Talksport and Fake Everton fans

[Papa Shango]

My point was that these were squads a lot less taleen


My point was that all of these squads were a hell of a lot less talented but with the exception of 97-98 they all put a shift in and managed a similar or better points total to what we are seeing now with the most expensively assembled squad in our history.

To say BFS has the worst squad at his disposal (as the OP did) is utter nonsense!

Fair enough. Really does depend how you look at it though.

Our squad has talent in it but its very unbalanced.

 

[NeutralPie]

You guys SHOULD new had got rid of you old owner, he did a fantastic job at Orient, you guys should build a statue of him, he was AWESOME

Yeah maybe a statue with a noose round his neck. Then we can pull it down and have our Saddam Hussein moment.

 

[MrGrumpy]

Yeah maybe a statue with a noose round his neck. Then we can pull it down and have our Saddam Hussein moment.

No he should have a statue which say legend, should be made out of pure Gold.

 

[VentureBrosEFC]

His approach to football is actually very similar to Mourinho's, and they actually share a lot in common, they are undoubtedly both pragmatists, they are a little bit better than people give them credit for when it comes to getting the best out of top players, yeah they are defensive minded, both are a little brash, but both are quality when it comes to digging out results, and both get their fair share of criticism when it comes to performances. They are actually very good friends too.

The biggest difference really is the calibre of clubs they have managed. Mourinho took over Porto, won the CL, you have to give him amazing credit for that, but the draw in the knock out stages opened up for him massively that year, he played a poor Man United team in the first knock out game, and got through with a late winner, with Mourinho famously running down the touchline, then after some freak results in other games that year, it meant he got to play Deportivo La Coruna, Lyon & Monaco en route to winning. Fair enough he still had to beat those teams, and he did, but were it not for that run he might not be where he is today.

I'm not trying to diminish Mourinho's achievements here, but sometimes in football you need a bit of luck, and you need to be in the right place at the right time, and after Mourinho won the CL for Porto, he won the oil lottery with Chelsea, then took over a dominant Inter team which had some world class defenders, and guys like Sneijder and Eto'o, again he done great to win the CL again, then he got the Madrid job, and now has the Man United gig.

Allardyce has simply never had those opportunities, the biggest opportunity he has had before Everton was Newcastle, and they kicked him out after 19 games or something, so they hardly really gave him a chance. But he has performed miracles in his own way, just not at the same calibre of clubs. And has over-achieved almost everywhere (when given a bit of time).

And actually, all those clubs he managed found life after Big Sam very difficult. Most of them getting relegated within a year or two of him leaving (Blackburn, Newcastle, Bolton, Sunderland, Palace struggling this year). The only club that pushed on without him were West Ham, but even that only lasted a year, now they are back to struggling again.

So you may well already have a Mourinho calibre manager on your hands, this is the biggest club he has managed at, he just needs the opportunity, and with a pre-season under his belt and a bit of faith he could take you places.

I think we are guilty sometimes of overlooking what he has achieved, because he's English, because he is a bit shall we say overweight, because he is linked with struggling clubs and playing long ball (which is a lazy generalisation) we think "oh it is only big Sam", but he brings a wealth of experience with him and has over achieved almost everywhere he has gone.

He's probably destined for the exit door at the end of the season anyway, difficult for anyone to do their job properly with so much negativity, but in case he does stay I think try and support him, give the guy a break and you might be pleasantly surprised with what he can do next season.

Oh you are clearly a wum or have way too much time on your hands to be writing novellas about a manager who will never work for your club (lucky you). By your logic could you say Roberto Martinez is just like Pep but he just wasn't given enough of a budget to achieve what Pep has?

Ridiculous conclusions ...

 

[andydgg]

another vote for Sam Allardyce to see the 18 months contract. And I'm not a liverpool fan or non game goer.

