’d never be able to do without such justification.

 

[Moomin]

In no way in the world is this response justified by October 7th m, not even to Netanyahu- it’s just a very convenient way for him to destroy Palestine under the ‘self defence’ lie

Imagine the destruction they would do in the West Bank if Hamas was there.......

 

[Spadge Vernacular]

In no way in the world is this response justified by October 7th m, not even to Netanyahu- it’s just a very convenient way for him to destroy Palestine under the ‘self defence’ lie

It is an outrage and Israsel under Likud are becoming the thing that they have historically sworn to oppose. But as I say, Hamas/Iran knew, and have been counting on an atrocious response.

Netanyahu is a madman but I'd suggest that Hamas/Iran clearly have as little regard for Gazans. Netanyahu will do as much damage as he can whilst Hamas are still holding civilian hostages and firing missiles into Israel etc. and he will keep falling back on what Hamas did. He doesn't want it to stop.

If Hamas cared and wanted the absolute nightmare that they have unleashed to stop we might be seeing inroads such as all of the hostages being released and all aggression against Israel stopped. They don't though and simply one part of a bigger picture of many moving parts.

As always innocent people are paying with their lives because of political dickheads.

 

[Mutzo Nutzo]

TBF there are still a lot of questions about that which should cause the official account to be at least re-examined.

I mean we know that the local military were reporting concerning things happening including practicing assaulting the fence; we know the Nova festival was moved to near the fence against local security forces wishes; Hamas’ capabilities and strengths were known and subsequent attacks have suggested the IDF still have a lot of intel within Gaza itself.

Hamas obviously carried out the initial attack, killing hundreds of civilians and hundreds more military and security personnel- but I do have a horrible feeling that some people thought that such a horror would allow them to do all manner of things that they’d never be able to do without such justification.

You can look at the original event and the way it was executed and say that yes it was planned that way and the response by the Israeli government was also predicted by Hamas and their handlers.

Israel responded as they always do - feet first , kill anything that moves and destroy everything. To me they fell right into the trap created by Hamas and Iran.

However my guess is that Hamas and Iran wanted the atrocities committed by Israel in Gaza to ignite the Arab world and bring down holy war on Israel. Fortunately that hasn’t happened - with most of the Arab world shaking their fists but not much else.

The events of Oct 7th committed by Hamas were evil, cruel, vile and subhuman and Israel had every right to respond but not to the extent they did. They have the resources to track down and kill everyone of the people involved in planning and executing the Oct 7th plan, instead they went full on wrath of god.

 

[Spadge Vernacular]

You can look at the original event and the way it was executed and say that yes it was planned that way and the response by the Israeli government was also predicted by Hamas and their handlers.

Israel responded as they always do - feet first , kill anything that moves and destroy everything. To me they fell right into the trap created by Hamas and Iran.

However my guess is that Hamas and Iran wanted the atrocities committed by Israel in Gaza to ignite the Arab world and bring down holy war on Israel. Fortunately that hasn’t happened - with most of the Arab world shaking their fists but not much else.

The events of Oct 7th committed by Hamas were evil, cruel, vile and subhuman and Israel had every right to respond but not to the extent they did. They have the resources to track down and kill everyone of the people involved in planning and executing the Oct 7th plan, instead they went full on wrath of god.

Just posted in the Iran thread

Iranian Supreme Leader Ali Khamenei criticized Islamic countries for not demanding a ceasefire for the Israel-Hamas war during a meeting with the Tehran branch of the Martyrs’ Commemoration National Congress.

Set your neighbours house on fire and keep pouring petrol on it whilst screaming outrage and that other neighbours should put the flames out. It is not even subtle.

 

[Spadge Vernacular]

 

[tsubaki]

You can look at the original event and the way it was executed and say that yes it was planned that way and the response by the Israeli government was also predicted by Hamas and their handlers.

Israel responded as they always do - feet first , kill anything that moves and destroy everything. To me they fell right into the trap created by Hamas and Iran.

However my guess is that Hamas and Iran wanted the atrocities committed by Israel in Gaza to ignite the Arab world and bring down holy war on Israel. Fortunately that hasn’t happened - with most of the Arab world shaking their fists but not much else.

The events of Oct 7th committed by Hamas were evil, cruel, vile and subhuman and Israel had every right to respond but not to the extent they did. They have the resources to track down and kill everyone of the people involved in planning and executing the Oct 7th plan, instead they went full on wrath of god.

The response was predictable, but it’s the circumstances that are what give me the concern that there is more to this.

Hamas absolutely carried out that attack, but why it did the damage it did should get far more attention than it does.

 

[Mutzo Nutzo]

Just posted in the Iran thread



Set your neighbours house on fire and keep pouring petrol on it whilst screaming outrage and that other neighbours should put the flames out. It is not even subtle.

Yup. It’s obvious that they are the orchestrators of this entire situation. However they didn’t bank on the apathy and disinterest shown by the Arab world.

 

[Drico]

Yup. It’s obvious that they are the orchestrators of this entire situation. However they didn’t bank on the apathy and disinterest shown by the Arab world.

They've not been paying attention, then.

The Arab world utterly abandoned the Palestinians decades ago. They've been bought off by the Americans since the time of Jimmy Carter. Sisi in Egypt couldn't care less about the Palestinians. He's merely concerned with his own survival. The less said about the rich Gulf states the better...

 

[tsubaki]

They've not been paying attention, then.

The Arab world utterly abandoned the Palestinians decades ago. They've been bought off by the Americans since the time of Jimmy Carter. Sisi in Egypt couldn't care less about the Palestinians. He's merely concerned with his own survival. The less said about the rich Gulf states the better...

I think this is a bit wide of the mark - it’s more that they can’t do anything to support the maximum Palestinian cause (to remove Israel) because of the size of Israel’s ally, who they are for varying reasons dependent on - the Gulf states and Saudi to protect them against Iran and for the economic benefits, and the rest out of them for the aid and out of fear.

In a multipolar world, especially one where the Iranian threat is much less real, the opportunities to do something for the Palestinians increase by a lot. I think we’re already at the stage of a Palestinian state on the 1967 borders (or close enough to not make much of a difference) coming as a result of this, and further Israeli intransigence might bring a nightmare scenario down upon their heads.