Current Affairs The "another stabbing in London" thread

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And Dan, there's a difference between accepting it would be better if the stats were reversed and calling the current situation a bloodbath.

I mean walking down Oxford Street isn't like the Somme.

You continue to cling to that single term which is subjective, and making jokes.

Anyway, another interesting article from yesterday;

Feral’ knife attacks where victims stabbed multiple times driving up London murder rate, police warn

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...ltiple-times-feral-police-mayor-a8419961.html

Metropolitan Police Assistant Commissioner Martin Hewitt said that stabbings are becoming increasingly violent in the capital. Speaking at the London Knife Crime Summit, he said: “The violence is getting greater. If I was stood here five years ago, I would probably be talking about knife offences where there was generally a single puncture wound.

"We are now routinely seeing multiple stabbings. That is one individual stabbing somebody multiple times.

"And increasingly seeing group offending as well. By that I don't mean there's a group and one person is stabbing, I mean there's a group of people who are all using weapons.

"Some of the CCTV footage that we see is shocking and quite frankly feral when you look at a group of individuals bearing down on another person.”

He was speaking days after a 15-year-old boy was beaten and stabbed by more than five assailants in three attacks that were launched seconds apart.

Over the last week alone, police in London have seized six guns, 135 knives and other weapons including CS spray.

”I have large numbers of officers now all over London who are routinely administering what you would call trauma medicine on the pavement and on the street in London to people who have been stabbed. And then the work obviously of paramedics and the doctors and everybody else that comes in.

“But the more violent the offences, the more chance there is that somebody is going to receive a fatal wound and I think that is part of why we have ended up where we are with the murder rate.”

He said reducing violent crime was a priority for the Metropolitan Police, which is using neighbourhood policing, patrols, diversion initiatives, stop and search and a dedicated Violent Crime Taskforce.

“The police response is part of the solution, but we have been clear that we cannot arrest our way out of this problem, and there needs to be a concerted effort from all agencies and communities to reduce the level of violence on our streets,” Mr Hewitt added.

Knife crime in England and Wales has rocketed by 22 per cent across in a year and robberies by a third.

Scotland Yard’s latest statistics show a 5 per cent rise in violence across London in the year to April, while knife crime is up 18 per cent, muggings up 30 per cent and youth homicide up a quarter in the same period.

The mayor’s office pointed to figures showing that the number of police officers in London had fallen to the lowest level in 20 years from 4.1 per 1,000 residents in 2010 to 3.3 officers per 1,000 today, putting the decline to “crippling government cuts to police spending”.

It said police spending per head has dropped faster in the Met than any other police force in England and Wales, due to rapid population growth combined with budget savings of £720m in the past eight years.

Sadiq Khan, who organised Wednesday’s summit, accused the government of worsening crime with police cuts, after increasing funding for Scotland Yard by £138m to recruit an additional 1,000 officers.

Home secretary Sajid Javid has vowed to prioritise police fundingin an upcoming government spending review but Mr Khan said the pledge came “too late”.

“The level of knife crime across our country, including London, is simply unacceptable. We’re doing everything we can, in City Hall, to tackle this scourge,” he added.

“The figures released today show the true scale of government cuts to police funding that have hit our city harder than anywhere else in the UK.”

The government’s first ever Serious Violence Strategy was heavily criticised for omitting findings from a leaked Home Office document suggesting that budget cuts had “likely contributed” to rising violence and “encouraged” offenders.

It named drivers including changes in the drugs trade, the rise of “county lines” gangs that brutally control supply into rural areas, and incitement on social media.

The use of British-born children for sex or as drug mules has made them the largest group of potential modern slaves in the UK.

“It is drawing younger and younger people into that world, so they are becoming exposed to criminality, they are becoming exposed to violence, they are being forced into actually taking part in the violence and all of that is desensitising them even further,” Mr Hewitt said.

Barnardo’s revealed that its services were dealing with increasing numbers of children at risk of criminal exploitation, seeing them present to almost 60 per cent of its services.

Of those, nearly three quarters thought the young person had been coerced, controlled, deceived or manipulated by others into criminal activity.

“Some of these young people are forced to carry weapons, carry and sell drugs, go missing and end up in other parts of the country, and are subjected to sexual exploitation and abuse,” the charity warned.
 
You continue to cling to that single term which is subjective, and making jokes.

Anyway, another interesting article from yesterday;

Feral’ knife attacks where victims stabbed multiple times driving up London murder rate, police warn

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...ltiple-times-feral-police-mayor-a8419961.html

Metropolitan Police Assistant Commissioner Martin Hewitt said that stabbings are becoming increasingly violent in the capital. Speaking at the London Knife Crime Summit, he said: “The violence is getting greater. If I was stood here five years ago, I would probably be talking about knife offences where there was generally a single puncture wound.

