Current Affairs EU In or Out

[peteblue]

The worst thing about all of this is whatever deal we end up with is very unlikely to please anyone at the end of the day, especially when we agree to Free Movement in order to acquire it

There's no way we'll put a hard border up between Southern and Northern Ireland. It was a hugely important step in the peace process and ending Free Movement means we'd have to put one up as Ireland would be classed as the EU, at which point all the hard work of the past two decades would be destroyed in an instant

For that reason alone, we'll keep Free Movement and most of the people who voted Brexit for it to be abolished are going to be utterly furious, causing yet more division amongst the populace

A complete and utter mess

We had a border agreement before the EU existed and we will have one long after the Eu has gone....

 

[Thomasc]

We had a border agreement before the EU existed and we will have one long after the Eu has gone....

So we will completely ignore this part of that particular policy altogether, but just in Ireland?

 

[Mikey_Fitzgerald]

So when Esk categorically stated that the UK' s trading relationships had been 'blown apart', not will be, not maybe, not possibly, but had been, you can prove this then.........this should be interesting.....

They've been "blown apart" because they all now have to be renegotiated as a result of impending Brexit, meaning the previous relationships cease to exist once the new ones are agreed

You're essentially arguing semantics

 

[Pienaar's gloves]

We had a border agreement before the EU existed and we will have one long after the Eu has gone....

How do you propose that it would work, in a way that allows Irish people through and does not allow unskilled EU people?

 

[peteblue]

They've been "blown apart" because they all now have to be renegotiated as a result of impending Brexit, meaning the previous relationships cease to exist once the new ones are agreed

You're essentially arguing semantics

So are you saying that they 'have been blown apart' they 'may be blown apart, or they 'will be blown apart'. And you wanted examples of how we are talking ourselves down..........

 

[Mikey_Fitzgerald]

We had a border agreement before the EU existed and we will have one long after the Eu has gone....

No we won't mate

Northern Ireland will be Britain and Eire will be the EU

If we limit movement of people, then we have to have a border between the two, otherwise immigrants would just have to get to Ireland and then head North

Part of the Good Friday Agreement is that we would not have a hard border between North and Southern Ireland. If movement of people is limited, we'll have to put a hard border up, which will breach the agreement. There's opposition in both parts of Ireland merely for brief border checks, let alone full on border control that would have to be implemented if we rejected Free Movement of people

So either we agree to Free Movement or we have to put a border up, which breaches a near two decade peace and will essentially invite the Troubles to return

Why do you think Northern Ireland voted so strongly to remain? They knew this would be on the cards

 

[peteblue]

How do you propose that it would work, in a way that allows Irish people through and does not allow unskilled EU people?

I have no idea, but I'm sure the thousands of civil service people in the UK and Eire will work something out.....

 

[DualityNSNO]

So are you saying that they 'have been blown apart' they 'may be blown apart, or they 'will be blown apart'. And you wanted examples of how we are talking ourselves down..........

Blown apart, Pete, in the sense that they no longer exist in the same sense.

Are you actually winding people up by latching on to grammatical terms and so on instead of the things ACTUALLY written in front of you or is this how you actually think arguments go?

If the latter - are you Donald Trump?

 

[Pienaar's gloves]

I have no idea, but I'm sure the thousands of civil service people in the UK and Eire will work something out.....

You think they're going to invent new technology that allows people from one country to drive down a road, but not others?

 

[peteblue]

No we won't mate

Northern Ireland will be Britain and Eire will be the EU

If we limit movement of people, then we have to have a border between the two, otherwise immigrants would just have to get to Ireland and then head North

Part of the Good Friday Agreement is that we would not have a hard border between North and Southern Ireland. If movement of people is limited, we'll have to put a hard border up, which will breach the agreement. There's opposition in both parts of Ireland merely for brief border checks, let alone full on border control that would have to be implemented if we rejected Free Movement of people

So either we agree to Free Movement or we have to put a border up, which breaches a near two decade peace and will essentially invite the Troubles to return

Why do you think Northern Ireland voted so strongly to remain? They knew this would be on the cards

Was it mentioned before the vote ?

 

[Harryflashman]

How do you propose that it would work, in a way that allows Irish people through and does not allow unskilled EU people?

That's the thing we will surely encounter that won't we ? If we don't have a hard border it's simple enough to cross then you can travel internally from the north with relatively few issues just on photo ID. The political and logistical issues of then starting to check ID on travelers from the North arriving on the mainland are then massive . It's one of the many things that were obviously going to be a huge issue from the very start .

It's also something that clearly needs to be resolved , I genuinely don't know what the answer is.

 

[Harryflashman]

Was it mentioned before the vote ?

It was identified as a major issue before the vote for many people but I think mostly it was ignored .

I have no idea, but I'm sure the thousands of civil service people in the UK and Eire will work something out.....

Doesn't sound like much of a plan that ri be honest .

 

[peteblue]

Blown apart, Pete, in the sense that they no longer exist in the same sense.

Are you actually winding people up by latching on to grammatical terms and so on instead of the things ACTUALLY written in front of you or is this how you actually think arguments go?

If the latter - are you Donald Trump?

No, I just picked up on a reply that Esk made to another poster. It was not grammar or even semantics, it was the certainty that was implied, when as we all know nothing is certain......

 

[Mikey_Fitzgerald]

So are you saying that they 'have been blown apart' they 'may be blown apart, or they 'will be blown apart'. And you wanted examples of how we are talking ourselves down..........

Are you disputing that the old trade agreements will no longer exist if we create new ones?

You are arguing semantics because you don't like the wording, but what Esk said is factually correct

ALL of our previous agreements will no longer exist once Brexit happens and we will have ALL new ones that will replace them. They may end up being very similar, but that won't change the fact that they will be new

It's like if you sign a new contract at work for similar terms, the old contract is supplanted by the new one, thus the old one technically ceases to exist. Esk's language may be a bit strong for you, but at no point has he said anything that's factually incorrect

 

[peteblue]

It was identified as a major issue before the vote for many people but I think mostly it was ignored .

Doesn't sound like much of a plan that ri be honest .

I am sorry that I haven't got all of the answers to all of the issues that may or may not have become relevant this morning. The UK government, the EU commission and the individual EU governments will no doubt lend me some assistance and in the mean time I'll stop having a life and just try a bit harder......