 

[witchdoc187]

What you mean not everyone on the radio is genuine? Madness

 

[NeutralPie]

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but not to their own facts. To say Allardyce has a reputation as some sort of firefighter, with the ability to rise a club like a phoenix from the flames is utter rubbish. The only consistent reputation he has is the dislike from his teams fans.

Except you just made up your own facts. He was very well liked at Palace, Sunderland, Bolton. He wasn't so well liked at Newcastle, Blackburn & West Ham, but they all got ideas way above their station, two of them got relegated within a year of getting rid of him, and the other improved for one year, but have been struggling ever since.

One thing that is objectively true though, is he has left every single club he has managed in a better league position than when he joined.

 

[CRIMHEAD]

Except you just made up your own facts. He was very well liked at Palace, Sunderland, Bolton. He wasn't so well liked at Newcastle, Blackburn & West Ham, but they all got ideas way above their station, two of them got relegated within a year of getting rid of him, and the other improved for one year, but have been struggling ever since.

One thing that is objectively true though, is he has left every single club he has managed in a better league position than when he joined.

If you stupidly look at the fact that we are now 9th vs. 13th, sure. Then you see he was 2 points out of 9th when he started, had a much easier schedule, had no cup or european competitions, had much fewer injury problems, bought 50M worth of players in January...

...so actually, no HE hasn't left the club in a better league position. Compared to what the average manager should expect, he's been worse. With all those factors, a DECENT manager - let alone one being paid 6M a year - has us in 7th at least. Easily.

So, HE hasn't done jack. The other factors above is why we have 'gained' two points relative to the field in however many games he's been in charge. HE actually has done worse than expected.

 

[Barnfred 55]

This is our first season in the National League after our corrupt owner (who is wanted for embezzlement, fraud, and tax evasion charges in Albania) almost destroyed our club and took us from near the top of League One to the National League in 3 years. We've got him out now thankfully.

But there are some parallels actually between our season and your season. We were struggling as well, shipping load of cheap goals, and for a moment some of us feared the worst, that we'd get relegated AGAIN, which would be almost unthinkable, but we got Justin Edinburgh in as manager, and after some mixed results he seems to have steadied the ship and guided us to mid-table safety. Hopefully can push on next year.

A lot of Orient fans will thank Edinburgh for his work so far, but others might say "thank him for what? For finishing in our lowest league position in history". No pleasing some people sometimes. Personally, I think we'll push on next season, and hopefully get back in the football league, but no guarantees in anything. Be a bit harsh as well to sack Edinburgh and bring in Allardyce, but obviously if the job was vacant no Orient fan in their right mind would turn him down (not that it would ever happen).

You could have him next season for 50p as we'll be paying the rest of his £6m salary.

After that you're on your own. Look forward to lots of draws.

 

[NeutralPie]

If you stupidly look at the fact that we are now 9th vs. 13th, sure. Then you see he was 2 points out of 9th when he started, had a much easier schedule, had no cup or european competitions, had much fewer injury problems, bought 50M worth of players in January...

...so actually, no HE hasn't left the club in a better league position. Compared to what the average manager should expect, he's been worse. With all those factors, a DECENT manager - let alone one being paid 6M a year - has us in 7th at least. Easily.

So, HE hasn't done jack. The other factors above is why we have 'gained' two points relative to the field in however many games he's been in charge. HE actually has done worse than expected.

Depends if you include that West Ham game or not. You were 17th before that. His appointment, having a word with the players, telling Unsworth to move Rooney to play deep midfield, clearly gave everyone a boost, it gave everyone a lift. Their heads were down before that, no fluidity, no creativity and an absolutely shocking defence. That's all the makings of a disaster right there.

But even if we don't give him any credit at all for that West Ham win, he is still 6th in the league joint with Burnley on points since he joined. And ahead of Arsenal. And improved your defence. So where exactly did you expect to be after 4 and a half months?

The January transfers often take a bit of time to settle, but if I'd offered you the joint 6th most amount of points on the 29th November, you'd have snapped my hand off and you know it!