"We are now routinely seeing multiple stabbings. That is one individual stabbing somebody multiple times.

"And increasingly seeing group offending as well. By that I don't mean there's a group and one person is stabbing, I mean there's a group of people who are all using weapons.

"Some of the CCTV footage that we see is shocking and quite frankly feral when you look at a group of individuals bearing down on another person.”

He was speaking days after a 15-year-old boy was beaten and stabbed by more than five assailants in three attacks that were launched seconds apart.

Over the last week alone, police in London have seized six guns, 135 knives and other weapons including CS spray.

”I have large numbers of officers now all over London who are routinely administering what you would call trauma medicine on the pavement and on the street in London to people who have been stabbed. And then the work obviously of paramedics and the doctors and everybody else that comes in.

“But the more violent the offences, the more chance there is that somebody is going to receive a fatal wound and I think that is part of why we have ended up where we are with the murder rate.”

He said reducing violent crime was a priority for the Metropolitan Police, which is using neighbourhood policing, patrols, diversion initiatives, stop and search and a dedicated Violent Crime Taskforce.

“The police response is part of the solution, but we have been clear that we cannot arrest our way out of this problem, and there needs to be a concerted effort from all agencies and communities to reduce the level of violence on our streets,” Mr Hewitt added.

Knife crime in England and Wales has rocketed by 22 per cent across in a year and robberies by a third.

Scotland Yard’s latest statistics show a 5 per cent rise in violence across London in the year to April, while knife crime is up 18 per cent, muggings up 30 per cent and youth homicide up a quarter in the same period.

The mayor’s office pointed to figures showing that the number of police officers in London had fallen to the lowest level in 20 years from 4.1 per 1,000 residents in 2010 to 3.3 officers per 1,000 today, putting the decline to “crippling government cuts to police spending”.

It said police spending per head has dropped faster in the Met than any other police force in England and Wales, due to rapid population growth combined with budget savings of £720m in the past eight years.

Sadiq Khan, who organised Wednesday’s summit, accused the government of worsening crime with police cuts, after increasing funding for Scotland Yard by £138m to recruit an additional 1,000 officers.

Home secretary Sajid Javid has vowed to prioritise police fundingin an upcoming government spending review but Mr Khan said the pledge came “too late”.

“The level of knife crime across our country, including London, is simply unacceptable. We’re doing everything we can, in City Hall, to tackle this scourge,” he added.

“The figures released today show the true scale of government cuts to police funding that have hit our city harder than anywhere else in the UK.”

The government’s first ever Serious Violence Strategy was heavily criticised for omitting findings from a leaked Home Office document suggesting that budget cuts had “likely contributed” to rising violence and “encouraged” offenders.

It named drivers including changes in the drugs trade, the rise of “county lines” gangs that brutally control supply into rural areas, and incitement on social media.

The use of British-born children for sex or as drug mules has made them the largest group of potential modern slaves in the UK.

“It is drawing younger and younger people into that world, so they are becoming exposed to criminality, they are becoming exposed to violence, they are being forced into actually taking part in the violence and all of that is desensitising them even further,” Mr Hewitt said.

Barnardo’s revealed that its services were dealing with increasing numbers of children at risk of criminal exploitation, seeing them present to almost 60 per cent of its services.

Of those, nearly three quarters thought the young person had been coerced, controlled, deceived or manipulated by others into criminal activity.

“Some of these young people are forced to carry weapons, carry and sell drugs, go missing and end up in other parts of the country, and are subjected to sexual exploitation and abuse,” the charity warned.

As someone well versed in this area though, you must appreciate that headline stats aren't very useful.

Which parts of London? Which people are affected? What's the relationship between victim and assailant?

All more useful things to know than 'knife crime is up in a city of 9 million people'
 
The first step is acknowledging the issue;



Rather than laughing it off with " Lols ...", claiming its just daily mail hysteria or "I'm alright jack, its just the youths on youths isn't it?"

There's also a tendency to write it off as a inevitability of city life.

That, and there's a significant problem with Londoners being too proud to admit the problem.

Race is also too quickly brought into it, as a priority and it can steer the response - that can be unhelpful.

Scrutinise the facts (the gov/police can reclassify crimes...) and it's clear there's a significant issue - not just knife crime, all violent crime.

I said on this very forum many years back stop an search and penalties for carrying weapons is a contributing factor to knife crime - it really is.

I wasn't laughing off the issue, I was laughing at the sensationalist rhetoric that London is a 'bloodbath'. I've acknowledged there is an issue numerous times on this forum.

You're talking like you're very knowledgable on the subject (and you may be for all I know) but im not seeing any great insight here. It's just you making some vague statements about how we shouldn't blame certain things for it whilst then failing to provide a list of anything we should blame or look at other than 'stop and search being a contributing factor'.
 
