Current Affairs Israel is an apartheid state

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WA Toffee said:
To be fair, your recent posts are the exact type I was parodying. The type that go - if you do not agree with me 100%, then you must support the exact opposite view. No nuance allowed. No context permitted. Just focus on polar opposites so I can attack you. It is the style of discussion I am commenting on, not the content.

As I said, it is a lazy style of conversation, and really serves just to shut down discussion rather than build it.

Oh, and just to be clear (yet again) - I do not in any way support or condone what Israel is doing in Palestine.
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Yeah mate, the reason why is it’s an emotional subject. I find watching a genocide incredibly emotionally rough, and I truly think that people who both sides a genocide, or support a genocide are inherently bad people.

I always hate it when debate perverts do the whole “you got emotional so you lost” bs. Yeah, I find the topic emotional and I don’t think I can reconcile with anyone who wants to both sides a genocide.
d34noj said:
So the terror attacks on October 7th were warranted.

I see.
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Case in point.
 
ChesterBlue said:
Yeah mate, the reason why is it’s an emotional subject. I find watching a genocide incredibly emotionally rough, and I truly think that people who both sides a genocide, or support a genocide are inherently bad people.

I always hate it when debate perverts do the whole “you got emotional so you lost” bs. Yeah, I find the topic emotional and I don’t think I can reconcile with anyone who wants to both sides a genocide.

Case in point.
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Jesus wept, dry your eyes.

Nobody is supporting a genocide you bloody idiot.
 
d34noj said:
Jesus wept, dry your eyes.

Nobody is supporting a genocide you bloody idiot.
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I’m sure they’re not, you just consistently do your best to undermine any posts pointing out that Israel is doing war crimes, while occasionally throwing a bone of ‘both sides are bad’.

As you consistently seem to veer towards supporting Israel, and consistently only argue against points which are anti Israel, I can only assume that you are indeed an Israel apologist.
 
ChesterBlue said:
I’m sure they’re not, you just consistently do your best to undermine any posts pointing out that Israel is doing war crimes, while occasionally throwing a bone of ‘both sides are bad’.

As you consistently seem to veer towards supporting Israel, and consistently only argue against points which are anti Israel, I can only assume that you are indeed an Israel apologist.
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Israel have been committing war crimes.

Hamas have been committing war crimes.

Hamas started this war on October 7th, a war they had no chance of winning.

Israel have been committing atrocities for years.

Even the UN '2 side' this conflict. BECAUSE THEY ARE BOTH COMMITTING WAR CRIMES.
 
d34noj said:
Israel have been committing war crimes.

Hamas have been committing war crimes.

Hamas started this war on October 7th, a war they had no chance of winning.

Israel have been committing atrocities for years.

Even the UN '2 side' this conflict. BECAUSE THEY ARE BOTH COMMITTING WAR CRIMES.
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NO ONE HAS DENIED OCTOBER 7TH THOUGH. No one has consistently tried to defend that atrocity. Difference is since then 44,000 Palestinians have been murdered by Israel deliberately, 70+% of which are women and children. Israeli snipers have deliberately sniped children, starved Palestinians, tortured and raped them in detainment centres, and has levelled Gaza and massive swathes of Lebanon. Let alone them deliberately targeting hospitals and providing no proof Hamas are hiding in them.

October 7th was blatantly an atrocity no one is arguing that, however you seem very comfortable with denying blatant atrocities being committed by Israel over, and over again.
 
d34noj said:
Mark Perlmutter? No mate.
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So we discuss the unreliability of main media sources, Al jazeera on one side and Western Legacy media on the other. We seemed to reach some sort of acknowledgement and now you source a speculative NY Times article that postulates, poorly, that Perlmutter is unreliable?

A bit inconsistent there, like most Israeli apologists.

You also ignored the second part of my comment about orchestrating the now verified famine.

