Current Affairs EU In or Out

[Barnfred 55]

I do find it odd that those sections of the press opining that statutory bodies preparing for a no deal is Project Fear unnecessary knee jerking, while giving caution/threat to a lack of preparedness in dealing with civil disruption angry leave voters.

I think the press is just as divided as the British public is with Brexit. The other side highlight every single potential negative to a no deal Brexit (most of it posted in here by the likes of yourself and Bruce), while assuming that life would just return to pre referendum 2016 normality should Brexit be cancelled. I think it's fair to say that both sides are overplaying/underplaying to suit their agenda.

 

[NilSatisOptimum]

Good grief what damming report this is, failure of epic proportions the same scale of the division between West and East Germany and the task and effort is the same as reunification. This report reaches across so many threads. However, I firmly believe Brexit is just a symptom of what this report highlights.

Kerslake: UK’s regional inequalities require action on scale of German reunification

Commission chaired by former civil service head blasts government’s approach to economic development and calls for new £10bn-a-year fund

www.civilserviceworld.com

 

[Jebus_lives]

I think the press is just as divided as the British public is with Brexit. The other side highlight every single potential negative to a no deal Brexit (most of it posted in here by the likes of yourself and Bruce), while assuming that life would just return to pre referendum 2016 normality should Brexit be cancelled. I think it's fair to say that both sides are overplaying/underplaying to suit their agenda.

There is most definitely under/over playing on both sides, but I think that's the nature of political discussion. Where I take issue is with out and put lies and deliberate misinformation.

As far as normality pre Brexit - I sincerely hope it doesn't, there was massive change needed in the UK, particularly a policy of Austerity, which I have said on many occasions contributed hugely to the Brexit decision.

In my mind, many of the problems that people in the UK see as negative aren't as a direct consequence of our EU membership, but as a result of choices by government. The EU is a convenient scapegoat, and when people fall more deeply into poverty, because of the choices they have made/been driven into believing by government and the press, somebody else will have to be found to blame...

 

[Barnfred 55]

As far as normality pre Brexit - I sincerely hope it doesn't, there was massive change needed in the UK, particularly a policy of Austerity, which I have said on many occasions contributed hugely to the Brexit decision.

You know full well I was specifically referring to the divide in the country that was caused by the outcome of the referendum vote. Even in the best case scenario this will probably take years to heal. A cancellation of Brexit will inevitably deepen the divide and increase the determination of leave supporters. My personal view is that the country will become quite toxic. There is a potential for a big swing to far right wing politics, the racists (and I mean the proper ones) will all come out of the woodwork and regard it as open season, there will be a general anti EU feeling with European goods being boycotted, people not going to Europe on holidays etc. The Brexit MEPs will be trying to cause as much havoc as they can in Brussels. Relations between the EU and the UK will deteriorate.

The Remain supporting press are either in denial of this, which is bad enough, or they are purposely suppressing the likely aftermath of pulling out of Brexit altogether, which is absolutely criminal and every bit as bad as the Brexit media playing down or ignoring the likely effects of a no deal.

 

[Barnfred 55]

In my mind, many of the problems that people in the UK see as negative aren't as a direct consequence of our EU membership, but as a result of choices by government. The EU is a convenient scapegoat, and when people fall more deeply into poverty, because of the choices they have made/been driven into believing by government and the press, somebody else will have to be found to blame...

There you go again expressing your own views as that of people who voted Brexit.

 

[Jebus_lives]

There you go again expressing your own views as that of people who voted Brexit.

Are you as intense and highly strung in your normal life as you are on here?

I'm not expressing their veiws, I'm expressing mine. I think it was a massive contributory factor in why people voted to leave, as a challenge to the status quo and the established order.

I said in the past I think many people given the choice to vote for radical change or not challenging the status quo felt no need to maintain the status quo as it has given them nothing but misery...

If you don't think that's the case, fair enough, but I'm not claiming be talking on behalf of leave voters, I'm expressing my opinion.

 

[Jebus_lives]

You know full well I was specifically referring to the divide in the country that was caused by the outcome of the referendum vote. Even in the best case scenario this will probably take years to heal. A cancellation of Brexit will inevitably deepen the divide and increase the determination of leave supporters. My personal view is that the country will become quite toxic. There is a potential for a big swing to far right wing politics, the racists (and I mean the proper ones) will all come out of the woodwork and regard it as open season, there will be a general anti EU feeling with European goods being boycotted, people not going to Europe on holidays etc. The Brexit MEPs will be trying to cause as much havoc as they can in Brussels. Relations between the EU and the UK will deteriorate.

The Remain supporting press are either in denial of this, which is bad enough, or they are purposely suppressing the likely aftermath of pulling out of Brexit altogether, which is absolutely criminal and every bit as bad as the Brexit media playing down or ignoring the likely effects of a no deal.

In one post I'm supposed to interpret your meaning and in another when I apply my interpretation to the situation I'm told I shouldn't feign to be so bold...

Which is it?

 

[Tubey]

You know full well I was specifically referring to the divide in the country that was caused by the outcome of the referendum vote. Even in the best case scenario this will probably take years to heal. A cancellation of Brexit will inevitably deepen the divide and increase the determination of leave supporters. My personal view is that the country will become quite toxic. There is a potential for a big swing to far right wing politics, the racists (and I mean the proper ones) will all come out of the woodwork and regard it as open season, there will be a general anti EU feeling with European goods being boycotted, people not going to Europe on holidays etc. The Brexit MEPs will be trying to cause as much havoc as they can in Brussels. Relations between the EU and the UK will deteriorate.

