Current Affairs Rail strikes

[Bruce Wayne]

But we do know why, Bruce. Teachers, Nurses etc, were not needing food banks 5-10 years ago. Nobody working full-time was needing food banks 10-15 years ago. We know this. So we do therefore know why.

I saw this earlier. Could someone not colour blind tell me which line is which?

 

[catcherintherye]

I'm just saying that we don't know the circumstances behind those people turning to foodbank. As I mentioned earlier, right now my wife and I are broadly breaking even. If all of my work dried up then we would struggle on her salary. Her individual circumstances wouldn't have changed, but our collective circumstances definitely would (and I doubt even if the RCN got the entirety of the increase they're asking for that would cover the shortfall, so what then?)

As far as I can tell the surveys into food bank usage didn't tell us anything about the circumstances involved other than "they're nurses", which isn't very helpful. For instance, in our hypothetical example a better solution might be to offer income support for the self-employed when their work dries up, which is something I don't believe exists at the moment, or a UBI or something of that nature. For other people such an approach would not be that helpful at all, and cheaper fuel or mortgage relief might be more useful.

This also doesn't address the fundamental issue that most nurses leave the profession not due to their pay but due to stress and/or burnout. You could argue that higher pay will attract more staff, but more staff will equal higher targets so the problem doesn't really go away. The only long-term solution given the demographic transformation in the country is to do far more to reduce demand for healthcare by keeping people healthy rather than curing us when we're sick. Realistically I don't see such a transformation ever happening as the NHS is practically impossible to change.

I'll try to be a bit briefer.

1) I'm also breaking even too. I havent stopped knowing how to budget, and I doubt you have either, or anyone else.

2) I'm sure theres a layer of people who are not good at budgeting, but that remains broadly consistent over time. When you see 1000s% increase under a political party in charge, it just seems almost impossible people have just stopped being able to budget.

3) I'm in favour of making changes in the NHS. for the most part, they are the changes those who shout loudest want. But it's not an either or.

4) Public sector pay has gone down, over 10 years. The richest 1-5% wealth has gone up massively. We cant afford to keep funding it. We need to address that issue. It doesnt solve everything, but it helps.

5) I agree, we need long term change, but most of it is outside of NHS. We are an unhealthy nation, who eat bad food and dont exercise enough. It is increasingly expensive to play sport. The NHS is like the last in the line to get this consequence, like the final people in pass the parcel. Crucially though, that can be done alongside paying people fairly. I would probably argue a more egalitarian society would probably aid this process.

 

[Charro]

Would you be happy if all Tesco, Aldi, other supermarket and shop staff went on strike. What about all of the staff in corner shops, Pubs and takeaways went on strike. What about the lorry drivers, should they all go on strike. The jokingly named ‘Border Force’ haven’t been missed, the railways will soon find that robots will be driving trains and many activities automated. Many public service jobs are not needed but our craven governments do little to sort them out. It is only the NHS that truly delivers benefit but it too needs a complete revamp.

Just saying ‘we want 10% or 20%’ and striking helps no one, especially those who currently do the jobs. It’s time that all public sector jobs had contracts with a no strike clause. For those of us of a certain age, remember when the USA air traffic controllers (who did have a no strike clause) went on strike and Ronald Reagan simply sacked them all, replaced them with military and hired and trained a new workforce. No one wants to see that, but strikes are in themselves selfish acts that will only make for the need and development of automation.

So before decrying or insulting people like Bruce who are looking at this from a more social aspect, you may wish to consider ‘what will happen in the future as a result’…just ask Arthur Scargill…..

Oh but it’s ok for you to continually insult public sector workers?

 

[Daveysgingerlovechild]

Would you be happy if all Tesco, Aldi, other supermarket and shop staff went on strike. What about all of the staff in corner shops, Pubs and takeaways went on strike. What about the lorry drivers, should they all go on strike. The jokingly named ‘Border Force’ haven’t been missed, the railways will soon find that robots will be driving trains and many activities automated. Many public service jobs are not needed but our craven governments do little to sort them out. It is only the NHS that truly delivers benefit but it too needs a complete revamp.

Just saying ‘we want 10% or 20%’ and striking helps no one, especially those who currently do the jobs. It’s time that all public sector jobs had contracts with a no strike clause. For those of us of a certain age, remember when the USA air traffic controllers (who did have a no strike clause) went on strike and Ronald Reagan simply sacked them all, replaced them with military and hired and trained a new workforce. No one wants to see that, but strikes are in themselves selfish acts that will only make for the need and development of automation.

So before decrying or insulting people like Bruce who are looking at this from a more social aspect, you may wish to consider ‘what will happen in the future as a result’…just ask Arthur Scargill…..

I think pub landlords should go on strike because people aren't buying enough beer.

 

[roydo]

I saw this earlier. Could someone not colour blind tell me which line is which?

Private sector top.

Public sector and CPI kinda cross.


Nurses bottom.

 

[Nightman]

I think pub landlords should go on strike because people aren't buying enough beer.