Haha, you wot? I live in a part of London that has a bit of a bad reputation, and I've never felt unsafe in ten years here.

until you get robbed. Only a matter of time, areas of London are literally like the third world, they have levels of 'first world' deprivation you tend to only see in America. Tories have a lot to answer for.
 
Wasn't there some sort of revision of the violent stat's in the UK over the last couple of years because the government had reclassified them and had to then declare them properly? Just thinking this may be skewing the quoted rise...
 
As someone well versed in this area though, you must appreciate that headline stats aren't very useful.

Which parts of London? Which people are affected? What's the relationship between victim and assailant?

All more useful things to know than 'knife crime is up in a city of 9 million people'

I think the more coverage the better in this situation given the tendency from those in power trying to downplay the issue - politically.

I wasn't laughing off the issue, I was laughing at the sensationalist rhetoric that London is a 'bloodbath'. I've acknowledged there is an issue numerous times on this forum.

You're talking like you're very knowledgable on the subject (and you may be for all I know) but im not seeing any great insight here. It's just you making some vague statements about how we shouldn't blame certain things for it whilst then failing to provide a list of anything we should blame or look at other than 'stop and search being a contributing factor'.

There's no magic wand mate.

Happen to think the Metropolitan Police Assistant Commissioner Martin Hewitt in his speech yesterday summed it up pretty well in the article I linked;

He said reducing violent crime was a priority for the Metropolitan Police, which is using neighbourhood policing, patrols, diversion initiatives, stop and search and a dedicated Violent Crime Taskforce.

But they need significantly more money and resource, the police have been systematically hamstrung and it's no surprise it has coincided with the increase in violent crime. The media headline stats can help force the change, you only have to look at Sadiq Khan's changing narrative on violent crime from downplaying 'not on his watch' to now pointing fingers.
 
Wasn't there some sort of revision of the violent stat's in the UK over the last couple of years because the government had reclassified them and had to then declare them properly? Just thinking this may be skewing the quoted rise...

As I said earlier, "Scrutinise the facts (the gov/police can reclassify crimes...)" - it happens. The Tories are bad for it, changing the definition of child poverty was outrageous.

In this case, it actually went the other way - this is an interesting read: https://academic.oup.com/bjc/article/56/6/1203/2415172
 
Regardless of who's wright or wrong on here, I believe the parents, or most of them are to blame. Maybe blame is the wrong word, but they should bear some responsibility. Kids follow examples from an early age and if the parents couldn't care less there's a good chance the kids won't and so the cycle continues.
Also our laws and deterrents are laughable, I mean seriously. I work in the middle east, Dubai, Saudi and Qatar mostly, you dare not put a foot wrong.
But regardless of the tough sentences, kids are very respectful anyway, because their parents are very respectful.
 
Regardless of who's wright or wrong on here, I believe the parents, or most of them are to blame. Maybe blame is the wrong word, but they should bear some responsibility. Kids follow examples from an early age and if the parents couldn't care less there's a good chance the kids won't and so the cycle continues.
Also our laws and deterrents are laughable, I mean seriously. I work in the middle east, Dubai, Saudi and Qatar mostly, you dare not put a foot wrong.
But regardless of the tough sentences, kids are very respectful anyway, because their parents are very respectful.
I'd like to hear more on what you think about this, and what changes you would see made
 
This doesn't really mean anything at all, and is with zero context. If the sentance for stabbing someone was reduced, would it make it more likely you would stab someone tomorrow?
What a strange question. I would never take a knife to anyone, why, would you.
Do you think bringing back the death sentence would reduce Murder rates. I do.
 
What a strange question. I would never take a knife to anyone, why, would you.
Do you think bringing back the death sentence would reduce Murder rates. I do.
I don't think they would no, my point being so called strong deterrents are like a band aid on cancer, when the problems have much deeper social and economical roots, you've kind of hinted at that yourself in your first post.
 
I don't think they would no, my point being so called strong deterrents are like a band aid on cancer, when the problems have much deeper social and economical roots, you've kind of hinted at that yourself in your first post.
Yes that was my point, education, but for both parents and kids. It seems to be underprivileged groups/minority's where most of it happens, that can't be right and it needs addressing.
By the way, and I'll contradict myself, I do believe the death sentence would reduce murder, but I don't think it should be brought back, mostly because I think its barbaric.
 
Yes that was my point, education, but for both parents and kids. It seems to be underprivileged groups/minority's where most of it happens, that can't be right and it needs addressing.
By the way, and I'll contradict myself, I do believe the death sentence would reduce murder, but I don't think it should be brought back, mostly because I think its barbaric.
That's fair enough, I can't see it reducing murder rates being introduced into a system with an established social fabric, but I'm at the same end conclusion anyway
 
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