Kenwright isn't failing enough...

[Nebbiolo]

No it isn't. A solution takes many parts, having one part of that solution is not the solution.

You can spend £11m on a striker like Luque and he does naff all for you, or you can spend £11 on a striker and he becomes a very good acqusition and gains you 5th place, which for our level is the best we can be.

Man U didn't get to their level by money alone, many parts were brought together in the major reinvention of the club that has now seen them become the most successful British Club in recent times. Youth investment, overseas marketing, staff investment, and spending prudishly to get to the next level.

Man U became successful in the early 90's due to two factors. One youth development and Eric Cantona. The latter costing just under a million, the former costing about the same in blood sweat and tears but reaped an absolute fortune.

Well seeing as I alluded to there being three factors that make it possible to do well, then I guess we do actually agree . Like I said, money, management and location are key to creating a team. Maybe my post should have been clearer.

 

[GhostOfDixie]

I hope you don`t think this rude of me but may I suggest that it is Moyes, and not Kenwright, that has got Everton to the brink of Champions league football. Not by spending millions but by sheer hard graft.
In an ideal world we would have millions to spend but even I realise that this is not the case. Therefore money has to be spent wisely and, with a few exceptions, Moyes has done this. As you so rightly pointed out.
I suspect that even now Kenwright is scrabbling around for cash to enable Moyes to achieve that which he wants in the transfer window.

Who signed Moyes? Who orchastrated his funds? Who brought in Earl to get money for Yakubu? Shall I go on?

 

[coyney]

I'm sorry Ghost, but money is indeed the solution. It's true that it is possible to unearth gems for little money. Our examples would be Arteta, Lescott and Cahill. But to continue a push into the Champions League then we need to be signing players with proven pedigree as well as these other types with potential. Look at the [Poor language removed], for example. It took one player at £23m to guarantee Champions League football. Look at Man Utd, it took the signing of a Portuguese wonder-kid at £13m to guarantee the premier league. Look at Chelsea, the team is awash with expensive flops and expensive hits. It gets them Champions League every year now. Money really is everything in this league. After money then we need good management of the club. After that we need the club to be located in a decent place. London is the best venue and attracts the majority of foreign players. But Manchester and Liverpool similarly are attractive cities to live in. Newcastle's problem has been that the city is [Poor language removed] and in a backwater. The club has also been managed terribly and the players that have signed have all been not good enough for the money paid.

Very sad but also true ,gone have the days when teams reared the youngsters through the ranks .no one is prepared to wait and teams with cash just go and buy for every Cahill ,Lescott that Davy turns in to class the Man us and Chelsea's just go out and buy the world class versions the Ronaldos and Drobnas its taken Dave 6 years to get us to the level we are at because of limited funding(I'm not blaming anyone if you have no cash you have none)But Chelsea and the rest would not wait more than a couple of seasons.

 

[GhostOfDixie]

Well seeing as I alluded to there being three factors that make it possible to do well, then I guess we do actually agree . Like I said, money, management and location are key to creating a team. Maybe my post should have been clearer.

Absolutely, I agree - I just feel you don't need £30 - £40million as much as you need a decent coach who knows how to get the best from his players. Newcastle are a prime example of that.

 

[Nebbiolo]

Absolutely, I agree - I just feel you don't need £30 - £40million as much as you need a decent coach who knows how to get the best from his players. Newcastle are a prime example of that.

But give Moyes £40m and a whole summer to spend it (i.e. some dithering time) and I think we'd be guaranteed fourth spot. So money would, effectively, be the final piece of the Moyes jigsaw. Unless, of course, it turns out that Moyes is one of those managers who's better with improving and managing distinctly average players rather than the best. Ferguson at Man Utd seems to be able to do either. My bet is that Moyes will also be capable of taking the next step up, should he remain with the club that has always backed him.

 

[GhostOfDixie]

hopefully.

 

[Duncan9]

Who signed Moyes? Who orchastrated his funds? Who brought in Earl to get money for Yakubu? Shall I go on?

Yes the queue was over a mile long, I believe, to take over at Everton Football Club.
I suspect you may mean who borrowed the funds ? Possibly against future revenue streams ?
"Who brought in Earl to get money for Yakubu". Does this mean that we now owe Earl money as well ?
We are obviously going to have to beg to differ on the adequacy/inadequacy of Kenwright.

 

[GhostOfDixie]

Yes the queue was over a mile long, I believe, to take over at Everton Football Club.
I suspect you may mean who borrowed the funds ? Possibly against future revenue streams ?
"Who brought in Earl to get money for Yakubu". Does this mean that we now owe Earl money as well ?
We are obviously going to have to beg to differ on the adequacy/inadequacy of Kenwright.

Well the way I see it is like this. One one side of the road we have those who hate Kenwright, think he is ruining this club. When in reality they are people who are just listening to others and saying yeah he's an idiot etc... bandwagon people who if sat down and thought about it would realise that he's actually done a good job.

Then on the other side of the road are the people who recognise that he has done a good job, these are those who decide - no I am not going to jump on the bandwagon, I am going to analyse and intepret. Instead of taking the easy way out.

Regardless of where you are standing, this club is in the best position it has been in since the 80's. Nobody can argue against that, so to say that Kenwright has done nothing but wrong for the club just makes no sense whatsoever,

 

[coyney]

Well the way I see it is like this. One one side of the road we have those who hate Kenwright, think he is ruining this club. When in reality they are people who are just listening to others and saying yeah he's an idiot etc... bandwagon people who if sat down and thought about it would realise that he's actually done a good job.