Now that is a strike I'd be firmly against ?

 

[Cool_Blue]

The police are allowed to strike in other countries, and they seem to have less crime than us.

I dont understand your point though? Just because the police cant strike nobody else should be able to?

And no I wouldnt be happy. But that's pretty much what we have now anyway, because the government are useless.

You don’t understand my point? It was a simple question and you answered it. You wouldn’t be happy, but again, do you think they should be allowed to strike? Can you imagine the anarchy that would prevail?

The point being that some occupations are critically important to holding the fabric of society together, and I’m surprised more of them are not banned from striking by law. Now I personally don’t give a flying one if, for example, teachers go on strike (got no kids), or rail workers (never travel by train), but you could argue both of those occupations fall into the category I just mentioned. It causes huge disruption and inconvenience to society as a whole when they do strike.

And on a personal note, my fss pension was raised by 2.8% in the autum, and inflation is what, 11%?
What can I do about my rising costs? Sweet fa, that’s what.

 

[catcherintherye]

You don’t understand my point? It was a simple question and you answered it. You wouldn’t be happy, but again, do you think they should be allowed to strike? Can you imagine the anarchy that would prevail?

The point being that some occupations are critically important to holding the fabric of society together, and I’m surprised more of them are not banned from striking by law. Now I personally don’t give a flying one if, for example, teachers go on strike (got no kids), or rail workers (never travel by train), but you could argue both of those occupations fall into the category I just mentioned. It causes huge disruption and inconvenience to society as a whole when they do strike.

And on a personal note, my fss pension was raised by 2.8% in the autum, and inflation is what, 11%?
What can I do about my rising costs? Sweet fa, that’s what.

I didnt understand how it relates to public sector workers, that's all.

So what teachers are banned from striking, what's to stop the government not further eroding their pay? How do they protect themselves from threats of bullying of abuse in the workplace? Do you not think a bit more time and effort should go into resolving what is leading people to strike, than just denying people their basic rights?

And other country's police forces go on strike, and as far as I can see, they dont like under anarchy.

Re your pension, I dont know which one you are in. Most are inflation linked. The state pension has gone up with inflation. I'm not sure why it's acceptable for pensioners not to take a pay cut, but those people working to keep the country going ("critically important" as you described them) have to take a pay cut? I'm open to ideas as to why that makes sense.

 

[Diogenes the Cynic]

It's really not just about the nurses currently working.

It's currently a seller's market if you're a nurse and been for some time. I've previously employed quite a lot of people I would never have taken on if there was any competition because the emphasis has to be to get a team filled to maintain safe staffing.

If the salary is not enough to live on then the next generation of nurses will simply not be there. Who wants to complete years of training to take on an intense and sometimes brutal role that won't put food on the table? You put that together with less nurses coming in from overseas and it's a health disaster in the making.

If you want to be able to recruit, train and retain nurses then you have to be able to offer them an attractive package. Nursing assistants especially in the private sector earn less than people at Aldi. Most nursing assistants I was taking on in the end were psychology students who wanted part time mental health experience. Good people but you only expect to keep them 6-12mths and fast turnover doesn't help maintaining patient safety especially in mental health settings where its so important to know your team well.

 

[peteblue]

I think pub landlords should go on strike because people aren't buying enough beer.

I‘m on it….

 

[peteblue]

Oh but it’s ok for you to continually insult public sector workers?

Of course…

 

[peteblue]

Do you think the police should be allowed to strike? Because they cannot, by law.
So you come home and find a burglar inside your house and you call the police. Sorry mate we’re on strike today.
You'd be ok with that?

Russia plans to bomb the U.K. on the day the RAF have a one day walk out….trust me if the supermarkets and pubs and restaurants closed tomorrow the howls of protest on here would be deafening…..

 

[peteblue]

So you want to strip people of their fundamental right to withdraw labour?
Things could be terrible where they work, holiday rights cut, breaks taken away, pay not even close to keeping up with inflation etc etc etc, and you believe it is right that an employee has no right to withdraw labour in order to ensure fair working conditions?
That sounds like an open house to let an employer do as they please with no comeback. Really?

As for % pay rise request. It's a negotiation, employer goes low, employee goes high, meet somewhere in the middle and everyone is happy. Only the government have forgotten the art of negotiation.

If shop workers wage and conditions were so bad that they they felt the need to strike. Good on them. I can do without going to a shop for a day. No Biggie.

Not at all, people can always withdraw their labour, just don’t expect a job to be kept open for you when you’ve decided you now wish to go back. Try putting a Christmas pub staff rota in place …….

 

[Nightman]

Not at all, people can always withdraw their labour, just don’t expect a job to be kept open for you when you’ve decided you now wish to go back. Try putting a Christmas pub staff rota in place …….

Would you like to see the citizens who are striking sacked?

 

[peteblue]

Would you like to see the citizens who are striking sacked?

Depends. Any that are already overpaid, get shut, any that are underpaid and you really want to keep pay more…..