Current Affairs The Labour Party

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It's easy to blame the Corbyn projects failure on Brexit, and I am no going to suggest that it didn't play a part in some thinking but the feedback from the doorsteps was that voters were saying they wouldn't vote for 'that man' [Corbyn] and post-election research identified Corbyn as a bigger problem than Brexit.
I’ve heard this from several people so no doubt it’s true, but I’m always curious what people would say when asked what it was that they disliked about corbyn so much. There’s no doubt the smear campaign against him was the biggest I’ve seen in my lifetime.
Think @Number_25 did door knocking before the election and knew pretty much the way things were gonna go.
 
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I’ve heard this from several people so no doubt it’s true, but I’m always curious what people would say when asked what it was that they disliked about corbyn so much. There’s no doubt the smear campaign against him was the biggest I’ve seen in my lifetime.
Think @Number_25 did door knocking before the election and knew pretty much the way things were gonna go.
Completely anecdotally - the impression I got when discussing Corbyn is people actually didn't dislike him personally at all, which surprised me. They just disliked what he was representing.

I feel like many people thought he was correctly identifying legitimate economic and societal problems we currently face and will face in the future, but was then applying solutions that stopped being relevant 40 years ago to those problems.
 
Completely anecdotally - the impression I got when discussing Corbyn is people actually didn't dislike him personally at all, which surprised me. They just disliked what he was representing.

I feel like many people thought he was correctly identifying legitimate economic and societal problems we currently face and will face in the future, but was then applying solutions that stopped being relevant 40 years ago to those problems.

That was it for me for sure. I thought he was an idealist, I have no doubt he genuinely held his principles. But I also personally had no doubt that his 'solutions' to problems would actually cause more harm than good.

For a quick example, free broadband - would mean everyone had free crap broadband, but stifle the marketplace to make good broadband harder to attain, stifling innovation. The "NATIONALISE EVERYTHING!" approach was also another example of his ideology being dangerous - his supporters deny that was happening, but it's right there in the 2019 manifesto; he wanted to nationalise pretty much everything.

These are examples of the problems people had with Corbyn - many of his policies were fine, like housing as one example, but it very much felt like there was a thin veil over what his real intent was, and it was an extreme left agenda that would have hurt the UK badly IMO.

I disliked him personally in only one area, which was also his strength - his stubborness. His decision to oppose the IHRA definition of anti-semitism just to make a stupid point was the final of many nails in the coffin for me; it showed that he was an ideological extremist and had no place in a position of power as a result.
 
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Completely anecdotally - the impression I got when discussing Corbyn is people actually didn't dislike him personally at all, which surprised me. They just disliked what he was representing.

I feel like many people thought he was correctly identifying legitimate economic and societal problems we currently face and will face in the future, but was then applying solutions that stopped being relevant 40 years ago to those problems.
Itls all about how the media sell any party.

Corbyn's party delivered a stunning result in 2017 because they had a massive deficit to make up after Brown and Miliband's failures and they had the media almost 100% against them with viciously scurillous campaigns. It was only because he caught a mood of anti-austerity that he was able to cut through. By 2019 the Brexit BS was the only game in town...and thanks to tits like Starmer the LP got their messaging all wrong on it and were obliterated.

If Starmer had 50% of the bad press and media Corbyn got his party would be trailing 20 odd percentage points today. As it is, he has a decent coverage from them and is still trailing by 14%.
 
Itls all about how the media sell any party.

Corbyn's party delivered a stunning result in 2017 because they had a massive deficit to make up after Brown and Miliband's failures and they had the media almost 100% against them with viciously scurillous campaigns. It was only because he caught a mood of anti-austerity that he was able to cut through. By 2019 the Brexit BS was the only game in town...and thanks to tits like Starmer the LP got their messaging all wrong on it and were obliterated.

If Starmer had 50% of the bad press and media Corbyn got his party would be trailing 20 odd percentage points today. As it is, he has a decent coverage from them and is still trailing by 14%.
I don't really agree with much of this, but it's a matter of conjecture I guess.

However, there is one thing I need to pick up on: "Corbyn's party delivered a stunning result in 2017"

A stunning result?

Losing to an extremely poor PM who run the worst campaign in modern electoral history?
Losing to a party who by that time had been in power for 7 years?
Losing to a party that gained their largest percentage vote share since Thatcher under a horrendous leader?
Losing to a party that was at war with itself over Brexit?

Maybe this attitude shows just how far the Labour party's standards have fallen. 1945 was a stunning result. 1997 was a stunning result. You know why? Because they won.
 
I don't really agree with much of this, but it's a matter of conjecture I guess.

However, there is one thing I need to pick up on: "Corbyn's party delivered a stunning result in 2017"

A stunning result?