Then on the other side of the road are the people who recognise that he has done a good job, these are those who decide - no I am not going to jump on the bandwagon, I am going to analyse and intepret. Instead of taking the easy way out.

Regardless of where you are standing, this club is in the best position it has been in since the 80's. Nobody can argue against that, so to say that Kenwright has done nothing but wrong for the club just makes no sense whatsoever,

Ghost in my humble opinion as I never jump on bandwagons Im too lazyits some where between the two has he done good yes has he been bad also yes I agree its unfair expecting him to compete with billionaires its mainly his lying that annoys me ,I think a lot of it is Wyness puts him on the spot but he should just say nothing rather than mislead the fortress fund was cringe-worthy I'm made up the shyte are getting the same from the cowboys after all the stick I got in the pub a typical crack was a guy comes up and asked could he look under my seat so I move then he looks and smiles and says theres no fortress fund here Que all the reds to burst out laughing .to who would take over not a easy question to answer as proved by our mates its by no-means just a question of cash ,but I think Moyes has saved Bill a lot rougher ride.

 

[Nebbiolo]

I think Moyes has saved Bill a lot rougher ride.

I think it has, at least up until this point, been a mutually beneficial relationship. It looked touch and go for Moyes for quite lengthy periods of time. Bill came out and backed his manager and categorically stated that Moyes was staying. Not many chairmen would have shown such loyalty. I think Moyes should be grateful for this. Moyes has now repaid this trust and has produced what we now have. Hopefully it will continue for some seasons yet.

BTW, I'm not a Bill fan. I kind of like the guy and believe that he does try his best for the club. I just sometimes wonder whether he has a tendency to get carried away. I've also seen personalities like Bill in general life and not all of these people were as straightforward as they "pretended" to be.

 

[SweetHomeGoodison]

When Bill K took over Everton I was delighted, relieved, really made up, I idolised him. I didnt care we didnt spend much so long as we stayed in the prem. I began to have my doubts when the Kings Dock stadium fell through, I like many others were floored. I always suspected it was more his vanity and keeping control of the club which put the knock on it, as it has been widely spoken about since that Robert Earl was prepared to fund it ( all be it via a loan/mortgage )
Bill has since given the nod to KW to broil the books any way he chooses to get funds for transfers ( im not criticising that, all clubs do it ) but it has taken us to almost £60m of debt with another chunk to be added this season,
it is unsustainable. This has lead to him grabbing a get out of jail card with Kirkby ( IMO ) I think he bit off more than he could chew. I dont think he envisaged success and wasnt financially prepared. So I too am not slagging him off for not having 100s of spare millions, im slagging him off for wanting to move the club out of the city of Liverpool, to Kirkby and calling it taking us forward. I dont think it is, I think its taking us massively backwards.

 

[GhostOfDixie]

Oh my.

Can someone please stretch that [Poor language removed] boundary around Kirkby to stop people using it as an excuse.

Jesus Christ, I was in Liverpool city centre prior to the Anfield derby and I saw [Poor language removed] all Evertonians, just RS every where, city went a long time ago. What difference does it make if you play in Liverpool suburbs or Liverpool city centre? None.

Also, I would like some clarification on such debt, because I'm not 100% certain of those figures.

 

[ToxtethBlue]

Oh my.

Can someone please stretch that [Poor language removed] boundary around Kirkby to stop people using it as an excuse.

Jesus Christ, I was in Liverpool city centre prior to the Anfield derby and I saw [Poor language removed] all Evertonians, just RS every where, city went a long time ago. What difference does it make if you play in Liverpool suburbs or Liverpool city centre? None.

Also, I would like some clarification on such debt, because I'm not 100% certain of those figures.

Are you from Liverpool?

 

[Neiler]

Heres a thought maybe and just maybe both Moyes and Kenwright are doing a good job! Why do we always have to have someone to blame?

Incidently i precict both Moyes and Round will sign their contracts together, possiblly tomorow!

Incidently Daveys back at Finch tomorow after his hols!

I have to say im wityh Ghost on this one, money wont buy success, yes it is part of acheiving it but only part. I presonaly would be againt anything over 3-4 (at a push) big signings!

Relax its the 1st of July, weve had years of having to pick up workman like signings, now watch the quality come in!

 

[daz4matty]

When Bill K took over Everton I was delighted, relieved, really made up, I idolised him. I didnt care we didnt spend much so long as we stayed in the prem. I began to have my doubts when the Kings Dock stadium fell through, I like many others were floored. I always suspected it was more his vanity and keeping control of the club which put the knock on it, as it has been widely spoken about since that Robert Earl was prepared to fund it ( all be it via a loan/mortgage )
Bill has since given the nod to KW to broil the books any way he chooses to get funds for transfers ( im not criticising that, all clubs do it ) but it has taken us to almost £60m of debt with another chunk to be added this season,
it is unsustainable. This has lead to him grabbing a get out of jail card with Kirkby ( IMO ) I think he bit off more than he could chew. I dont think he envisaged success and wasnt financially prepared. So I too am not slagging him off for not having 100s of spare millions, im slagging him off for wanting to move the club out of the city of Liverpool, to Kirkby and calling it taking us forward. I dont think it is, I think its taking us massively backwards.

I think the way foreward is kirkby we need this move to progress.
I am not a kenwright fan but all the signs are moysie is going to stay and i believe in him.