Current Affairs Free Speech

[Brett Angell Delight]

It was the first example I thought of as in the news today.

How abou a very common refrain - the 'gender pay gap' - 'women are paid less than men for the same job!'

No they aren't. That's literally illegal.

Or 'Britain is more racist now than the 70s/80s' - we objectively aren't.

Or 'trans women are women' - no they biologically aren't.

By your logic - where in your words there's no 'shades of grey' - I should blindly accept those things as true, solely because it's in pursuit of equality. If I don't, I'm a misogynist, racist, transphobe and so on.

No. The reason you thought I was 'prejudiced' was because of your own issue in not seeing that there very much is shades of grey in this debate, being that there's not one way to seek to equality. I think BLM does the opposite of seeking equality - it actually creates racial division. That doesn't make me prejudiced, because overall obviously there is racial disparity in the UK. It just means I see different ways of redressing it.

Gender pay gap - I don’t recall complaints of a pay gap for people performing the same role. A general gap exists though, largely because women - along with POC - are woefully underrepresented at exec level.

Racism - Whether it is more or less racists than any other given time period, it is still unacceptably racist at a systemic level. Just because it might not be as bad as the 19xx’s, doesn’t make it good.

Trans women are indeed women. Where does biology enter into gender identity? I understand the point you’re trying to make re reproductive organs but it’s invalid. In this day and age, anyone should be able to identify as whichever gender (if any) they feel best suits them. It’s an odd concept for me to get my head around, admittedly, but that’s very much my issue. And please - just on the off chance you were planning on it - spare me the “hilarious” Piers Morgan-esque “I IDENTIFY AS A CARROT THEN!” retort. Kids kill themselves in heartbreaking numbers over others’ refusal to see them as they see themselves. What they have in their kecks has nothing to do with it.

 

[Brett Angell Delight]

I think social media has a lot to answer for. There is no more reasoned debate, you’re either right or left, A or B... no middle ground and nobody willing to keep an open mind and listen to opinions that may differ from their own. The “cancel culture” you mention is vile and is the reason our society is so divided.

I don’t necessarily agree mate.

What do you put on your scone first, jam or cream? - Subject to a reasonable debate.

Political issues such as fiscal policy - Subject to a reasonable debate

The right of everybody to be treated equitably, irrespective of race, religion or gender is NOT a political or nuanced issue and is therefore not subject to debate. What you’re seeing on social media more and more is a refusal on behalf of those oppressed to continue to compromise or be silent altogether on the matter.

 

[Tubey]

Gender pay gap - I don’t recall complaints of a pay gap for people performing the same role. A general gap exists though, largely because women - along with POC - are woefully underrepresented at exec level.

Racism - Whether it is more or less racists than any other given time period, it is still unacceptably racist at a systemic level. Just because it might not be as bad as the 19xx’s, doesn’t make it good.

Trans women are indeed women. Where does biology enter into gender identity? I understand the point you’re trying to make re reproductive organs but it’s invalid. In this day and age, anyone should be able to identify as whichever gender (if any) they feel best suits them. It’s an odd concept for me to get my head around, admittedly, but that’s very much my issue. And please - just on the off chance you were planning on it - spare me the “hilarious” Piers Morgan-esque “I IDENTIFY AS A CARROT THEN!” retort. Kids kill themselves in heartbreaking numbers over others’ refusal to see them as they see themselves. What they have in their kecks has nothing to do with it.

Societally they identify as women. Genetically, they are not. So the zero sum sentence of "trans women are women" isn't accurate.

But I'm really not going into this again.

 

[wainy]

I don’t necessarily agree mate.

What do you put on your scone first, jam or cream? - Subject to a reasonable debate.

Political issues such as fiscal policy - Subject to a reasonable debate

The right of everybody to be treated equitably, irrespective of race, religion or gender is NOT a political or nuanced issue and is therefore not subject to debate. What you’re seeing on social media more and more is a refusal on behalf of those oppressed to continue to compromise or be silent altogether on the matter.

I don’t believe it is the oppressed refusing to be silent, it’s a toxic environment where you HAVE to be right, no matter what. I have friends who are so deep routed in this it’s a joke, for example if I was to agree with, or like, a Tory policy, that automatically makes me a Tory. It’s ridiculous.

I agree with you completely on the subject of equality, race etc that’s not up for debate. Take brexit as another example, you were either a Gammon or a Remoaner... no debate, just idiots shouting at each other.

 

[Brett Angell Delight]

I don’t believe it is the oppressed refusing to be silent, it’s a toxic environment where you HAVE to be right, no matter what. I have friends who are so deep routed in this it’s a joke, for example if I was to agree with, or like, a Tory policy, that automatically makes me a Tory. It’s ridiculous.

I agree with you completely on the subject of equality, race etc that’s not up for debate. Take brexit as another example, you were either a Gammon or a Remoaner... no debate, just idiots shouting at each other.

Unusually you’ll get no argument from me, there!

 

[wainy]

Unusually you’ll get no argument from me, there!

What’s happened to the GoT I know and love?!

 

[Prevenger17]

Societally they identify as women. Genetically, they are not. So the zero sum sentence of "trans women are women" isn't accurate.

But I'm really not going into this again.

Do you miss holidays Tubey?

 

[Tubey]

Do you miss holidays Tubey?

Nope not really.

 

[TheSecondComing]

For me, most woke people are just anti-bigot, and it is the bigot who objects to woke people the most. They don't like it when their hate is highlighted.

Not the case, I have seen the term facist used more and more recently for something that isn’t fascism and in the same breath they’re calling someone a facist they’re themselves are looking and sounding like one.

 

[Noisy noise annoys]

Not the case, I have seen the term facist used more and more recently for something that isn’t fascism and in the same breath they’re calling someone a facist they’re themselves are looking and sounding like one.

I have never heard "wokers" calling people fascists. The fact is, they out nob eds for their intolerance and bigotry and they cannot handle it.

 

[coollino]

In a whole world of baffling things.

Middle aged men and women telling (mainly) later teens what gender they are and how they should accept that still blows my mind.

 

[Tubey]

Jeez, I must be getting old...

I'm agreeing with Tubey's posts more and more in recent times...

What's happening to me???

You disagreed with me on one issue - the EU. You've assumed that because I was pro-EU my thoughts on everything else were predictable.

I'm not like that. I look at things on balance and come to a view as objectively as possible. I still think leaving the EU was mind-numbingly stupid, but at the same time I can readily accept the EU have made themselves look like everything Brexiteers said they were during this pandemic. I don't entrench myself in any given view and then defend it to the death.

 

[Old Blue 2]

You disagreed with me on one issue - the EU. You've assumed that because I was pro-EU my thoughts on everything else were predictable.

I'm not like that. I look at things on balance and come to a view as objectively as possible. I still think leaving the EU was mind-numbingly stupid, but at the same time I can readily accept the EU have made themselves look like everything Brexiteers said they were during this pandemic. I don't entrench myself in any given view and then defend it to the death.

It's a joke post, Tubey...

 

[Tubey]

It's a joke post, Tubey...

I know but was answering the underpinning point, as it's common. Everyone is expected to be in neat little political camps these days.

 

[Old Blue 2]

I know but was answering the underpinning point, as it's common. Everyone is expected to be in neat little political camps these days.

Agree totally with what is in bold above...