Current Affairs Race wars, neo-nazis and other unpleasantness
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That makes a long custodial sentence for stealing... sorry, looting £3.50 of water right then...
Give this a read DD
How the criminal justice system deals with a riot
5th August 2024 Thirteen years ago, I went along to the south London shopping centre expecting to report on a riot. But there was not a riot. And so in a splendid exercise of journalism, I filed a …davidallengreen.com
I'm OK thanks mate. Spent too many years of my life reading law/criminology as it is
Mate, it probably brought about less arrests because people just got absolutely leathered for a good few hours until they gave up.
Without the official riot act, back in ‘89 there was a disturbance at a rave in Paul St. in Liverpool: 300 rioters and about 50 cops in total.
There weren’t many arrests in total, but the Royal was very busy for a long time after it.
So yeah it feels harsh , context I suppose is key . If I walk into a shop and steal a bottle of water , the impact to the shop and the community is relatively minor . If a shop window is smashed in , I run into shop take part in looting whilst singing and dancing and passers by or shop owners cower in fear that feels different right ?
What I do know is that the hospitality industry in the city centre of Liverpool have seen a dramatic drop in earnings in the last week ; I know people at the weekend cowered in hid in fear as places were smashed up ; know people are actively frightened to come into the city so I’m guessing retail is down ; I know people of colour are terrified of what they saw and how they feel they’ll be treated by the mobs ; the chief Constable of the police said officers are having nightmares ; I know coppers were hospitalised ; I know investigation of other crimes have been paused whilst this has people placed on it’s enquiry ; various offices in the city closed early on Monday sending staff home because of the threat presumably effecting profits and productivity ; I know there has been a huge expenditure on clearing up and repair plus insurance claims that will effect the premiums of many that live in the areas plus the closure of small businesses ; Australia amongst other countries are warning their citizens about travel to the UK which could impact on tourism. I also know a load of families were effected by an horrific attack and specifically asked people not to respond in this way but these requests were ignored . So all in all if these matters are considered by the powers that be and the courts when it comes to sentencing it doesn’t feel wholly shocking to me that the sentences, which are within the guidelines, are at the very top end whereas someone damaging someone’s property a few years ago that no one saw wasn’t seen as quite so high profile .
The riot act/how it come about/how it's evolved over the years and even how it's used as saying today could make a paper.
Back when it was introduced, the riot act was read out at civil disorder and people had an hour to get off. If they didn't, it would be then they'd get it.
tsubaki
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Again though this is something that is consistent amongst sentences for things that happened during previous riots, it isn’t unique to this one or these communities.
I should say though that I think there is even there a difference between rioting over cops shooting someone and rioting in order to attack a social group who are completely unconnected to the trigger incident. Pogroms should be stamped down on even harder than riots, IMHO.
That’s not how the law works though. Context around crimes plays a large role in sentencing. Context such as the situation, circumstances and method of the crime play a large part. Even if the outcome of the crime is identical, all of this gets taken into account.
For example, you have two murders:
One murder, someone stabs the victim once in the chest as a result of a prior disagreement.
The other murder, a completely innocent person gets ambushed and beat to death for no reason other than their sexuality/gender/race.
Both end results are the same, both victims are dead, obviously. However, when sentencing the two, which one do you think will receive a harsher sentence?
Obviously that’s an extreme example but there’s an obvious difference between shoplifting something on a peaceful day from Tesco, and jumping into a smashed up Tesco during a riot and looting stuff.
Doesn't matter if they smashed it up personally or not, the fact that they were part of a riot and looting it during a riot would be considered an aggravating factor in sentencing.
Damo_1878
Don't care. Not bothered.
Precisely
Businesses and individuals are being widely effected. There's dispersal orders from the police in south Liverpool and a no fly zone for drones over most of Merseyside
The cost of policing tax payers are paying is high too
There are unseen wider impacts across the country and the whole point is this is not individual crimes its orchestrated and organised groups committing both individual crimes but also violent disorder and rioting
This is why there's a tough response
If it were up to me, I’d lock the lot of these gammons up and cut their cocks off.
So some of these sentences seem fairly lenient.
So some of these sentences seem fairly lenient.
Yeh, I talked myself (and my mate) out of it last night. I’d have a few Stella’s and it could end up all over the shop
Nobody is refuting the example you give.
They'll be ball park in terms of sentencing.
Crimes at riots, aren't.
I think the state go to far and push it too much. I think they do so not out of benefit/value to society, but for themselves.
Again - the examples from 2011;
- a twenty- three-year-old with no prior convictions sentenced to six monthsʼ imprisonment for stealing £3.50 worth of bottled water
- a twenty-two-year-old sentenced to sixteen months for stealing ice cream;
- a forty-eight-year-old sentenced to sixteen months for stealing doughnuts.
It's why they were given an hour back in the day to disperse.
Some people can be wrong place, wrong time. Get carried away/make a stupid decision like nicking some crocs. Personally I wouldn't jail them for 16 months.
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