Current Affairs Reports of shots outside UK Parliament

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peteblue said:
Yes, but you didn't read my response. They can be as radicalised as they like, but if they are locked up until Isis or whoever surrender, then they are no harm to anyone. I'm not talking about putting someone away for a set term, but until 'their side' actually surrenders, and if they never do then they never get out, that's what happens in wars......
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Locking them up, or at least locking them up in the normal prison system and/or with other jihadis, doesn't work. All it does is give them loads of time to misread the Koran, learn Arabic badly, get really physically fit and spend a vast amount of time speaking to and developing links with people who are far more likely to be sociopathic and have criminal tendencies than one finds in modern society. IS was born in the US military prison system, don't forget. France's Islamist problem is also strongly linked to its prison system.

The only way (or at least only sane way) to beat the Takfiris is to demonstrate how wrong they are - not by boosting them by wall to wall coverage of shocking terror attacks, or by giving them the honour of sending the SAS after them, but by recognizing that they are fundamentally weak individuals who rage against the reality of human progress by carrying out these acts. If we want to bury them then we need to go down the route of more freedom, more technological progress, and in general make us and our society even better than we are now.
 
'BRIDGE OF TERROR'

Daily Mail must have used about 10 different headlines so far today, they get more ridiculous each time
 
tsubaki said:
Locking them up, or at least locking them up in the normal prison system and/or with other jihadis, doesn't work. All it does is give them loads of time to misread the Koran, learn Arabic badly, get really physically fit and spend a vast amount of time speaking to and developing links with people who are far more likely to be sociopathic and have criminal tendencies than one finds in modern society. IS was born in the US military prison system, don't forget. France's Islamist problem is also strongly linked to its prison system.

The only way (or at least only sane way) to beat the Takfiris is to demonstrate how wrong they are - not by boosting them by wall to wall coverage of shocking terror attacks, or by giving them the honour of sending the SAS after them, but by recognizing that they are fundamentally weak individuals who rage against the reality of human progress by carrying out these acts. If we want to bury them then we need to go down the route of more freedom, more technological progress, and in general make us and our society even better than we are now.
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I'm sorry mate, I always find your posts thought provoking, but these guys don't react like you or I. A liberal touchy-feely let's all be friends and explain the error of their ways will only ever result in their absolute belief that we are weak and can be overcome. When they believe or at least understand that that we will be far more resolute than they are then we can make progress. We had a PM who thought he could reason and discuss issues with the 3rd Reich, he was wrong, sometimes being harder than the opposition is what is required, and for that we need moral strength and courage......
 
So excluding the scumbag, another 4 people have died and 40 people injured. Meanwhile police are saying that it was 'Islamist related' and that 'The attacker’s identity was already known to counter-terrorism officials'......
 
It's perhaps worth noting that for all the shock and awe in the media, London appears to be going about its business as usual. Indeed, I live 30 minutes walk from Westminster Bridge, and apart from the solitary helicopter flying above the area, you would literally have had no idea anything was going on.

Of course, I don't wish to diminish the impact this act had on the people caught up in it, for them it is undoubtedly terrible, but I hope we don't go overboard with knee jerk responses that blow it out of proportion.
 
London got back to normal very quickly after 7/7 so it is no surprise it would seem to some like nothing happened yesterday and it is business as usual so to speak. Just so tragic for those caught up in it yesterday just because they were in the wrong place at the wrong time going about their everyday business.
 
peteblue said:
So excluding the scumbag, another 4 people have died and 40 people injured. Meanwhile police are saying that it was 'Islamist related' and that 'The attacker’s identity was already known to counter-terrorism officials...
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No doubt true and therein lies the problem, they have to cast a wide net, the POI may only get a cursory look as his threat level is low - then...aaaand, it's on to the next one.

