orchard
Player Valuation: £60m
With their Indonesia 'thing', I suspect so Bruce.
Current Affairs The " another shooting in America " thread
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Gunz
You should post more than just 'yes'. It's not very convincing.
I have plenty of family and friends in Oz and they have never mentioned any real ISIS issues in Australia. Not so much more than anywhere else if any significant issues.
In fact according to Australian statistics Muslims do not commit the most crime far from it. The Muslim nation in Australia are against ISIS and have spoken out about it several times.
And according to Australian media the lads trying to smuggle a bomb onto an Etihad airplane and the small number of disillusioned of teens who left for Syria to join isis is as about as much you will read about ISIS in the Australian media over the last couple of years.
Doesn't your country or adopted country boast one of the most restrictive visa programs for foreigners? They have enough TV shows boasting how tough they are on immigrants.
a) OK. Surely your family/friends are aware of the following:
1. Endeavour Hills stabbings (2014) - Numan Haider
2. Sydney hostage crisis (2014) - Man Monis
3. Parramatta shooting (2015)
4. Minto Stabbing (2016) - Ihsas Khan
5. Queanbeyan stabbing (April 2017) - Service station attendant stabbed to death by two teenage boys.
6. Brighton siege (June 2017) - Yacqub Khayre
Then there are the numerous plots which have been prevented.
( http://www.news.com.au/national/cri...d/news-story/86fc734df0963e21fe038c0eecce7d80 )
Where your family and friends live may indicate why they haven't heard so much. If you reside in Melbourne or Sydney then you'll only be to aware of the issue.
b) I'm not sure what Muslim crime stats have to do with ISIS. If the discussion is to be about crime rates amongst immigrant populations then we can discuss this further.
c) Thankfully some of those disillusioned teens won't be coming back. Those still alive are begging to come back though. Hopefully they aren't allowed back.
d) Australia does have a restrictive visa program in relation to coming here to work and study, marriage. Coming by humanitarian visa etc is a little different.
Isn't it good to make actual factual statements instead of saying simply yes or saying its happening without backup.
Now you were asked were isis a factor in Australian suburbs and responded yes but really are they?
Now to point out a few things. You made it seem that Australia has been terrorized a great deal by "ISIS" of late but the incidents you mentions span 3 years and only 2 of them are confirmed as being a) monitored by intelligence and b) actual;y known to be linked to ISIS. They being Monis and Khayre although the later was a criminal long before he was hooked and hated law enforcement because of this. Remember ISIS claim any attack if the perpetrator is muslim also be they in fact doing in the name of ISIS or not.
The others are all young lads who are religious fanatics with no affiliation to ISIS other than they heard their calling. They were all inspired attacks not actual ISIS members. No more than any other countries issues with young people being led by their strong beliefs or being brainwashed into something sinister.
All scum and all deserve to be punished by law or their maker.
I could list 8 maybe 9 countries with similar issues who don't consider being under siege by isis led fanatics. It's fear mongering simple as that.
Also when you mention ISIS you are clearly talking about Muslims or Muslim converts so of course stats of crime by and against muslim's comes into don't pretend it doesn't or isn't a factor.
Now don't be patronising the majority of Australians or people living there live on the east coast and don't live in isolation so my kin and friends are well aware of the news in any of the cities. Also i lived the for 5 years so don't pretend you are the only one with the insider information.
granted refugee visa are always different but its not easy to become a refugee in Australia have a read of this
https://www.aph.gov.au/About_Parlia...ry_Library/pubs/rp/rp1617/RefugeeResettlement
Also to insinuate that those are the highest offenders and those prosecuted for crimes is disingenuous see the stats from 2014 for prisons and crime
Monis entered Australia on business with a legit business visa by plane and decided to overstay
The Paramatta shooter is Australian having being naturalized at a young age his parents who committed no crimes were the partitioning refugees and he was brought in with them as a young child as part of the petition. But he spent 10 years growing up in Australia and became a citizen.
Australia takes in up to 12k refugees per year mainly from muslim countries. It used to get a lot by boat but as you know it stops the boats and turns them around or makes them dock on islands it controls and puts them in camps.
Now most are by plane. Most of the refugess who enter have not committed crimes. In fact the prison stats or 2014 indicate more Australians, Brits and Asians (China, Tawain, Vietnam) make up the bulk of the prisoners.
But again tell me how your suburbs are being terrorized
I understand ISIS claim responsibility for the attacks a lot of the time, however how many of these attacks would have occurred had the perpetrator had been influenced by the ISIS ideology. I don't think that by not having travelled to the war zone means someone is not an ISIS soldier.
The concern is not just with the occurrence of the attacks but the amount of sympathisers to the cause of ISIS, in addition to the public displays of insinuated violence/death/be-headings etc during protest. Now I'm not saying all persons who attend protests are ISIS sympathisers and wannabe soldiers etc. However I do think there needs to be some caution in relation to suggesting it's only a few young lads and religious fanatics. I don't think the people living under ISIS rule would have taken too much comfort with that in the lead up to their towns/cities being taken over.
As for Numan HAIDER. He was displaying the ISIS flag within local shopping centres in the lead up to his attack. He openly displayed photographs of him with the ISIS flag. Furthermore he had been a member of Al-Furqhan Islamic centre which was a radical islam school in suburban Melbourne. And this isn't the only radical school in Melbourne or Australia for that matter, in addition to some mosques teaching a radicalised version of Islam. By the same token, there are plenty of Mosques, Islam schools etc which are of no concern. But that is the very issue, it is the existence of the others , irrespective of how many which causes concern.
As for visas, I'm well aware of the process and it shouldn't be easy to get a visa, irrespective of whether your a refugee or a immigrant wanting to study, work.
