Roberto Martinez discussion

[TheHumbleEgg]

Howard is Daves get out of jail card this year, Distin took the brunt last year, but apparantly Howard has been at fault for every goal

Gonna be well used before the season end this is...

 

[davek]

11th.

That's ok for now. Where we end will be the determining factor in how we view PL performance. Let's see where we end up.

 

[Donald Twain]

to go off topic for a moment.

Is there a thread for tomorrows match yet?

Ish.

 

[Whistlin' Dixie]

That's ok for now. Where we end will be the determining factor in how we view PL performance. Let's see where we end up.

We had this under moyles. It was always: "We were only 'x' points off an 'x' placed finish; if only...."

Wasn't good enough then, still isn't now.

 

[Ihaters]

That's ok for now. Where we end will be the determining factor in how we view PL performance. Let's see where we end up.

That's where you and others here disagree. It wasn't good enough previously.. why is it now?

 

[willo30]

5th, 6th, 7th mean nothing in terms of expectations. Points is the only way to gauge it.

2 seasons ago we got 72 points. Moyes once got us 61 points, which was our best season? Some would say 72 points, some would say 4th place. Both are probably right but getting more points means you lost or drew less and won more. Other teams which we had no control over did better as well which is why we finished 5th.

My point is if we were to finish 5th, 6th, 7th on around 50 odd points then I would see that as a failure. If we were to finish 8th on 60 points then that would be my expectation fulfilled.

 

[Ihaters]

5th, 6th, 7th mean nothing in terms of expectations. Points is the only way to gauge it.

2 seasons ago we got 72 points. Moyes once got us 61 points, which was our best season? Some would say 72 points, some would say 4th place. Both are probably right but getting more points means you lost or drew less and won more. Other teams which we had no control over did better as well which is why we finished 5th.

My point is if we were to finish 5th, 6th, 7th on around 50 odd points then I would see that as a failure. If we were to finish 8th on 60 points then that would be my expectation fulfilled.

I'd rather win the league on 70 points than come second on 80, points are great, but ultimately league position shows how good you were in relation to those around you that season.

 

[steken1]

It matters where you finish, nothing else. Finishing 1st is winning and everything else is irrelevant.

All this five points off 5th etc, etc is embarSssing

 

[Little Ralphy]

5th, 6th, 7th mean nothing in terms of expectations. Points is the only way to gauge it.

2 seasons ago we got 72 points. Moyes once got us 61 points, which was our best season? Some would say 72 points, some would say 4th place. Both are probably right but getting more points means you lost or drew less and won more. Other teams which we had no control over did better as well which is why we finished 5th.

My point is if we were to finish 5th, 6th, 7th on around 50 odd points then I would see that as a failure. If we were to finish 8th on 60 points then that would be my expectation fulfilled.

I can see what you're saying but football isn't golf. If you get 3 points your opponent gets 0, and if you draw you each get 1. A really poor side can inflate everyone's points total, it's more likely if the league is a close one (more competitive) that the points totals are going to be lower as teams will beat each other or draw more games. It's all about league positions.

 

[Moomin]

It matters where you finish, nothing else. Finishing 1st is winning and everything else is irrelevant.

All this five points off 5th etc, etc is embarSssing

Imagine trying to brag about talking to some sexy lady about the weather.

It's just not right.

 

[nsno-chris]

It's 22 or 23, I believe.

Well, yes, tactics are a huge part.

However, tactics don't account for Howard diving in at the feet of players to give penalties away vs Swansea and Leicester.

They don't explain McCarthy and Lukaku both failing to track Rondon when that is the job they had been given by the manager.

They don't explain Stones missing that tackle on Ighalo in the first game of the season.

So no, it is quite obviously not 'all down to tactics', just as the good results we've had aren't.

Not quite tactics, yet we've conceded the most goals at home in all 5 top European divisions, but yeah tactics don't have anything to do with

What a crazy idea that was, eh oh

 

[willo30]

I'd rather win the league on 70 points than come second on 80, points are great, but ultimately league position shows how good you were in relation to those around you that season.

But that would never happen but see your point. To be honest I don't care how good or crap other teams are in the league I expect us to win around 60 points easily. Breaking it down would be 10 - 12 home wins, 5 or 6 away wins and around 15 draws. That would give us 60 - 70 points.

 

[BlueToff]

Dave's favourite defence is that Martinez is building a team of kids that have all these issues.. If that's the problem.. buy a grown up or two as well.

He brought in Cleverley who is an experienced premier league player. We have the likes of Jagielka and Barry and Howard should be able to utilise the experience they have.

 

[BlueToff]

Not quite tactics, yet we've conceded the most goals at home in all 5 top European divisions, but yeah tactics don't have anything to do with

What a crazy idea that was, eh oh

Read my post instead of jumping to conclusions/deciding to ignore my point.

Second line -

"tactics play a huge part"

 

[matty1878]

But that would never happen but see your point. To be honest I don't care how good or crap other teams are in the league I expect us to win around 60 points easily. Breaking it down would be 10 - 12 home wins, 5 or 6 away wins and around 15 draws. That would give us 60 - 70 points.

You think Wel Achieve this now still?