Any expert who knows his onions knows that as the usual targets get hardened they move on to easier ones and there are always 'innovators' and then copy cats.
Nobody has easy access to planes any more, see the recent laptop ban, but most can get or have access to a car and a kitchen knife or such.
Your expert will admit that you can do little to stop the lone nutter and beefed up security will relax sooner or later...usually sooner.

So what is the answer - let them kill me with seeming regularity and Impunity...they want to be killed so shooting them in the act, while saving the cost of a trial and 25 yrs in prison is doing them a favour
Or do we just kill them with greater application... but such 'efficient' killing is frowned upon...all part of the problem, well 'my' problem.
Their method IS efficient ( for their definition of efficient, aka, 1 martyr Vs 'X' targets )

The 'liberals' will say that killing them with greater application makes Us worse than them and I know it will sound silly and trite but they started it, cue the yeah but if the west hadn't...fill in your 'whatever historic justification going back as far as you like'

But 2 wrongs never made a right...though the 'liberals' will argue that their side has a point though... how is it that 'my side' never has a point or just get over it the crusades were 800yrs ago
So just how 'wrong' are their current wrongs?...how 'right' are the rights of their case, how 'right' are their right to 'rights'
How 'wrong' are the historical wrongs
What's the scores on the doors for all the total of wrongness in the wrongs and rightness in the rights now and going back.Yeah it's got that stupid.

Make your mind up, you're avenging Historical wrongs or you're pushing a political religious agenda - you can't do both.
Historical? - get over it, grow up, move on, that was then etc, Yeah we did stuff, but that was then, the world was different, We were different.

Political - Religious agenda - just Koff, if we wanted it we would've voted for it, or converted to your view, we didn't, we haven't.

My view is...and while I don't like their agenda/ethos/way of life/ treatment of women and general human rights...if that's the law in wherever-i-stan fair enough, but take fair warning it isn't the way WE do things.

If we can we should take steps to stop this religiously dogma justifying, historical titfortat...in simple terms 2+2 = 5; where 5 = I'm right and you're either for it or dead.

But the apologists and the morally weak, head in the sand mob in power won't do much except continue to restrict my freedom in the mistaken view that will preserve it.
Then there's Oil.
Oh and I thought we'd learned the 'appeasement and half measures' aren't the answer - neither are reasoning and fine words...or 'danegeld' for that matter.
so what does that leave us?
do nothing and take our lumps?

musing turned into a bit of a mini rant and no doubt all the usual suspects will trumpet their offended dismay and have a go...knock yourselves out. But hey, you can post you outrage on Facebook or twitter and feel relevant, for all the good that will do.

Or come up with a solution...or at least admit the problem is not just on the shoulders of the victim, then convince the powers that be to do something, something effective,
what ever we're doing now isn't working
#puts on tin hat.
 
The crux of the matter is that it's impossible to stop people committing atrocities like this, no matter what their faith, when they have no fear of death and actually embrace it.

That is the most dangerous person(s) that any security force can ever face.

How do you stop someone who wants to die ?
 
Bruce Wayne said:
It's perhaps worth noting that for all the shock and awe in the media, London appears to be going about its business as usual. Indeed, I live 30 minutes walk from Westminster Bridge, and apart from the solitary helicopter flying above the area, you would literally have had no idea anything was going on.

Of course, I don't wish to diminish the impact this act had on the people caught up in it, for them it is undoubtedly terrible, but I hope we don't go overboard with knee jerk responses that blow it out of proportion.
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London always has always, as far as possible in adversity, carried on as normal. I worked down there frequently myself during the days of PIRA terrorism and people just got on with it. I don't think it will be a question of blowing things out of proportion when its hardly an everyday occurrence, but I think people are sensible enough to not overreact. Ken Livingstone has just been interviewed in his capacity as a former Mayor Of London and he said after 7/7 there wasn't one act of retribution against the Muslim Community nor a mosque daubed. That surprised me a little but hopefully its a fitting template for now when feelings are running high.
 
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