I'm confused about the highest offender statement. I simply stated if you wished to discuss crime amongst the immigrant population we can. To then take the leap that I believe they have the highest amount of criminal offenders is incorrect. The actual question should relate to at what rate are people from immigrant populations committing criminal offences, and subsequently being charged and convicted and then compare this to non-immigrants.
I'm in no way against immigration. I think it is great, however I also believe we have to be accepting the right persons. And by this I don't mean white Europeans. I mean people whether they be Christain, Muslim, Buddhist, Jewish etc who are going to contribute to society and make Australia better. Australia over the last fifty years has taken in massive amounts of people under a how range of schemes from Asian, the Middle East, Africa, Europe be they refugees, working professionals, scholars etc. Some of the people who've come have done really well and contributed to a better Australia, however by the same token some have come and it hasn't been for the best. Now to ensure we are able to limit those who aren't here for the right reasons, benefit Australia how else do we achieve this other than been strict on immigration.
The concern is not just with the occurrence of the attacks but the amount of sympathisers to the cause of ISIS, in addition to the public displays of insinuated violence/death/be-headings etc during protest. Now I'm not saying all persons who attend protests are ISIS sympathisers and wannabe soldiers etc. However I do think there needs to be some caution in relation to suggesting it's only a few young lads and religious fanatics. I don't think the people living under ISIS rule would have taken too much comfort with that in the lead up to their towns/cities being taken over.
As for Numan HAIDER. He was displaying the ISIS flag within local shopping centres in the lead up to his attack. He openly displayed photographs of him with the ISIS flag. Furthermore he had been a member of Al-Furqhan Islamic centre which was a radical islam school in suburban Melbourne. And this isn't the only radical school in Melbourne or Australia for that matter, in addition to some mosques teaching a radicalised version of Islam. By the same token, there are plenty of Mosques, Islam schools etc which are of no concern. But that is the very issue, it is the existence of the others , irrespective of how many which causes concern.
As for visas, I'm well aware of the process and it shouldn't be easy to get a visa, irrespective of whether your a refugee or a immigrant wanting to study, work.
I'm confused about the highest offender statement. I simply stated if you wished to discuss crime amongst the immigrant population we can. To then take the leap that I believe they have the highest amount of criminal offenders is incorrect. The actual question should relate to at what rate are people from immigrant populations committing criminal offences, and subsequently being charged and convicted and then compare this to non-immigrants.
I'm in no way against immigration. I think it is great, however I also believe we have to be accepting the right persons. And by this I don't mean white Europeans. I mean people whether they be Christain, Muslim, Buddhist, Jewish etc who are going to contribute to society and make Australia better. Australia over the last fifty years has taken in massive amounts of people under a how range of schemes from Asian, the Middle East, Africa, Europe be they refugees, working professionals, scholars etc. Some of the people who've come have done really well and contributed to a better Australia, however by the same token some have come and it hasn't been for the best. Now to ensure we are able to limit those who aren't here for the right reasons, benefit Australia how else do we achieve this other than been strict on immigration.
The highest offenders as in criminals convicted in Australia are Australian. Pretty sure that was clear in my point. Its easily googled.
Anyway lets keep this on topic its about the US shootings
I was residing in Melbourne last year and at no point felt like it was an issue
dholliday
deconstructed rep
Has this one been on this thread yet? It's easy to lose track...
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-41880511
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A gunman opened fire at a church in Texas during Sunday services, resulting in multiple reported casualties.
The attack happened at the First Baptist Church in Sutherland Springs in Wilson County.
Local ABC affiliate KSAT 12 reported the gunman entered the church at around 11:30 local time and began shooting.
Police told the outlet there were "multiple victims" and the gunman had been killed in the aftermath. The number of casualties is not yet clear.
Photos and video from the scene showed the area taped off by local law enforcement.
A number of helicopters have arrived to transport the wounded, KSAT 12 reporter Max Massey said.
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http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-41880511
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A gunman opened fire at a church in Texas during Sunday services, resulting in multiple reported casualties.
The attack happened at the First Baptist Church in Sutherland Springs in Wilson County.
Local ABC affiliate KSAT 12 reported the gunman entered the church at around 11:30 local time and began shooting.
Police told the outlet there were "multiple victims" and the gunman had been killed in the aftermath. The number of casualties is not yet clear.
Photos and video from the scene showed the area taped off by local law enforcement.
A number of helicopters have arrived to transport the wounded, KSAT 12 reporter Max Massey said.
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The binman chronicles
Player Valuation: £80m
What the hell is wrong with the United States? Everyone needs to look into the mirror tomorrow and ask themselves is this the country they want to live in where your loved ones can be brutally gunned down even in a church. These mass shootings are happening with greater frequency, something isn't working.
artetas_biggest_fan
Player Valuation: £6m
Over 1.4 million have died by firearm there since Liverpool's own John Lennon was murdered in New York. There are more deaths by firearm by per day there (85) than in the UK in a year (average 50).
People know the dangers, you live there at your own peril. (Given the better weather, I probably still would).
My brother lives in Texas (San Antonio), he's very close to the latest massacre. I now have my parents trying to contact him just to make sure he's ok.
What a disgraceful backward place it is being run by backward right wing bible thumping hillbillies.
Tip my hat to the English. It was they who came up with the "right to bear arms" (1689 Bill of Rights), but recognised that the world was very different in 1920 when they passed gun control laws, and now have one of the lowest firearm death rates in the western world.
dholliday
deconstructed rep
My favourite article on the subject is still this one: the rate of gun deaths suggest a permanent civil war:
American gun use is out of control. Shouldn't the world intervene?
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