 

[MrGrumpy]

Depends if you include that West Ham game or not. You were 17th before that. His appointment, having a word with the players, telling Unsworth to move Rooney to play deep midfield, clearly gave everyone a boost, it gave everyone a lift. Their heads were down before that, no fluidity, no creativity and an absolutely shocking defence. That's all the makings of a disaster right there.

But even if we don't give him any credit at all for that West Ham win, he is still 6th in the league joint with Burnley on points since he joined. And ahead of Arsenal. And improved your defence. So where exactly did you expect to be after 4 and a half months?

The January transfers often take a bit of time to settle, but if I'd offered you the joint 6th most amount of points on the 29th November, you'd have snapped my hand off and you know it!

The whole top paragraph is a lie, Unsworth picked the team and spoke to the players, Sam had nothing to do with it and wasn’t our manager then

 

[banno]

I was for giving BFS a chance to prove himself. He steadied the boat initially without the football getting any better. January came and he bought a few decent players but he needed a few more to be able to change our style and be able to supply his new signings. January was his great chance to put his mark on this team but he never did. The football has got no better and now we are being outplayed by almost everyone. Defence is all over the place, the midfield has become non existent, supply line to Tosun is basically a hoof ball majority of the time. He has had enough time at the club to work with the players, add players to suss out the riff from the raff but he hasn't. I would have at least expected a slight progression in style over the months but that hasn't happened and I believe will now never happen. He is too old fashioned in his methods and is still looking at not to lose rather than how to win. We gave him a chance and he hasn't taken it, therefore, I want him out at the earliest opportunity. We should be looking at challenging and not consolidating and I don't think he has that in his locker. He is solely a survivest and not a challenger.

 

[NeutralPie]

The whole top paragraph is a lie, Unsworth picked the team and spoke to the players, Sam had nothing to do with it and wasn’t our manager then

I remember seeing him in the stands, that's for sure. And by all accounts he did speak to the players for 30 minutes, and to David Unsworth. And Unsworth I think had completely dropped Rooney before that game if my memory serves me right, or if he hadn't dropped him he wasn't playing him in that midfield role, so seems a bit of a coincidence Unsworth would suddenly pick Rooney in the same role that Allardyce played him in his one game in charge of England, and do that of his own accord the day Big Sam was appointed.

But we can nitpick and not give him any credit at all for that win, even without that win he still has the joint 6th most amount of points in the PL since the day he was appointed. Where did you expect to be?

 

[Lanolin]

Depends if you include that West Ham game or not. You were 17th before that. His appointment, having a word with the players, telling Unsworth to move Rooney to play deep midfield, clearly gave everyone a boost, it gave everyone a lift. Their heads were down before that, no fluidity, no creativity and an absolutely shocking defence. That's all the makings of a disaster right there.

But even if we don't give him any credit at all for that West Ham win, he is still 6th in the league joint with Burnley on points since he joined. And ahead of Arsenal. And improved your defence. So where exactly did you expect to be after 4 and a half months?

The January transfers often take a bit of time to settle, but if I'd offered you the joint 6th most amount of points on the 29th November, you'd have snapped my hand off and you know it!

Do you have such encyclopaedic knowledge of all clubs situations at different points of the season, or are you just a particularly big fan of Sam? I would think of myself as a pretty big football fan but I couldn't even tell you what month Watford or Leicester sacked their managers, and yet here you are knowing our fixture list, the tactical changes we made in non-televised games and what discussions were had between figures at the club. It's amazing you have time to support another club when you know so much about ours.

 

[NeutralPie]

Do you have such encyclopaedic knowledge of all clubs situations at different points of the season, or are you just a particularly big fan of Sam? I would think of myself as a pretty big football fan but I couldn't even tell you what month Watford or Leicester sacked their managers, and yet here you are knowing our fixture list, the tactical changes we made in non-televised games and what discussions were had between figures at the club. It's amazing you have time to support another club when you know so much about ours.

I watch a lot of Premier League football, and the West Ham game was on sky (or BT) can't remember which.