Perlmutter also calls the war a land grab and yes, Israel are grabbing land. Causation or correlation can't be defined without evidence but the outcome is still induced famine and more land taken, both verified
 
WA Toffee said:
Let's be clear from the outset - I do not support what Israel is doing.

Let's also be clear though, we don't know the context of children being shot. Was it accidental? was it crossfire? was it even Hamas?

If it is soldiers just walking up shooting children (or any civilian), then they are guilty of war crimes and deserve everything they get. If it is a command from higher up, they are also guilty of war crimes and also deserve to be fully punished.

I think we both agree that what is happening is an absolute disgrace and unforgivable, we probably differ only on the nuance about what is intentional and what is haphazard.

To be clear, whether it is intentional or haphazard, it is wrong
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They are already verifiably guilty of war crimes, blocking aid/access to water among other things, but will not get everything they deserve. This is the problem.

Their job is to limit civilian casualties and they are making no effort to do so. The veil has been lifted and they know they can get away with this. We may differ on the intention, but without knowledge of the mens rea outside of linkage to past stated beliefs among the coalition partners that Palestinians aren't a real people and they wish to create a Greater Israel without Palestine and Jordan, there is a preponderance of evidence that Israeli actions point more toward it being genocide than anything simply haphazard
 
Toffeepot said:
So we discuss the unreliability of main media sources, Al jazeera on one side and Western Legacy media on the other. We seemed to reach some sort of acknowledgement and now you source a speculative NY Times article that postulates, poorly, that Perlmutter is unreliable?

A bit inconsistent there, like most Israeli apologists.

You also ignored the second part of my comment about orchestrating the now verified famine.

Perlmutter also calls the war a land grab and yes, Israel are grabbing land. Causation or correlation can't be defined without evidence but the outcome is still induced famine and more land taken, both verified
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This is what I've been saying all along - yet I'm an apologist🤔

As for the famine, of course they are - it's a tactic of war which has been used for years.

Oh, and it's not a NY Times article.
 
Toffeepot said:
They are already verifiably guilty of war crimes, blocking aid/access to water among other things, but will not get everything they deserve. This is the problem.

Their job is to limit civilian casualties and they are making no effort to do so. The veil has been lifted and they know they can get away with this. We may differ on the intention, but without knowledge of the mens rea outside of linkage to past stated beliefs among the coalition partners that Palestinians aren't a real people and they wish to create a Greater Israel without Palestine and Jordan, there is a preponderance of evidence that Israeli actions point more toward it being genocide than anything simply haphazard
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Don't they have one of the lowest civilian death in war rates ever? Just because you say it - it doesn't make it true.

This fella explains it better than me.
 
ChesterBlue said:
NO ONE HAS DENIED OCTOBER 7TH THOUGH. No one has consistently tried to defend that atrocity. Difference is since then 44,000 Palestinians have been murdered by Israel deliberately, 70+% of which are women and children. Israeli snipers have deliberately sniped children, starved Palestinians, tortured and raped them in detainment centres, and has levelled Gaza and massive swathes of Lebanon. Let alone them deliberately targeting hospitals and providing no proof Hamas are hiding in them.

October 7th was blatantly an atrocity no one is arguing that, however you seem very comfortable with denying blatant atrocities being committed by Israel over, and over again.
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There will never be peace til Israel elects a decent government that actually wants peace in the region.
 
ChesterBlue said:
Yeah mate, the reason why is it’s an emotional subject. I find watching a genocide incredibly emotionally rough, and I truly think that people who both sides a genocide, or support a genocide are inherently bad people.

I always hate it when debate perverts do the whole “you got emotional so you lost” bs. Yeah, I find the topic emotional and I don’t think I can reconcile with anyone who wants to both sides a genocide.

Case in point.
Click to expand...
You're obviously not reading what I'm writing, and your default appears to be attacking people and calling them names, so I'll just leave it there and not bother engaging with you any more. Have a great night 😘
 
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