Current Affairs The Labour Party

[Old Blue 2]

Maybe many of us don't see the need? It's perhaps noticeable that unions have only endured in areas, such as the public sector, where there is a monopoly provision of services, so strikes retain their ability to blackmail. When no such monopoly exists, you don't appear to have unions as "strikes" is all they offer. They need to get with the times if they want to be attractive.

I have to say this post is a little short-sighted. Perhaps from never being in a nion, Bruce?

What the media have concentrated on is the strike being about a pay increase. The strike is about a much broader front than that. It also embraces conditions of service and redundancies. Now the media and rail bosses and the Government will trumpet that efficiencies are required and 'new technology' means that less staff are needed. Well, we have seen how efficiencies and less staff have affected the Police service for starters.

The unions also serve to protect members from unfair dismissal, and a whole range of issues pertinent to the work place. If you've never been a union rep, Bruce, you will have little knowledge of such things, as a lot of individual issues go 'under the radar' of ordinary people.

So I would respectfully suggest that before you say that '..."strikes" is all they offer...'. Unions are 'with the times' - it's employers (i.e. the top strata of society that still have an iron grip on all industries) that need to get with the times...

 

[The Gueye Science]

UK real wages will still be lower in 2026 than they were in 2008

The UK is forecast to endure almost two decades of stagnant earnings.

www.newstatesman.com

This is part of the reason why productivity growth in the UK is so poor. Why would any company make a big upfront capital investment in a market whose consumers will have less disposable income in the future than they do now?

 

[Bruce Wayne]

I have to say this post is a little short-sighted. Perhaps from never being in a nion, Bruce?

What the media have concentrated on is the strike being about a pay increase. The strike is about a much broader front than that. It also embraces conditions of service and redundancies. Now the media and rail bosses and the Government will trumpet that efficiencies are required and 'new technology' means that less staff are needed. Well, we have seen how efficiencies and less staff have affected the Police service for starters.

The unions also serve to protect members from unfair dismissal, and a whole range of issues pertinent to the work place. If you've never been a union rep, Bruce, you will have little knowledge of such things, as a lot of individual issues go 'under the radar' of ordinary people.

So I would respectfully suggest that before you say that '..."strikes" is all they offer...'. Unions are 'with the times' - it's employers (i.e. the top strata of society that still have an iron grip on all industries) that need to get with the times...

It's a pity that unions never seem to prepare members for the future but instead try to insulate them from it.

 

[NilSatisOptimum]

It's a pity that unions never seem to prepare members for the future but instead try to insulate them from it.

Don't think that's fare most unions have opposed Conservative governments in recent times for the reasons many wage workers now find themselves in, work does not pay.

 

[NilSatisOptimum]

I have to say this post is a little short-sighted. Perhaps from never being in a nion, Bruce?

What the media have concentrated on is the strike being about a pay increase. The strike is about a much broader front than that. It also embraces conditions of service and redundancies. Now the media and rail bosses and the Government will trumpet that efficiencies are required and 'new technology' means that less staff are needed. Well, we have seen how efficiencies and less staff have affected the Police service for starters.

The unions also serve to protect members from unfair dismissal, and a whole range of issues pertinent to the work place. If you've never been a union rep, Bruce, you will have little knowledge of such things, as a lot of individual issues go 'under the radar' of ordinary people.

So I would respectfully suggest that before you say that '..."strikes" is all they offer...'. Unions are 'with the times' - it's employers (i.e. the top strata of society that still have an iron grip on all industries) that need to get with the times...

 

[edge]

It's a pity that unions never seem to prepare members for the future but instead try to insulate them from it.

They don't, merseyrail have done a deal 20 yrs a go to do just that.
They have done a pay deal this year, Scots and Welsh the same
Drivers deals for change are already in place and have been for years , there isn't the infrastructure to implement them .
The RMT have NOT said there will be no changes, they want a debate on them , and a structured move on that direction.
Not mass sackings , a pay deal that is paid for out of there pensions in the long run.
ANY union or indeed any fair mined person would agree this is not the way to go about making changes for the future.

 

[NilSatisOptimum]

Excellent line from Starmer about Conservative government, paycuts for Nurses pay rises for Bankers.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

They don't, merseyrail have done a deal 20 yrs a go to do just that.
They have done a pay deal this year, Scots and Welsh the same
Drivers deals for change are already in place and have been for years , there isn't the infrastructure to implement them .
The RMT have NOT said there will be no changes, they want a debate on them , and a structured move on that direction.
Not mass sackings , a pay deal that is paid for out of there pensions in the long run.
ANY union or indeed any fair mined person would agree this is not the way to go about making changes for the future.

I mean if you wanted to do a degree or gain some other qualification, would your union support you? There seems to be the standard schtick that members' lot is improved most when they're in a monopoly position and can therefore wield great power by going on strike. If that scenario doesn't exist then unions don't really do much because their entire focus is on extracting as much out of what is rather than preparing members for what will be.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1111/bjir.12571 this study looks at how young people feel about unions, and the number who are distinctly ambivalent has grown considerably over the last few decades, which strongly suggests that unions have failed to maintain their relevance in a more market driven economy. That study also found that women and non-white people were more likely than average to have an unfavourable view of unions, which again highlights how they have failed to adapt to a world in which their operations don't revolve around the kind of manual work done by "working class" men.

 

[Old Blue 2]

I mean if you wanted to do a degree or gain some other qualification, would your union support you? There seems to be the standard schtick that members' lot is improved most when they're in a monopoly position and can therefore wield great power by going on strike. If that scenario doesn't exist then unions don't really do much because their entire focus is on extracting as much out of what is rather than preparing members for what will be.

You haven't a clue about the lot of the ordinary working person, Bruce...

 

[Bruce Wayne]

You haven't a clue about the lot of the ordinary working person, Bruce...

I'm an ordinary working person. My wife is a nurse. What an odd statement to make. Indeed, I'm doing some research work at the moment on how working class people can transition when their livelihoods are disrupted, and suffice to say, unions are nowhere to be seen.

 

[Old Blue 2]

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1111/bjir.12571 this study looks at how young people feel about unions, and the number who are distinctly ambivalent has grown considerably over the last few decades, which strongly suggests that unions have failed to maintain their relevance in a more market driven economy. That study also found that women and non-white people were more likely than average to have an unfavourable view of unions, which again highlights how they have failed to adapt to a world in which their operations don't revolve around the kind of manual work done by "working class" men.

Forget your studies, get into the REAL WORLD, mate...

 

[Old Blue 2]

I'm an ordinary working person. My wife is a nurse. What an odd statement to make.

Not from what you've told us of your job in the past. Or was that a load of brown stuff in a field...?

 

[Bruce Wayne]

Forget your studies, get into the REAL WORLD, mate...

I don't know what you think academics actually do.

 

[Bruce Wayne]

Not from what you've told us of your job in the past. Or was that a load of brown stuff in a field...?

I'm a person and I work, therefore I'm an ordinary person. Maybe the fact that you think unions don't exist for "people like me" is half of the problem.