Current Affairs Donald Trump POS: Judgement cometh and that right soon

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Only the wealthy deserve iPhones:

Rep. Jason Chaffetz (R-UT) appeared on CNN Tuesday morning to explain why obtaining health care is a matter of personal responsibility for millions of Americans, and not an area that requires government intervention.

In particular, Chaffetz said that, under the new GOP plan, poor Americans would be forced to make wise financial decisions if they really wanted to have access to health care.

“You know what, Americans have choices, and they’ve got to make a choice,” he said. “And so maybe, rather than getting that new iPhone that they just love and want to go spend hundreds of dollars on, maybe they should invest in their own health care.”
To be honest, I am in agreement with that. Money should go on essentials first rather than luxuries. No one needs an iPhone.

Probably not the best example for the guy to use, but I agree with the sentiment.
 
It's not though is it? The Dutch system is also insurance based, but isn't anywhere near as dysfunctional as the American system.

As with most things, I suspect the answer is incredibly complex. One thing I'm kinda sure of though is that chopping and changing with the frequency that they are in America is not a good thing.

I don't know anything about the Dutch system, but my guess would be more government regulation of the insurance industry in the Netherlands makes the difference.

Edit--quick check says yes. Actually seems we tried to copy the Dutch system with the ACA.
 
To be honest, I am in agreement with that. Money should go on essentials first rather than luxuries. No one needs an iPhone.

Probably not the best example for the guy to use, but I agree with the sentiment.
See I believe health care is a right, just like education. Would you be fine if he said you should give up your iPhone and save to put your kids through private education because we're shutting all the public schools.
We pay enough in taxes that we should be able to afford a basic public health care system.
 
See I believe health care is a right, just like education. Would you be fine if he said you should give up your iPhone and save to put your kids through private education because we're shutting all the public schools.
We pay enough in taxes that we should be able to afford a basic public health care system.

Isn't Medicaid that?
 
Isn't Medicaid that?

Medicaid is extremely selective in many states in particular those that didn't expand the program under the ACA (ie most red states).

Example
Medicaid requirements:
In order to qualify for this benefit program, you must be a resident of the state of North Carolina, a U.S. national, citizen, permanent resident, or legal alien, in need of health care/insurance assistance, whose financial situation would be characterized as low income or very low income. You must also be either pregnant, blind, have a disability or a family member in your household with a disability, be responsible for children under 19 years of age, or be 65 years of age or older.
In order to qualify, you must have an annual household income (before taxes) that is below the following amounts:

Household Size* Maximum Income Level (Per Year)
1 $15,800 *this is 40 hours at minimum wage
2 $21,307
3 $26,813
4 $32,319
5 $37,825
6 $43,331
7 $48,851
8 $54,384
 
Yea, but that's for the very poor.
Again, the health/education analogy. it's like saying your kid can only go to public school if you have no income.

Medicaid is extremely selective in many states in particular those that didn't expand the program under the ACA (ie most red states).

Example
Medicaid requirements:
In order to qualify for this benefit program, you must be a resident of the state of North Carolina, a U.S. national, citizen, permanent resident, or legal alien, in need of health care/insurance assistance, whose financial situation would be characterized as low income or very low income. You must also be either pregnant, blind, have a disability or a family member in your household with a disability, be responsible for children under 19 years of age, or be 65 years of age or older.
In order to qualify, you must have an annual household income (before taxes) that is below the following amounts:

Household Size* Maximum Income Level (Per Year)
1 $15,800 *this is 40 hours at minimum wage
2 $21,307
3 $26,813
4 $32,319
5 $37,825
6 $43,331
7 $48,851
8 $54,384

Fair enough, it wasn't a leading question. I've seen that the budget for Medicaid is equivalent to our spending on the NHS but had no idea just who qualified for that and who didn't.
 
To be honest, I am in agreement with that. Money should go on essentials first rather than luxuries. No one needs an iPhone.

Probably not the best example for the guy to use, but I agree with the sentiment.
For most of the poor the only way they can get online, short of going to the public library with limited hours, is a smartphone, it is certainly far cheaper than buying a pc and home access. Since the internet provides a while range of information that is not only important in searching/applying for jobs or benefits as well as kids education think it is far more an essential than many suppose. It also means they can save money by ditching an expensive and comparatively useless landline.
 
Medicaid is extremely selective in many states in particular those that didn't expand the program under the ACA (ie most red states).

Example
Medicaid requirements:
In order to qualify for this benefit program, you must be a resident of the state of North Carolina, a U.S. national, citizen, permanent resident, or legal alien, in need of health care/insurance assistance, whose financial situation would be characterized as low income or very low income. You must also be either pregnant, blind, have a disability or a family member in your household with a disability, be responsible for children under 19 years of age, or be 65 years of age or older.
In order to qualify, you must have an annual household income (before taxes) that is below the following amounts:

Household Size* Maximum Income Level (Per Year)
1 $15,800 *this is 40 hours at minimum wage
2 $21,307
3 $26,813
4 $32,319
5 $37,825
6 $43,331
7 $48,851
8 $54,384

single working age people with no disabilities just die then??
 
I don't know anything about the Dutch system, but my guess would be more government regulation of the insurance industry in the Netherlands makes the difference.

Edit--quick check says yes. Actually seems we tried to copy the Dutch system with the ACA.

I'd imagine their consumers have much better information, too. Here you have no idea how much your specialist treatment or a hospital stay might cost you until you get the bill. There's also a lot of room for... not exactly corruption, but unannounced and unnecessary service. For months after our son was born we were getting bills from this doctor and that doctor who we didn't even remember.
 
single working age people with no disabilities just die then??
No, they pay a fortune for private insurance,
Edit. If they can't afford that and can't get on medicaid, they just turn up at the ER when they are really sick. The hospitals won't turn them away but they will bill them, They then can't afford the bills and their credit rating gets screwed. Eventually their debt gets sold to collections agencies.
The idea of Obamacare is to subsidize the cost of private healthcare so people like this dont get screwed but it's tricky in states that don't participate fully. The republican solution would make it even more difficult for people like this to participate in the private healthcare system,
 
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Isn't it blindingly obvious that there is zero compassion in this administration and the x*%^ that heads it - POTUS - is only interested in destroying anything that he - and his cronies - can't make anything out of in favour of something they can? Basically the US has a Robber Baron in the White House.
 
single working age people with no disabilities just die then??


or become bankrupt so then they qualify for Medicaid.

I have a patient with type 1 diabetes. On medicaid as a kid and diabetes was well controlled. Aged out of medicaid and really hasn't had insurance since. Before ACA he couldn't get insurance because he had a preexisting condition. He briefly had insurance via the ACA but lost it because he couldn't keep paying the premiums and pay for meds, doctors visits, food, housing etc. If NC had expanded Medicaid under the ACA , he would be eligible. He tries to work two jobs, but struggles due to his health.

His diabetes has been poorly controlled for nearly 10 years and he's now lost top third of his foot.

He is late 20s early 30s and will end up disabled and unable to work by age 40 if not sooner if nothing changes.

This is why the cost of universal health insurance makes sense...at least to me. We end up using taxes to care for folks one way or another. Why not do it up front so folks like him stay healthy and continue to work and contribute taxes.

/end rant
 
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