Current Affairs Irish Border and Brexit

[peteblue]

You're just missing out a few hundred years of history mate. Google The Troubles and Brits in Ireland and you'll be fine. Think of it like the whites in South Africa or the South in the US and their treatments of Blacks.

Still a little bit of ignorance on the issue hasn't stopped @Joey66 or @peteblue albeit perhaps you're coming at it from a much more sinister perspective in which case you'll get on fine with old @Moomin

Be very careful about who you call ignorant of a subject......

 

[electricblue]

As an outsider (non-Brit) myself wondering, why do Northern Irish people feel so offended about the thought of having a hard border? If it offends them so much, why did they choose to join UK instead of being independent together with South? I mean if you think you are better of within UK, then it shouldn't upset you so much that there is a hard border with your Southern neighbour. Two different countries at the end of the day. And you are leaving the EU unlike Rep of Ireland, even more natural.

Just my two cents, maybe I am not aware some aspects of this issue.

There was no 'choosing' involved I'm afraid. It's a bit of a long story... about 800 years long in fact.

As for the hard border, no-one is offended - we just don't want the damn thing back again as it is divisive. The EU is about breaking down barriers between people, not putting them up.

 

[Moomin]

Be very careful about who you call ignorant of a subject......

Don't let the faux Irish get to you Pete.

 

[Deleted member 48881]

There was no 'choosing' involved I'm afraid. It's a bit of a long story... about 800 years long in fact.

As for the hard border, no-one is offended - we just don't want the damn thing back again as it is divisive. The EU is about breaking down barriers between people, not putting them up.

I am against all kinds of borders as well, mate. Especially when it comes to Ireland. Shouldn't back there. But it is very complicated now in this world. EU politics, agreements etc.

You know there is hard border between Croatia and Serbia, one is EU member the other is not, they speak almost the same language, have a shared history, though different ethnicity. Same goes to Greece & Turkey, both share a lot of history good and bad, hell Greece has tiny tiny islands, like 3-4 kms away from Turkey mainland, you can even swim there, and people have to get visa and pass the border control to go there. So, believe me, there are worse.

I really hope Irish and British people can solve this Brexit deadlock somehow, without the hard border.

 

[peteblue]

There was no 'choosing' involved I'm afraid. It's a bit of a long story... about 800 years long in fact.

As for the hard border, no-one is offended - we just don't want the damn thing back again as it is divisive. The EU should be about breaking down barriers between people, not putting them up.

Fixed for you.....

 

[Charlie Sweet]

Be very careful about who you call ignorant of a subject......

Mate you suggested the Irish should give the EU the finger and jump into an economic union with their good old friends from Empire days her majesty's England. That's ignorance in a nutshell (at least of one side of the debate).

 

[peteblue]

I am against all kinds of borders as well, mate. Especially when it comes to Ireland. Shouldn't back there. But it is very complicated now in this world. EU politics, agreements etc.

You know there is hard border between Croatia and Serbia, one is EU member the other is not, they speak almost the same language, have a shared history, though different ethnicity. Same goes to Greece & Turkey, both share a lot of history good and bad, hell Greece has tiny tiny islands, like 3-4 kms away from Turkey mainland, you can even swim there, and people have to get visa and pass the border control to go there. So, believe me, there are worse.

I really hope Irish and British people can solve this Brexit deadlock somehow, without the hard border.

The Irish and British people can solve this without a hard border.....The problem is when the Belgians, Germans, Luxemburgers etc etc try to get involved......

 

[peteblue]

Mate you suggested the Irish should give the EU the finger and jump into an economic union with their good old friends from Empire days her majesty's England. That's ignorance in a nutshell (at least of one side of the debate).

A point of view is a point of view, do not mistake it for ignorance......

 

[SteveSC]

I am against all kinds of borders as well, mate. Especially when it comes to Ireland. Shouldn't back there. But it is very complicated now in this world. EU politics, agreements etc.

You know there is hard border between Croatia and Serbia, one is EU member the other is not, they speak almost the same language, have a shared history, though different ethnicity. Same goes to Greece & Turkey, both share a lot of history good and bad, hell Greece has tiny tiny islands, like 3-4 kms away from Turkey mainland, you can even swim there, and people have to get visa and pass the border control to go there. So, believe me, there are worse.

I really hope Irish and British people can solve this Brexit deadlock somehow, without the hard border.

You realise the Croats hate the Serbs right?

There's been a long difficult history between the two since they broke from what was Yugoslavia. They have had disputes also about that land were the border is and the Croats once accused the Serbs of genocide.

They now have a council to try and maintain peace.

 

[Deleted member 48881]

You realise the Croats hate the Serbs right?

Some do, some not. I visited both Croatia and Serbia for short period of time, there were some hostile people towards their neighbour, and others who are pretty open minded. It depends. Government level, all seems forgotten, now they get along very well, minor problems about some border villages only, last month Serbian President was in Croatian capital, and they signed some good agreements. And the language is almost identical, few 10-15 words here and there sound different, rest of it, simply same language.

Still though, hard border stays there. And this off-topic anyway.

 

[SteveSC]

Some do, some not. I visited both Croatia and Serbia for short period of time, there were some hostile people towards their neighbour, and others who are pretty open minded. It depends. Government level, all seems forgotten, now they get along very well, minor problems about some border villages only, last month Serbian President was in Croatian capital, and they signed some good agreements.

Still though, hard border stays there. And this off-topic anyway.

Its not off topic if you are drawing parallels with other countries with hard borders.

Some countries have them for good reason like Croatia and Serbia.

But their plight and the reason they have them are different.

 

[Deleted member 48881]

The Irish and British people can solve this without a hard border.....The problem is when the Belgians, Germans, Luxemburgers etc etc try to get involved......

Then Ireland should follow the UK and exit the EU. This is what you fancy?

 

[peteblue]

Then Ireland should follow the UK and exit the EU. This is what you fancy?

If Ireland wish to remain within the Eu they should do so. However Ireland and the U.K. had a common travel area before the EU was even imagined, and will have one after the U.K. has left. We should not allow this political project to unduly disturb the border when there is no need apart from being a political negotiation chip..........

 

[ToffeeTim]

You're just missing out a few hundred years of history mate. Google The Troubles and Brits in Ireland and you'll be fine. Think of it like the whites in South Africa or the South in the US and their treatments of Blacks.

Still a little bit of ignorance on the issue hasn't stopped @Joey66 or @peteblue albeit perhaps you're coming at it from a much more sinister perspective in which case you'll get on fine with old @Moomin

Yeah it's not as clear cut as that mate. If the solution to irish affairs was that simple there wouldn't still be issues.

And the simple accusations we get that it's either completely the Brits fault or its completely the nationalists fault are both completely wrong. Complex is the word I'd use and I grew up here. Your analogies are clearly one sided but I digress.

 

[Joey66]

Nothing sinister about my post mate, I already said I am not an expert, not well-informed about this and also an outsider (not Brit nor Irish). I accept I seemed a bit simplistic, cause it just didn't make sense, two different countries, there won't be shared EU membership anymore, hard border is inevitable, I thought.

Now checking wikipedia about The Troubles, it is very comlicated stuff. Thanks for tip of the info, appreciated

Take no notice @Charlie Sweet is complicated as it's let's stop Brexit at any price - when a trade deal is done with the EU one hopes the Irish problem will be solved !