The Remain supporting press are either in denial of this, which is bad enough, or they are purposely suppressing the likely aftermath of pulling out of Brexit altogether, which is absolutely criminal and every bit as bad as the Brexit media playing down or ignoring the likely effects of a no deal.

Nonsense - if a second referendum has remain win, when it has become abundantly clear what Brexit means, then that is democracy in action. If people want to riot or go right wing, fine, let them. And kettle the everloving crap out of them when they do for breaking law and order.

The problem with the initial referendum was that it wasn't defined. Lies were told, far more on the leave side than remain - that's an unavoidable fact. If anything, blindly following the first referendum - which by the way was completely non-binary - given its' now well known flaws and we're now three years away from it with zero progress; THAT'S a subversion of democracy, because absolutely nobody voted for the situation we're in now and absolutely nobody voted to leave with no deal.

 

[JimmyJeffers]

Are you as intense and highly strung in your normal life as you are on here?

I'm not expressing their veiws, I'm expressing mine. I think it was a massive contributory factor in why people voted to leave, as a challenge to the status quo and the established order.

I said in the past I think many people given the choice to vote for radical change or not challenging the status quo felt no need to maintain the status quo as it has given them nothing but misery...

If you don't think that's the case, fair enough, but I'm not claiming be talking on behalf of leave voters, I'm expressing my opinion.

It was mainly cos people got racist to be fair

 

[summerisle]

 

[Jebus_lives]

It was mainly cos people got racist to be fair

Yes, in some instances, but as I said in the racism thread, I think that bubbles away under the surface and largely stays dormant.

Mix that in with policy that makes people's lives miserable and you've got a formula for Brexit.

@Barnfred 55 just my opinion ok, wouldn't want to be considered being there voice of the voiceless silent minority here*

*The irony of this phase in hindsight.

 

[Barnfred 55]

Nonsense - if a second referendum has remain win, when it has become abundantly clear what Brexit means, then that is democracy in action. If people want to riot or go right wing, fine, let them. And kettle the everloving crap out of them when they do for breaking law and order.

The problem with the initial referendum was that it wasn't defined. Lies were told, far more on the leave side than remain - that's an unavoidable fact. If anything, blindly following the first referendum - which by the way was completely non-binary - given its' now well known flaws and we're now three years away from it with zero progress; THAT'S a subversion of democracy, because absolutely nobody voted for the situation we're in now and absolutely nobody voted to leave with no deal.

What do you think was nonsense about that post Tubey?.

All I did was give my opinion on what I believe would happen if Brexit was stopped. Do you think I'm wrong? Do you think that everybody who wanted to (and still want to) leave the EU will just accept the situation.?

And where did I mention rioting?

 

[Tubey]

What do you think was nonsense about that post Tubey?.

All I did was give my opinion on what I believe would happen if Brexit was stopped. Do you think I'm wrong? Do you think that everybody who wanted to (and still want to) leave the EU will just accept the situation.?

And where did I mention rioting?

This.

You know full well I was specifically referring to the divide in the country that was caused by the outcome of the referendum vote. Even in the best case scenario this will probably take years to heal. A cancellation of Brexit will inevitably deepen the divide and increase the determination of leave supporters. My personal view is that the country will become quite toxic. There is a potential for a big swing to far right wing politics, the racists (and I mean the proper ones) will all come out of the woodwork and regard it as open season, there will be a general anti EU feeling with European goods being boycotted, people not going to Europe on holidays etc. The Brexit MEPs will be trying to cause as much havoc as they can in Brussels. Relations between the EU and the UK will deteriorate.

The Remain supporting press are either in denial of this, which is bad enough, or they are purposely suppressing the likely aftermath of pulling out of Brexit altogether, which is absolutely criminal and every bit as bad as the Brexit media playing down or ignoring the likely effects of a no deal.

Did voting to leave result in the country becoming "toxic" because of the left?

Nope.

So why should I give the slightest toss if some middle aged wealthy white men and pensioners are upset about a democratic vote?

Furthermore, why on earth should I be worried about racists 'coming out of the woodwork'? Why should we be bending over in fear of people like that?

No, we had a vote, we were lied to, the consequences have come clear. If democracy prevails and a second vote happens and we remain, anyone stupid/extreme enough to 'come out the woodwork' should be slapped down, as we're a country of law and order.

This whole situation has come about because of Cameron being fearful of the hard right and kowtowing to them for selfish purposes. It's about time we stop being afraid of what cranks will do.

 

[roydo]

Do you think that everybody who wanted to (and still want to) leave the EU will just accept the situation.?

If they were told the truth about some of the bull they have been fed, I reckon most would. If they were actually happy to engage and not shout "You Lost, get over it." Which I sadly doubt.

You did it yourself last night, citing you wanted control of our borders. Some pointed out that we do have control of them. But Nigel blames the EU, and its lapped up.

 

[Barnfred 55]

Are you as intense and highly strung in your normal life as you are on here?

I'm not expressing their veiws, I'm expressing mine. I think it was a massive contributory factor in why people voted to leave, as a challenge to the status quo and the established order.

I said in the past I think many people given the choice to vote for radical change or not challenging the status quo felt no need to maintain the status quo as it has given them nothing but misery...

If you don't think that's the case, fair enough, but I'm not claiming be talking on behalf of leave voters, I'm expressing my opinion.

Not normally. You just wind me up easily.