Losing to an extremely poor PM who run the worst campaign in modern electoral history?
Losing to a party who by that time had been in power for 7 years?
Losing to a party that gained their largest percentage vote share since Thatcher under a horrendous leader?
Losing to a party that was at war with itself over Brexit?

Maybe this attitude shows just how far the Labour party's standards have fallen. 1945 was a stunning result. 1997 was a stunning result. You know why? Because they won.

May threatened pensions, Corbyn was deemed as a no hoper so pensioners basically stayed at home to give May a kicking.

Corbyn still couldn't win.

2019 saw him the Tory voter base take no chances, combined with northern Brexit voters, and Corbyn took a thumping as a result.

Even with nearly everything going to Corbyn's advantage, he couldn't win a GE. He could never win a GE; no one with his political position could.
 
The problem we face, Dave, is that most of the country does not appear to align around our left (or those on the opposite right) thinking, they are a gang of spineless moderates - occupants of the fabled centre ground.

We might be the minority but our solidarity and demands would be better heard in the Socialist Workers Party, Socialist Labour Party, the Socialist Party or even the Communist Party. We don't need further dilution.
Getting into 'the Peoples Front of Judea' territory here.
 
Completely anecdotally - the impression I got when discussing Corbyn is people actually didn't dislike him personally at all, which surprised me. They just disliked what he was representing.

I feel like many people thought he was correctly identifying legitimate economic and societal problems we currently face and will face in the future, but was then applying solutions that stopped being relevant 40 years ago to those problems.
Mainly my experience but with some concern about his views on security also.
 
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I don't really agree with much of this, but it's a matter of conjecture I guess.

However, there is one thing I need to pick up on: "Corbyn's party delivered a stunning result in 2017"

A stunning result?

Losing to an extremely poor PM who run the worst campaign in modern electoral history?
Losing to a party who by that time had been in power for 7 years?
Losing to a party that gained their largest percentage vote share since Thatcher under a horrendous leader?
Losing to a party that was at war with itself over Brexit?

Maybe this attitude shows just how far the Labour party's standards have fallen. 1945 was a stunning result. 1997 was a stunning result. You know why? Because they won.
You went round the houses and never addressed the point: THE MEDIA and its horrendous misrepresentation of Corbyn and his message.

Add that to the state the Blairites and Miliband left the LP in, and the denial of a majority to a Tory Party riding high in the polls pre-election WAS a stunning result.

No LP leader - even Foot - has ever faced that barrage of BS and hatred to claw back lost ground to the Tory scum.
 
You went round the houses and never addressed the point: THE MEDIA and its horrendous misrepresentation of Corbyn and his message.

Add that to the state the Blairites and Miliband left the LP in, and the denial of a majority to a Tory Party riding high in the polls pre-election WAS a stunning result.

No LP leader - even Foot - has ever faced that barrage of BS and hatred to claw back lost ground to the Tory scum.

It's a bit like us playing a cup final against Man City, losing 5-4 and you coming away saying “That was a stunning result for us”. Nah. We lost. No loss can ever be deemed a 'stunning result'.

As for going around the houses, I said I disagree with your analysis of the loss. The whole "it was 'THE MEDIA' who lost it" argument is a common trope wheeled out by people who have a deep distain for the working classes ability to think for themselves. It's horrendously patronising.
 
It's a bit like us playing a cup final against Man City, losing 5-4 and you coming away saying “That was a stunning result for us”. Nah. We lost. No loss can ever be deemed a 'stunning result'.

As for going around the houses, I said I disagree with your analysis of the loss. The whole "it was 'THE MEDIA' who lost it" argument is a common trope wheeled out by people who have a deep distain for the working class's ability to think for themselves. It's horrendously patronising.
It's not though is it? In the 'parallel' example you use, there's a clear winner. The 2017 election, on the other hand, there was no clear winner; it was a hung parliament with the Tories having to ask the DUP when they could wipe their arses.
 
It's not though is it? In the 'parallel' example you use, there's a clear winner. The 2017 election, on the other hand, there was no clear winner; it was a hung parliamnet with the Tories having to ask the DUP when they could wipe their arses.
hahaha, okay then Dave, how about you go and speak to somebody who actually needs a Labour government right now - somebody who is having their benefits cut - and you tell them 2017 was a ‘stunning result’ and see the reaction you get.

I'd love to see it.
 
hahaha, okay then Dave, how about you go and speak to somebody who actually needs a Labour government right now - somebody who is having their benefits cut - and you tell them 2017 was a ‘stunning result’ and see the reaction you get.

I'd love to see it.

My/our benefits went up in March. I mean we had a long chat how to spend the extra 40p a week, but still.
 
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