Current Affairs The Conservative Party

[Bruce Wayne]

not necessarily true with automation etc. also we are going to see a massive recession / depression leading to a massive increase in unemployment. So how does adding more unemployment help there?

Firstly, there is no evidence that automation has led to a reduction in employment. Secondly, recessions are temporary. Demographics rather less so.

 

[summerisle]

'irregardless' the wonders of a private education. These chinless little slugs are a great advert for bullying

Embiggens my hatred of them.

 

[summerisle]

Pants on fire time.

 

[mightymoyes]

 

[NorthernBlue]

Go to about 13:05 and hear what the whopper has to say about doctors and nurses and indenturing them.

 

[Walken]

Go to about 13:05 and hear what the whopper has to say about doctors and nurses and indenturing them.

A small and possibly cherry picked sample size, but it does give a little hope that many tory party members are unhappy with their party.

Perhaps not all are as sycophantic as the man of many imaginary careers makes it feel.

 

[Calvin]

I literally used to work in credit derivs, so I do have some understanding of this. The debt markets are always over leveraged and aren’t trading under a massively different concept to the stock markets.

Even take a basic CDS trade, if you trade that speculatively you are literally betting on whether a nation or company defaults - if you’re right you get the payout for the trade but you have bet on a country or a company to fail, that means people lose their entire livelihoods at minimum, all the while the big banks will be pressuring companies/governments where they will benefit from a default due to holding short positions against it.

How on Earth can a system where this is allowed be a net positive? And stocks are no different with short-selling et big problem is the debt-based money system

 

[Calvin]

I literally used to work in credit derivs, so I do have some understanding of this. The debt markets are always over leveraged and aren’t trading under a massively different concept to the stock markets.

Even take a basic CDS trade, if you trade that speculatively you are literally betting on whether a nation or company defaults - if you’re right you get the payout for the trade but you have bet on a country or a company to fail, that means people lose their entire livelihoods at minimum, all the while the big banks will be pressuring companies/governments where they will benefit from a default due to holding short positions against it.

How on Earth can a system where this is allowed be a net positive? And stocks are no different with short-selling etc

In my opinion the big problem is the debt-based money system. A system in which governments can print huge amounts of money, run massive deficits and then steal the peoples wealth through inflation. Which is something you'll never hear any mainstream politician discuss. That suggests to me that they are happy with the status quo which is why I don't trust any of them. As far as Capitalism goes, Adam Smith wrote 2 books "The Wealth of Nations" and "The Theory of Moral Sentiments". The Chicago School took their inspiration from "The Wealth of Nations" and disregarded the other book and pushed their version of Capitalism on the world.

 

[Calvin]

Firstly, there is no evidence that automation has led to a reduction in employment. Secondly, recessions are temporary. Demographics rather less so.

I don't think what is coming is going to be a "normal" recession. And personally i don't think its a good idea to have large amounts of immigration when we are going into a severe downturn. Like a "Lost Decade" type of scenario.

 

[Calvin]

Firstly, there is no evidence that automation has led to a reduction in employment. Secondly, recessions are temporary. Demographics rather less so.

Really? Look at the state of late-stage capitalism - due to rampant consumerism and giving too much power to corporations the environment is screwed, the wealth gap is larger than ever, and as you pointed out most countries are on the verge of bankruptcy.

At this point socialism is pretty much required, even more so with the advent of AI and robotics which are going to take absolute tonnes of both blue and white collar jobs. Universal basic income will be pretty much a requirement unless we just have a system where the majority of the population are literally on the breadline.

I was also of the opinion that AI, Robotics, Driverless vehicles etc would reduce the need for as many workers?

 

[Calvin]

Its been increasing exponentially in the last 50-60 years, facilitated by a lack of regulation and continued lurches to the right and beliefs that markets are self correcting due to (imagined) competition.

I'm open to your thoughts on what is admittedly an extremely broad and complex topic. I have no doubt there are many areas of it I don't understand.

Is this the moment for capitalism? All empires have historically eaten themselves through greed, corruption and short sightedness from those at the top.
Why should capitalism be any different?

We've seen those at the top extend their take from the world and reduce their contribution massively over the 50 years. This has allowed national debts to rise and seen public influence extended to issues that otherwise would seen global co-operation due to common sense and scientifc and economic consensus. All of this has been allowed thanks to free market and capatalist ideologies.

I’m a simple guy, I try not to get too caught up in the minutiae of every political system / ideology.
I believe in Private Property, I believe that a person should be able to own a home an abode that doesn’t belong to the State or any other institution. This also obviously links in with the “means of Production”, which I don’t believe should be limited to the State. Private Property is fundamental to individual freedom. It’s very difficult to be free when the state can take away your house, your job etc.
I admit that in the present, the markets are manipulated and controlled by an elite cabal. And to an extent you will never have totally free markets. You’ll always have interference from governments via tariffs, taxes etc and manipulation from large, powerful corporations, individuals, other nations etc. But I believe that markets are the best way to answer the supply/demand dynamic which occurs in nearly every aspect of our daily existence. I don’t believe any other economic/political system has adequately solved this issue.

 

[Rita_Poon]

"you can't buck the market" oh the bitterest of ironies.

 

[mightymoyes]

 

[Rita_Poon]

Please don't get my hopes up at this hour, I need the sleep of the damned.....

 

[Calvin]

"you can't buck the market" oh the bitterest of ironies.

Wasn’t it Gordon Brown who proclaimed “The End of Boom/Bust”?
He’s still got the nerve to make the odd tv appearance.